Fr. Z and Michael Voris offer "Year of Faith Retreat at Sea" Caribbean cruise this coming Lent


#1

churchmilitant.tv/retreatatsea/flier.pdf

I find this…strange…not very conducive to the penitential nature of Lent.


#2

[quote="anp1215, post:1, topic:308585"]
churchmilitant.tv/retreatatsea/flier.pdf

I find this...strange...not very conducive to the penitential nature of Lent.

[/quote]

A Lenten cruise? Seems a little strange. It would be like Catholic day at Six Flags falling on Good Friday. I guess there is nothing wrong with it, depending on the person, but I couldn't do it.


#3

A “Lenten retreat” on a luxury cruise ship sailing around exotic Caribbean ports? Sounds like the exact sort of thing that Mr. Voris and Fr. Z would mock and criticize - unless they themselves were profiting from it.


#4

Cruise/conference combos seem to be the latest fad. If I’m not mistaken, Catholic Answers has done that sort of thing before. Lent does seem an odd time of the year for such a thing, but perhaps they were limited in their choice of times. Perhaps that time of year is much more cost-effective than the summer time. :shrug:


#5

[quote="anp1215, post:1, topic:308585"]
churchmilitant.tv/retreatatsea/flier.pdf

I find this...strange...not very conducive to the penitential nature of Lent.

[/quote]

My friend, I'm sure you're not the only one.

This sounds uncomfortably close to the sort of antics that have given television evangelists such a bad name.

Maybe I'm just old-fashioned, and maybe I'm not up-to-date on these things, but somehow phrases like "dance clubs", "personal enrichment classes", and "5-star luxury cruise" do not sound Lenten at all to me. What could possibly be Lenten about luxury, ostentatious displays of wealth, and the "pleasures of the world"? :( :shrug:

Having the Sacrament of Reconciliation, Masses, and a retreat on board sounds nice on paper, but do they really belong side-by-side with the things mentioned above?

"Know you not that the friendship of this world is the enemy of God?" (St. James 4:4)


#6

[quote="Joe_5859, post:4, topic:308585"]
Cruise/conference combos seem to be the latest fad. If I'm not mistaken, Catholic Answers has done that sort of thing before. Lent does seem an odd time of the year for such a thing, but perhaps they were limited in their choice of times. Perhaps that time of year is much more cost-effective than the summer time. :shrug:

[/quote]

That's what I would guess.


#7

Several Catholic bloggers have written sharing similar sentiments. I don't know if I'm allowed to link to any of them here, but if you google "Fr. Z and Michael Voris cruise" you will see some good blog entries that do a good job of explaining how I feel.

This is just...really weird.


#8

I've already registered to go and I look forward to it. It's a great opportunity for traditionally-minded Catholics to get together. I am guessing that the timing has everything to do with the availability and booking the cruise itself with the cruise liner. FYI Saint Michael's media itself is only charging $100 for the entire week of conferences, daily mass etc. That is not exorbitant by any means and I do not believe anyone is "lining their pockets". I understand the objection as stated, but I'm not convinced that is indeed the real objection.


#9

[quote="missadeangelis, post:8, topic:308585"]
I've already registered to go and I look forward to it. It's a great opportunity for traditionally-minded Catholics to get together. I am guessing that the timing has everything to do with the availability and booking the cruise itself with the cruise liner. FYI Saint Michael's media itself is only charging $100 for the entire week of conferences, daily mass etc. That is not exorbitant by any means and I do not believe anyone is "lining their pockets". I understand the objection as stated, but I'm not convinced that is indeed the real objection.

[/quote]

I'm sure that $100 isn't going towards paying to go to daily Mass or Confession.


#10

[quote="Deo_Gratias42, post:9, topic:308585"]
I'm sure that $100 isn't going towards paying to go to daily Mass or Confession.

[/quote]

But it may be going toward keeping the ministry's doors open.


#11

Like some else posted, it's only OK because Fr Z and Michael Voris are running it.

If it were another Catholic, they'd be roundly criticized for hosting a cruise with cocktail reception and entertainment during Lent.

Jim


#12

[quote="JimR-OCDS, post:11, topic:308585"]
Like some else posted, it's only OK because Fr Z and Michael Voris are running it.

If it were another Catholic, they'd be roundly criticized for hosting a cruise with cocktail reception and entertainment during Lent.

Jim

[/quote]

I think you are right.


#13

[quote="JimR-OCDS, post:11, topic:308585"]
If it were another Catholic, they'd be roundly criticized for hosting a cruise with cocktail reception and entertainment during Lent.

[/quote]

Ya, because as we all know Michael Voris hasn't taken any flak for this.


#14

[quote="devoutchristian, post:13, topic:308585"]
Ya, because as we all know Michael Voris hasn't taken any flak for this.

[/quote]

And as we all know, Mr. Voris NEVER judges by outward appearances, and always assumes that someone's internal disposition is what counts. . . . .right?


#15

[quote="missadeangelis, post:8, topic:308585"]
I've already registered to go and I look forward to it. It's a great opportunity for traditionally-minded Catholics to get together. I am guessing that the timing has everything to do with the availability and booking the cruise itself with the cruise liner. FYI Saint Michael's media itself is only charging $100 for the entire week of conferences, daily mass etc. That is not exorbitant by any means and I do not believe anyone is "lining their pockets". I understand the objection as stated, but I'm not convinced that is indeed the real objection.

[/quote]

On top, of course, of the multi-thousand dollar cost of the cruise itself.


#16

He’s never denied that a person’s internal disposition is what counts. Of course he does base his actions and statements on external appearances (since he can’t know the internal disposition of others), then again everyone does that.


#17

[quote="devoutchristian, post:16, topic:308585"]
He's never denied that a person's internal disposition is what counts. Of course he does base his actions and statements on external appearances (since he can't know the internal disposition of others), then again everyone does that.

[/quote]

:thumbsup:


#18

[quote="devoutchristian, post:13, topic:308585"]
Ya, because as we all know Michael Voris hasn't taken any flak for this.

[/quote]

He shouldn't take any flak for it. This type of cruise is not prohibited by Church doctrine nor by any discipline. I see no need to judge based on appearances. With this being Mr. Voris on the cruise, I do not think there is any one left that will be judgmental about the appearance of this event.

We all have to decide for ourselves if such an event would be proper. I personally could no more take this cruise in Lent than I could, say launch into a defense of Hell at Thanksgiving dinner, a time for everything and all that.


#19

[quote="pnewton, post:18, topic:308585"]

We all have to decide for ourselves if such an event would be proper. .

[/quote]

And therein lies the problem.

These two guys have a history of speaking out on what's improper for other Catholics, but they ignore the basic observation of Lent by hosting a cruise, the week before Holy Week no less.

Jim


#20

ncregister.com/blog/simcha-fisher/charities-you-ought-to-know?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+NCRegisterDailyBlog+National+Catholic+Register#When:2012-12-14 10:00:01

I am uncomfortable with the idea myself and could not see myself going on such a thing. Then again, perhaps they are planning to have round the clock activities to give people things to do which focus on Lent rather than the fact that they are on a cruise. Regardless of their internal dispositions, the event seems from the outside to be at least a bit unseemly. I have a feeling that, if they go through with this, they are going to regret it down the road because they are going to hear about it more than once.

The above article takes a pretty good approach to it in my view.


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