Gluttony


#1

What do you think of these quotes about gluttony from saints? We don't hear about this sin often.

In my opinion, the descriptiopns of gluttony and why it is a sin sound similar to the arguments we hear today for why some kinds of sexual activity are unacceptable within marriage.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gluttony

Pope Gregory I, a doctor of the Church, described four ways by which one can commit sin of gluttony, and corresponding biblical examples for each of them:[3]

  1. Eating before the time of meals in order to satisfy the palate.
    Biblical example: Jonathan eating a little honey, when his father Saul commanded no food to be taken before the evening.[1Sa 14:29]

  2. Seeking delicacies and better quality of food to gratify the "vile sense of taste."
    Biblical example: When Israelites escaping from Egypt complained, "Who shall give us flesh to eat? We remember the fish which we did eat in Egypt freely; the cucumbers and the melons, and the leeks and the onions and the garlic," God rained fowls for them to eat but punished them 500 years later.[Num 11:4]

  3. Seeking to stimulate the palate with sauces and seasonings.
    Biblical example: Two sons of Eli the high priest made the sacrificial meat to be cooked in one manner rather than another. They were met with death.[1Sa 4:11]

  4. Exceeding the necessary quantity of food.
    Biblical example: One of the sins of Sodom was "fullness of bread."[Eze 16:49]

  5. Taking food with too much eagerness, even when eating the proper amount, and even if the food is not luxurious.
    Biblical example: Esau selling his birthright for ordinary food of bread and pottage of lentils. His punishment was that the "profane person . . . who, for a morsel of meat sold his birthright," we learn that "he found no place for repentance, though he sought it carefully, with tears." [Gen 25:30] The fifth way is worse than all others, said St. Gregory, because it shows attachment to pleasure most clearly. To recapitulate, St Gregory the Great said that one may succumb to the sin of gluttony by: 1. Time (when); 2. Quality; 3. Stimulants; 4. Quantity; 5. Eagerness

In his Summa Theologica (Part 2-2, Question 148, Article 4), St. Thomas Aquinas reiterated the list of five ways to commit gluttony:
Laute - eating food that is too luxurious, exotic, or costly
Nimis - eating food that is excessive in quantity
Studiose - eating food that is too daintily or elaborately prepared
Praepropere - eating too soon, or at an inappropriate time
Ardenter - eating too eagerly.

Aquinas notes that the first three ways are related to the nature of the food itself, while the last two have to do with the time or manner in which it is consumed

St. Alphonsus Liguori wrote the following when explaining gluttony:

"Pope Innocent XI has condemned the proposition which asserts that it is not a sin to eat or to drink from the sole motive of satisfying the palate. However, it is not a fault to feel pleasure in eating: for it is, generally speaking, impossible to eat without experiencing the delight which food naturally produces. But it is a defect to eat, like beasts, through the sole motive of sensual gratification, and without any reasonable object. Hence, the most delicious meats may be eaten without sin, if the motive be good and worthy of a rational creature; and, in taking the coarsest food through attachment to pleasure, there may be a fault."


#2

Yeah, it's true. We often overlook gluttony as a sin, but it's in the Bible. It is one of the 7 cardinal sins. It's appropriate to bring this vice up as a reminder to us.

I admit it's one of the main sins I wrestle with.


#3

Yes, it is a sin. A small one. I admit, I am guilty of this on occasion. To eat food or extra food just for pleasure. I am becoming more disiplined however.

But, I can see where if a Nun, Monk, or a Preist will take a more serious and disiplined attitude on this..:)


#4

I’m often amazed at how sins affect each of us differently. Food for me is merely tummy filler. I have my own cardinal sin that i wrestle with, which I’m sure didn’t cross some people’s minds… Just a thought!!


#5

[quote="Eagle1937, post:3, topic:348685"]
Yes, it is a sin. A small one. I admit, I am guilty of this on occasion. To eat food or extra food just for pleasure. I am becoming more disiplined however.

But, I can see where if a Nun, Monk, or a Preist will take a more serious and disiplined attitude on this..:)

[/quote]

Actually, gluttony isn't considered a minor sin. It's up there with the top 7 cardinal sins!

And put a knife to your throat if you have a ravenous appetite. Proverb 23:2

There are others, as well.


#6

The 10 Commandments are the laws…Break anyone of these, it is a major sin. Ok, a Mortal one…

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/command.htm

And a Confession is in order. Smaller lesser sins need to be confess as well…But these, can be reconcile with God by changing or Repenting ones ways…And ask or pray to be forgiven in a private way..

“And put a knife to your throat if you have a ravenous appetite. Proverb 23:2”

Yeah but. I don’t have a ravenous appetite..

Gluttony. I discovered I don’t do any of this..

Praepropere – eating too soon
Laute – eating too expensively
Nimis – eating too much
Ardenter – eating too eagerly
Studiose – eating too daintily
Forente – eating wildly

“eating too soon” - I take this as eating while not hungry..

There are times I only eat once a day. Or sometimes don’t eating anything at all..

I do fast on occasion. But, I am way over due for this.

I do fast before Communion..


#7

[quote="ClearWater, post:5, topic:348685"]
Actually, gluttony isn't considered a minor sin. It's up there with the top 7 cardinal sins!

[/quote]

7 *Capital *sins....is the better term.

  1. What are vices?

1866-1867

Vices are the opposite of virtues. They are perverse habits which darken the conscience and incline one to evil. The vices can be linked to the seven, so-called, capital sins which are: pride, avarice, envy, anger, lust, gluttony, and sloth or acedia.

vatican.va/archive/compendium_ccc/documents/archive_2005_compendium-ccc_en.html

Lust of course is in the area of grave matter- but is anger or pride or gluttony necessarily grave matter? Such would not be the correct reading of such. Such contain both grave and venial matter.


#8

Reason, the virtue of temperance, and good judgement of conscience can guide one in ones eating. Though it is to be noted that what is contrary to temperance for one is not for another and as at least one Saint reminds us–this is a area that is a difficult one where many struggle.

Also note that often one is dealing with venial gluttony --not serious (an example of serious gluttony is loosing ones reason via being drunk…). It is important to note this for some get confused on this subject.

We should seek to live by virtue here and to eat reasonably…

Individual acts of overeating…intemperance (gluttony in this sense) are “ordinarily” a “venial matter” for venial sin…

(Now certain uncorrected habits that cause at least in the* short term* serious problems can become grave…like perhaps your doctor tells you if you keep eating 7 pieces of cake a day you will seriously harm your health or drop dead…in three months)

One example of gluttony that are grave matter…being drunk to the point of one losing ones reason …


#9

Such would lead to a misundertanding.

Under many of the 10 Commandments - there are many venial matters.


#10

#11

[quote="Eagle1937, post:6, topic:348685"]

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/command.htm

[/quote]

The obligation of the Decalogue

2072 Since they express man's fundamental duties towards God and towards his neighbor, the Ten Commandments reveal, in their primordial content, grave obligations. They are fundamentally immutable, and they oblige always and everywhere. No one can dispense from them. The Ten Commandments are engraved by God in the human heart.

2073 Obedience to the Commandments also implies obligations in matter which is, in itself, light. Thus abusive language is forbidden by the fifth commandment, but would be a grave offense only as a result of circumstances or the offender's intention.

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2.htm


#12

Reason, the virtue of temperance, and good judgement of conscience can guide one in ones eating. Though it is to be noted that what is contrary to temperance for one is not for another and as at least one Saint reminds us--this is a area that is a difficult one where many struggle.

Also note that often one is dealing with venial sin --not serious (an example of serious gluttony is loosing ones reason via being drunk....). It is important to note this for some get confused on this subject.

We should seek to live by virtue here and to eat reasonably...

Individual acts of overeating...intemperance (gluttony in this sense) are "ordinarily" a "venial matter" for venial sin...

(Now certain uncorrected habits that cause at least in the* short term* serious problems can become grave...like perhaps your doctor tells you if you keep eating 7 pieces of cake a day you will seriously harm your health or drop dead...in three months)

An example of gluttony that are grave matter....being drunk to the point of one losing ones reason ...


#13

Thank you for this thread. Very helpful.


#14

"Such would lead to a misundertanding"

There are Mortal Sins and there are Venial or lesser sins.

If I killed someone, I have commited a Mortal Sin. There no Venial matters here...

In that case, a full confession is in order..

I argue, that smaller venial sins do not need a Priest to absolved them in a Confessional Booth. But can be absolved during Mass with a Priest and Prayer.

I know many people in Church who recieve Communion and do not go to Confession. But during the ceremony, there is a part where one truly confesses their faults - and its repeated. This is ok - No murderers, thieves, and adulterers here!

But, they should go to confession for it is a humbling experience and properly prepares you for Commnuion.. - Mortal Sins aside.


#15

[quote="Eagle1937, post:14, topic:348685"]
"Such would lead to a misundertanding"

There are Mortal Sins and there are Venial or lesser sins.

If I killed someone, I have commited a Mortal Sin. There no Venial matters here...

Yes of course ...such is always a grave matter. But other things that fall under the 5th commandment can be venial matter. The point there was that there are venial matters that fall under the 10 commandments....and for example there are venial acts of gluttony, of anger ...

In that case, a full confession is in order..

Yes

I argue, that smaller venial sins do not need a Priest to absolved them in a Confessional Booth. But can be absolve during Mass with a Priest and Prayer.

Yes - but it is good to confess venial sins -- at least some of them -- and yes venial sins can be forgiven (not absolved) in many ways...prayer etc

But, they should go to confession for it is a humbling experience and properly prepares you for Commnuion.. - Mortal Sins aside.

Yes most certianly

[/quote]

The obligation of the Decalogue

2072 Since they express man's fundamental duties towards God and towards his neighbor, the Ten Commandments reveal, in their primordial content, grave obligations. They are fundamentally immutable, and they oblige always and everywhere. No one can dispense from them. The Ten Commandments are engraved by God in the human heart.

2073 Obedience to the Commandments also implies obligations in matter which is, in itself, light. Thus abusive language is forbidden by the fifth commandment, but would be a grave offense only as a result of circumstances or the offender's intention.

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2.htm


#16

Entering a Consecrated Church is one big Confessional Booth...

Mortal Sins are more serious and a one to one private affair with a Priest is the only way to absolve them..


#17

"venial acts of gluttony, of anger "

But, they are not Mortal Sins and do not fall under the 10 Commandments.


#18

Yes they fall under the 10 commandments.


#19

Gluttony can most certainly be a mortal sin. It’s not necessarily the sin itself, though in some cases it is. If I eat a pack of crackers just because it’s there and I’m bored, I have to think that is venial, but if I’m eating 3 big macs every few hours, clearly that is a grave/mortal matter.

Still, to be a mortal sin has its parameters and is clearly defined by the Church.

The Gravity of Sin (Starts in paragraph 1854 and elsewhere)

**1855 **Mortal sin destroys charity in the heart of man by a grave violation of God’s law; it turns man away from God, who is his ultimate end and his beatitude, by preferring an inferior good to him. (1395)
Venial sin allows charity to subsist, even though it offends and wounds it.

**1857 **For a sin to be mortal, three conditions must together be met: “Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed with full knowledge and deliberate consent.”

1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God’s law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin. (1734)

The whole section is great reading, but these three paragraphs seem to hit the heart of the matter.


#20

Every day? Every few hours? -ya your doctor might say you will be dead quite soon…etc


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