Gods Punishment?

I was listening to the radio again. Relivant radio I think the guest was Dr. Mark Marivali. They were talking about if God still uses Natural disasters and diseases as a way of geting attention/punishing the people. For example the swine flue outbreak and how it started in Mexico City and I think they said passing a pro abortion bill. God obviously in the past used such ways. The question I pose is does he still and is believing one way or another go against scripture or the CC.

I will try and post a link latter when they have it up.

I do not really have a sound answer for your question, just my own opinion. I was always taught that God is unchanging. Since God could never make a mistake, why would He ever have to change? Correct?

Therefore, since the Bible states that God did use natural disasters and disease to punish people in the past, it would only stand to reason that He could and probably would continue to do so today.

And besides, just look around at the discusting mess that we have made of this beautiful world that God gave to us. It is now not only legal but perfectly acceptable to kill unborn children, for people of the same sex to call themselves married, for unwed people to live together without any kind of shame or social stigma attached. Nobody seems to care and people seem just perfectly happy to go along to get along. It all makes me want to puke!
And guess what, I’m just as bad as the next guy, I seldom speak out.

So, if ever there was a society and a people that were way past due for a big old helping of the Wrath of God it is us.

May the Good Lord continue to have mercy on his stiff necked people.


Maybe, but they’re consequences of the realities and facts of life. The planet never stays the same. The forces of nature acting within and upon it do anyway.
Illnesses that get out of hand have their basis in a series of events.
For instance, if Swine flu has entered my country, it’s because three New Zealand students flew to Australia directly from Mexica. They’d planned their trip, enjoyed it, and then returnd to their place of study.
We couls apply this logic to most things.

If someone dies of lung cancer it’s likely to be because they smoked or because they came into contact with unhealthy compounds or chemicals. If a drunk drive crashes into someone and kills them, once again, it’s consequences.

Natural disasters are consequences of the physical nature of our world and the forces acting upon it.
Personal disasters are consequences of a wide rage of conditions…genetics, poor diet, stress, someone else’s bad choices or our own.

I think we do have to take responsibility for the consequences of our own choices, and deal as best we can with other’s unwelcome choices.
We need also to be aware of, and take proper precautions where we can of the natural disasters resulting from the fabric of our world and universe.
Good sense, together with God’s love and grace can help us deal with personal, community and global consequences ot reality and of choices.

I am not saying all the people that get diseases/ilnesses and what not are all evil or any thing. Yes there are consequenses for our choises lik smoking excessive drinking ect…
What about the things beond are controle some diseases and natural disasters. yes the world is changing but who crated and controls it? The world is ever evolving, but does God still not controle its comings and goings.

Reminds me of the warnings from our lady in Fatima, :(:bighanky:
we all know she said that if the people of the times didn’t change their ways then a great chastisement will take place. :imsorry:
Well what happened world war 2, I can’t say what their sins were, or how great they were but I can say that our sins are pretty bad, what use to be wrong is now right and what is right is now wrong, all is upside down, humanity has returned to the dark ages. :sad_bye:
The signs of the times aren’t good. I live only 30 minutes away from the king lake Victorian bush fires in Australia, I went there last week, words can not describe the scene . :sad_yes: we have never had a disaster as big as this in our history,
Interesting in November 2008 the majority of politicians in Victoria voted to change the abortion law, :frighten: it is now legal to kill babies in the womb and is no longer a crime.
One could say oh all a coincidence. I for one believe it’s a chastisement. :twocents:

Before you folks start down the path of a vengeful God, just waiting
for us to make a misstep before unleashing a disaster upon us, please get a copy of
Fr. Jonathon Morriss’s book “The Promise”. It will give you the church’s perspective on suffering and disaster.

You really don’t want to be saying that disease is a punishment for sin, or, as you get
older, you will not understand why you were stricken with cancer, or diabetes.

I once heard a nun speak of her life and vocation (caring for troubled children) and she made the statement which has stayed with me ever since… " I’ve been fortunate, not everyone is blessed with cancer".

These things can be great blessings, not great punishments, as my wife and I both know.

Peace to you all.

I do agree to a point. Not every illness is a punishment from God. We all do need suffering as suffering can be a blessing. What more or less I am refering to is a more global scale of spreading diseases. And it is not always the wicked who end up on the recieving end. Suffering can come as a blessing in drawing one to Christ. Especialy if we embrace our cross.

I don’t know I don’t think so. Because I was always taught that it was the devil who was responsible for alot of bad things. I was always taught it was Jesus who was there to pick up the pieces and brought good out of evil.

I think alot of the things that are bad and are happening are because of alot of us turning away from God. But I think that when people get into a mess they will and do turn to him because they are desperate.

But for awhile I did think that it was Gods way of getting our attention. Now I think its our way of not giving God our attention. People don’t care about eachother anymore. Its all about money and greed, at whatever the cost. Its not God, its man who does these things. Look at toys for kids, they sold them anyway for money. Look at how water had toxic waste. Instead of cleaning it up, companys would let people get cancer. Look at how people will look the other way for a buck. Kill a inocent baby by abortion, just to have a nicer house, car, vacation, money. Its not God its man. We do it to ourself!

Jesus was asked a similar question.

Luke 13

1There were present at that season some that told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.

2And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?

3I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

4Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?

5I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Modern paraphrase:

“Do you think that the people who died in the swine flu epidemic were the worst sinners in Mexico? I tell you they were not. But unless you repent, you will all likewise perish. Or do you think that all those homosexuals who died of AIDS were the worst sinners in the world? I tell you they were not, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.”

And remember, this warning was NOT given to unbelievers or Romans or anyone else, but good, practicing, kosher-keeping, believing Orthodox Jews.

Can you imagine an application to our present day?

that is funny i find this thread. i have been thinking about this for while. maybe because of the abortion fight i thought maybe this is warning from our God to the people. remember when mother Mary appeared to them it was at a time of violence against children and each other. i woudnt discard the possibility of punishment. we cannot go on the way we are going. sin are increasing one way or another. i can almost say the people have forgot the Laws of God. we need to be reminded that He still is the Almighty and He has not forgot us. Our Lord knows how much we are suffering because of the sins that are being commited against Him.

There are rather rational answers for why most natural disasters occur. To put it on God is usually the way of those who are unhappy with someone’s behavior and find it self congratulatory when bad things happen to nod and say God did it as punishment for whatever I don’t like. It was the same with HIV/AIDS, and virtually every earthquake, tsunami, volcanic eruption, etc. Has been said since recorded time. It’s a nice scapegoat and very little else I reckon.

Besides, there is apparently now some evidence that the latest flu attack may have ironically arisen in the USA. The final determination is probably a long way off, but I’d be careful about pointing fingers at this point.

cluny Modern paraphrase:

“Do you think that the people who died in the swine flu epidemic were the worst sinners in Mexico? I tell you they were not. But unless you repent, you will all likewise perish. Or do you think that all those homosexuals who died of AIDS were the worst sinners in the world? I tell you they were not, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.”

Well Said cluny :thumbsup:

I think its the law of karma that creates these things; not God.

Every action produces a reaction…

Karma:confused: Does not God controle what happens with his creation good and alow nec evil at times. Suffering does bring one to God. Law of Karma sound a bit like a budist teaching to me. comon

I wonder what these radio people would say now, since there is some evidence that the virus did NOT originate in Mexico after all.

Nor has it been found in swine.

Answer: No. The idea is fundamentally incoherent. It could equally well be argued that swine flue is a sign of Divine anger with Miravalle’s theology - how can one prove otherwise ? Any event can be matched to any other: the epidemic may be a punishment for the fall of the USSR, or for any of a million other things. It could be evidence of hatred for CAF :slight_smile: The interpretations are numberless, & limied only by common sense, reason, & one’s biases.

And a God who strikes out at people without explaining why, is morally inferior to a three-year-old in a tantrum; a God who has a tantrum and throws out diseases does far more harm than a three-year-old who throws a rubber duck across a room. We are back in the realm of blaming gays for hurricanes, as happened not long ago; the outlook is the same.

That makes it sound as though God was throwing something evil at some evil-doer - and missed, like a drunkard with too much liquor in him. Maybe God should stop trying to hurt people. :cool:

The Law of Karma is real.
Every action produces a reaction.
Why, is another reason, which you illuminate; suffering indeed turns us to reflect on who we are and why we are here, and where we are going in life. As you imply, the goal of life is union with God.

And no, its not a buddhist teaching, its a *universal *teaching.

Yes its right, sometimes God uses natural disasters for punishing people but it doesn’t mean God hate them. He just want to realize them for their sin.

Not only do I believe that God is now punishing a decadent and immoral society, but we are watching the coming of the end times unfold. It may take many years and might not happen in our lifetime, but by all appearances it seems to be the time predicted in the Book of Revelation. If you read revelation closely, everything written there is starting to happen. To name just a few things, earthquakes all over the globe, famine and pestilence, children turning against parents and parents murdering their own children. I know many would say that these things have always happened and that’s true. But never in the history of time has it been on the grand scale of today. And, we are only seeing the very tip of the iceberg here. Also true is that we have world wide coverage now with TV and Internet which they did not have in years past, but yet, still the numbers are growing in disasters all around the globe.

No one has made God the King of their nation. Governments around the world no longer rely on God for guidance but have set themselves up as rulers. America itself has become a Godless and disobedient society. I personally think God has been such a loving and patient God, giving us more time then we deserve to mend our ways and turn back to Him. We have Evangelists going around the globe preaching the Word and telling people to return back to the Lord. Many have, but more have not. The truth is that lots of people are still going around having a great time, living their lives like they will be on this earth forever and without a care in the world. They don’t even consider that someday we will pass from this life to another. It doesn’t even enter their mind. Abortions are taken as a matter of fact, not a big deal and nothing to concern ourselves with. What a disgrace before the Lord!

As for myself, I stand ready for the return of the King. When He finally appears I will fall upon my knees in remorse for all the bad things I’ve done on this earth and will plead for mercy.

I can’t predict where we’re headed, but wherever it is, it sure doesn’t look good. This world is going down fast it seems, but it’s not too late to change things. If everyone would turn their eyes up to the heavens, God would heal our lands. He would save us. I hope more and more people will wake up and turn their eyes upon Jesus and ask for forgiveness of our sins and healing of all our lands.


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