I went to a bar last night with a couple of friends. It was my idea to go out and listen to some music and dance. My intention was never to ‘pick up’ or flirt with any girls. We were dancing and a girl came up to my friend and they ‘hooked’ up. I feel terrible now since I felt that i led my friend into sin by influencing them to go out and placing them into the occasion of sin. it was never my intention to pick up any girls and I never encouraged my friends to. Was it a mortal sin?
Mate, you can’t blame yourself for your friend hooking up with a chick. It doesn’t matter where you are or where you go, your friend still had the free will to make his own decisions.
Anyway, good on your friend! If I were you, I wouldn’t be asking if taking him out for a night was sinful, but what is he doing to pull the girls!
No. As I have found with bars there is an applicable saying that sums up their use,“don’t go to a barbershop if you don’t want a haircut.”
He went to a club, not a brothel. :rolleyes:
Prayer. Confession. Doesn’t that ring any bell?
At the state of grace, as frequently as you can, receive the Eucharist.
Then ask what to do again.
I forgot: “You are your brother’s keeper.”
Is going to a bar a grave matter? No. Was it your intent to get your friend hooked up? No. Not seeing the mortal sin here. Not even seeing venial sin. Your friend made a poor choice. Pray for him. Encourage him to avail himself of the sacraments if he is Catholic. If you’re concerned about this, maybe next time you guys find another place to go…but the sin is all his.
“hooking up” means having sex? If he isn’t having sex it’s no big deal… If he is it’s not your sin. It’s not a prostitute home.
see i think semantics plays a role here.
when i hear bar i think of cheers somewhere to hang out have some drinks play 42, listen to a jukebox, stuff like that.
when i hear club i think of a plce to take/meet women dance and all that. personally im not a fan of clubs as they tend to be overly loud and sexualized beyond belief.
that said i think the op needs to compare. if he intended a ‘bar’ bthen i think it highly unlikely that he could have reasonably expected this. if he meantr ‘club’ and just typed the word bar i think that is a different enough type of place that some rflection is required.
either way i would try to find a new place to go out at.
You went out with your mates (as our anglican friend above has stated) to have a good time which in and of itself is not a sin. Since you are in australia, I’m not totally sure of the nuances of bar down there but, here it’s a place to go and have a few beers and laughs from the sound of it. There’s always some danger unless it’s just a family pub that your friend could “hook up” with a girl. Also here, did they do more than just have a date or kiss? Now you didn’t tell him to do that or encourage it, it really was his choice. If you feel bad about it then you could go to confession and the priest’ll sort out the whole business of whether it was a sin or not. Confession never really hurts one does it?
I say no harm, no foul. Now if the person was married and picked up a prostitute or another woman, then the adultery question would come into play. As long as he doesn’t do anything to harm himself or others (such as driving impaired or drunk), there’s no harm in going out to a bar and having a night with the guys.
=DEESYPAL;5299921]I went to a bar last night with a couple of friends. It was my idea to go out and listen to some music and dance. My intention was never to ‘pick up’ or flirt with any girls. We were dancing and a girl came up to my friend and they ‘hooked’ up. I feel terrible now since I felt that i led my friend into sin by influencing them to go out and placing them into the occasion of sin. it was never my intention to pick up any girls and I never encouraged my friends to. Was it a mortal sin?
To be a Mortal sin it must include all of the following.
Prior awareness that it is a Gravely sinful act
Freewill desire to commit the sin anyway.
To a “lesser” or “greater” we are “our brothers keeper,” depending on circumstances.
By it self going to a bar is not sinful. Going to to a bar IN HOPES of “getting lucky” is!
Having a drink [unless you’re an alcoholic] is not sinful, getting drunk is!
Meeting someone of the opposite sex, even in a bar, is by itself not sinful, UNLESS it is with the intention of having sex.
Inviting friends to a bar to enjoy the music and some non-sexual social life is OK. If you’re friend decides to “be picked up” for a sinful purpose, it’s his sin, NOT your’s! It was his decision not yours.
Don’t be so ahrd on yourself.
Love and prayers,
agreed, but still you can use it as a learning experience for future reference.
Totally and completely agree.
In catholic moral theology, act and intention have to be paired up for an occasion of sin. Agreed with StC’sDavid.
Agreed. Your friend picked up. Poor choice.
The state of your mind is more important.
Have clarity about your intentions, and make them clear. Nothing wrong with good clean fun and good company. You just found out that your friend was open to other things happening.
After you’ve had a few drinks and a beautiful woman comes up to you for a chat, you’re generally not thinking straight anyway. :rolleyes:
The message in your post seems very clear, concise and applicable. It’s simple: Reputable people don’t go to clubs or bars (very few like Cheers)!!! Reputations are ruined. Some based upon the very idea “of going to a bar and/or a club.” The club and/or bar carries its own connotation. You used the term “sexualized.” That’s a very appropriate description for the attendees at a bar or club. Attending with a “friend,” going to “listen to the music” or going to “have a drink” are all lame excuses.
True, Shadrak. But you also have to use your common sense.
Your friend could have “hooked up” in a bar, the library, a coffee shop, or walking his dog.
Do you know for sure what happened next? I mean, did he come brag about his conquest, or could they have just danced for a while and then gone to IHOP for coffee and pancakes to get to know each other? From what you wrote, I don’t know that anybody committed any kind of sin. If a guy is going to get married some day, he has to do something to meet girls.
Even if they did (insert euphemism here), that was his choice, the choice of both of them I’d expect, but not yours.
Give yourself a break. Unless you said to your friends, “Hey, let’s go find some chicks (or whatever folks in Australia call girls) and maybe we’ll get lucky,” your pal and his new friend are responsible for whatever may or may not have happened.
Maybe you can find some other place to dance, like take ballroom classes or…I don’t know where else you could go to dance without bringing your own partner. Try line dancing, no partner needed and there may be clubs (groups of people type of club, not nightclub) there like we have around here that actually focus on the dancing part. It’s a family activity with married and single people, old people, groups of women married to non-dancing men, even children were in the group I attended.
But you didn’t do anything wrong.
I think the term is Sheilas. Guys in Australia are called blokes.