Gospel today: does God not want to save anyone?


#1

Hello everyone.

As I read through today's reading, one verse (Mk 4:12) bites me:

[BIBLEDRB]mark 4:12[/BIBLEDRB]

Does that mean there are people whom Jesus Christ does not want to convert or forgive at all? What should (and should not) we learn from this verse?

Thank you.


#2

Various sayings in Scripture that need to be understood in context and in their particular genre ...like "pluck out your eye"....

Catechism 851

Indeed, God "desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth";344 .....God wills the salvation of everyone ....

344: 1 Tim 2:4.

scborromeo.org/ccc/p123a9p3.htm#851


#3

Cornelius a Lapide says this

Observe: the word that, as Mark says, that seeing they way see, and not perceive, does not signify cause and intention, but consequence and effect. For Christ, in speaking parabolically, did not intend absolutely to blind them, but only to permit what was the consequence of His parables—namely, that the Jews, being blinded with envy and lust, although they saw so many miracles of Christ, and heard His heavenly wisdom, yet would not believe, nor understand what they saw and heard, but would be as though they had neither seen nor heard.


#4

Haydock Commentary

In punishment of their wilfully shutting their eyes, (Matt. xiii. 15.) God justly withdrew those lights and graces which otherwise he would have given them, for their effectual conversion.

These speeches here and elsewhere, we are not to understand as if he spoke in parables to this end that the hearers might not understand, lest they should be converted; but we must learn the true sense from the corresponding texts in Matt. xiii, and Acts xxviii, where our Saviour and S. Paul render it thus:

*with their ears they have been dull of hearing, and their eyes they have shut. lest, perhaps, they may see, and understand, and be converted, and I heal them. *

Whereby it is evident, that the speaking in parables was not the cause, (for many besides the apostles heard and understood) but themselves, who would not hear and understand, and be converted: and thus they were the real cause of their own wilful and obstinate infidelity.


#5

Hi
Jesus gives man a chance in describing the word in parables, he does not use harsh methods such as: if you are one of those people that.... then so and so will happen to you..." but uses parables so that those who do not wish to perceive shan't but those who are receptive to His grace will be open to It and interpret It in their own lives.
The fundamentals all come down to free will, are you willing to listen and to understand? Jesus spreads the Word, they must decide what to do with it. Often we wish we could force it down other people"s throats because we see the bigger picture, but time and time again has proved that it must be done by His way, which is invariably gentle and good.
You just have to be open to it


#6

Ditto previous post..I've often thought that part of the The Parable of The Sower is why the devil, in the first instance, is able to come and steal away the seed so easily. Unless touched by grace,the ground of our hearts are solid, cold, and unyielding. Try planting seeds on a cold January Day. A feast for all blackbirds and rodents everywhere! If we till our hearts with love for God, love for neighbor, and repentance for personal sin only then can we be receptive for the 30, 60, and 100x return God seeks on his investment. God Bless!!!


#7

[quote="poptown, post:1, topic:313185"]
Hello everyone.

As I read through today's reading, one verse (Mk 4:12) bites me:

[BIBLEDRB]mark 4:12[/BIBLEDRB]

Does that mean there are people whom Jesus Christ does not want to convert or forgive at all? What should (and should not) we learn from this verse?

Thank you.

[/quote]

The Messiah had to come to the Jews... the Jews had to reject the Messiah so that through their rejection God could open Salvation to the Gentiles (St. John 1:1-14)... so God uses man's intellect to keep them from understanding His Salvific Plan so that His Mercy could reach those who were not His Chosen People (read Romans 9:1 through 11:32).

...notice that Jesus also stated that none who is sent to Him by the Father would He turn away!

Maran atha!

Angel


#8

[quote="poptown, post:1, topic:313185"]
As I read through today's reading, one verse (Mk 4:12) bites me

[/quote]

There are different kinds of hearers as pictured in the parable that comes immediately before and which Jesus explains after verse 12.

Does that mean there are people whom Jesus Christ does not want to convert or forgive at all? What should (and should not) we learn from this verse?

I wouldn't say He has absolutely no desire to convert them. Because of this, for instance:
Matthew 23.37, "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing!"

On the other hand, Jesus does seem to imply a divine intention behind their response. Consider Isaiah 6, which might explain why Jerusalem stoned the prophets and rejected their message:

*Isaiah 6.8-13, "And I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?”

Then I said, “Here I am! Send me.”

And he said, “Go, and say to this people:
“‘Keep on hearing, but do not understand; keep on seeing, but do not perceive.’

Make the heart of this people dull, and their ears heavy, and blind their eyes;
lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears,
and understand with their hearts, and turn and be healed.”

Then I said, “How long, O Lord?”

And he said:
“Until cities lie waste without inhabitant, and houses without people, and the land is a desolate waste, and the Lord removes people far away, and the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land.
And though a tenth remain in it, it will be burned again, like a terebinth or an oak, whose stump remains when it is felled. Thy holy seed is its stump”*

One thing we could learn from this is that here is another reason for us to live in utter dependance upon El Shaddai, (God Almighty).


#9

Thanks everyone of you for answering! What you have said are truly helpful.


#10

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