Greatest gift of God


#1

What is the greatest gift God has bestowed on us?


#2

His Son. I suppose you could say the Mass, then. Is that what you meant by “the Eucharist” or did you mean the Blessed Sacrament?


#3

Hi
I think the greatest gift from God is the defeat of death on the cross
through Jesus.
Dave.


#4

[quote=oudave]Hi
I think the greatest gift from God is the defeat of death on the cross
through Jesus.
Dave.
[/quote]

Yes, and the continuous offering of that Sacrifice in the Mass.


#5

None of the above. His greatest gift is Love, from that all else exists.

John


#6

It has to be His plan for our Salvation! Which choice is that :wink:


#7

With all due respect Yochumjy, I would offer for a thought/consideration that His love is not a gift per se, the Grace that comes from His love is - it’s the manifestation of His love for us.

I thought about Salavtion as it was the gift of Grace he sent us, but His grace would be a good choice also!!!


#8

I voted for free will. I think if we didn’t have the ability to choose God none of the rest would matter.


#9

[quote=awalt]With all due respect Yochumjy, I would offer for a thought/consideration that His love is not a gift per se, the Grace that comes from His love is - it’s the manifestation of His love for us.

I thought about Salavtion as it was the gift of Grace he sent us, but His grace would be a good choice also!!!
[/quote]

Yochumjy is correct while you are playing with words .

Love is God and God made man is Jesus,in other words there is nowhere God is not .Such is Christ ,Eternal Life,Spirit and all those things where Divine nature is experienced as Love and in Love.


#10

[quote=FightingFat]I voted for free will. I think if we didn’t have the ability to choose God none of the rest would matter.
[/quote]

Free will is original sin,what fell and died in Adam was the division of man and God,what rose and lived in Christ was Divine Will and the death of free will hence man made God.

Jesus had no free will .


#11

LOVE. :wink: God Bless


#12

Jesus had no free will .

HUH??? :bigyikes:


#13

[quote=Curious]HUH??? :bigyikes:
[/quote]

All that passed in the Life of Jesus came from God,he had no choice in the matter.He was not exempt from anything we suffer and indeed felt all the things we feel which hurt our human nature.Never has a greater life existed as that of Christ.

ccel.org/t/theo_ger/theologia34.htm

Why are you surprised ?.


#14

[quote=oriel36]Free will is original sin,what fell and died in Adam was the division of man and God,what rose and lived in Christ was Divine Will and the death of free will hence man made God.

Jesus had no free will .
[/quote]

Free Will is not and never was original sin, it was the abuse of FW which led to sin. Adam and Eve did not cast the first sin, no, it was Lucifer in fact, who rebelled against God and swept 1/3 of the angels down with him, who all had FW mind you. Without free will we would not be able to love God or created beings freely, which would be no love at all, who would therefore, if he forced (which would be the result of abscence of free Will) us to love, then that would be cruel, and therefore would act outside of his nature, and would cease to be omnibenevolant, which is not possible for God to do. In conclusion it would have not been an omnibenevolant God or GCB who created us.


#15

[quote=Sean.McKenzie]Free Will is not and never was original sin, it was the abuse of FW which led to sin. Adam and Eve did not cast the first sin, no, it was Lucifer in fact, who rebelled against God and swept 1/3 of the angels down with him, who all had FW mind you. Without free will we would not be able to love God or created beings freely, which would be no love at all, who would therefore, if he forced (which would be the result of abscence of free Will) us to love, then that would be cruel, and therefore would act outside of his nature, and would cease to be omnibenevolant, which is not possible for God to do. In conclusion it would have not been an omnibenevolant God or GCB who created us.
[/quote]

On this matter as a Catholic and in line with the Theologia Germanica,I take a stand on the matter.

All humans have a choice between one thing and another,for good or for evil according to cultural and geographical influences however Jesus makes it quite clear than the gift of following the Christian Way comes only from God *.

By no means is this an elitist thing ( one Christian is inferior or superior to another ) but the balances of two ways of Christian life was certainly recognised in the early church and seen as complimentary to the overall Christian community.The division of Catholic and Protestant is just a symptom of the failure to forget that Christ is the head of the church rather than the Church as a seperate entity in lieu of some perceived future return of Jesus.

65He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him.”

66From this time many of his disciples turned back and no longer followed him.

67“You do not want to leave too, do you?” Jesus asked the Twelve. 68Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69We believe and know that you are the Holy One of God.” 65He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him.”

John 6


#16

[quote=oriel36]Yochumjy is correct while you are playing with words .
[/quote]

It was not my intent to play with words, to me it seems like that is what the Bible (RSV-CE) says. Start with Eph 2:4 –

"But God, who is rich in mercy, out of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved) "

…to me that says because God loved us He bestows the gift of Salvation, by grace, on us. How do we know it’s a gift?

Verse 8 says –

“For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God— 9 not because of works, lest any man should boast.”

So Grace is a Gift, bestowed by God, because he Loves us.

And then verse 10 says –

“For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them. %between%

…which says that since the beginning this was God’s plan of Salvation so we could do good works to glorify God.

So all this adds up to "God loves us so much He bestows the Gift of Salvation by Grace in order that we may glorify God through good works.

I don’t think that’s playing with words :confused:


#17

[quote=oriel36]All that passed in the Life of Jesus came from God,he had no choice in the matter.He was not exempt from anything we suffer and indeed felt all the things we feel which hurt our human nature.Never has a greater life existed as that of Christ.

ccel.org/t/theo_ger/theologia34.htm

Why are you surprised ?.
[/quote]

Hi Oriel, I thought Jesus gave His life freely when He took on sin and went to the cross? :confused: God Bless


#18

Himself


#19

[quote=awalt]It was not my intent to play with words, to me it seems like that is what the Bible (RSV-CE) says. Start with Eph 2:4 –

"But God, who is rich in mercy, out of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved) "

…to me that says because God loved us He bestows the gift of Salvation, by grace, on us. How do we know it’s a gift?

Verse 8 says –

“For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God— 9 not because of works, lest any man should boast.”

So Grace is a Gift, bestowed by God, because he Loves us.

And then verse 10 says –

"For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them. "

…which says that since the beginning this was God’s plan of Salvation so we could do good works to glorify God.

So all this adds up to "God loves us so much He bestows the Gift of Salvation by Grace in order that we may glorify God through good works.

I don’t think that’s playing with words :confused:
[/quote]

When are you ever going to get out of that scriptural swamp and at least attempt to find the ground Christ said was necessary to be a follower by means of God’s gift rather than by choice.

“who were born not by natural generation nor by human choice nor by a man’s decision but of God.” John 1

Look,it is fairly easy to put Paul in context as a follower of Christ by God’s decision rather than the inherited one through cultural and geographic circumstances.I love my Catholic inheritance and by no means see it at odds with the very individual experience of the Christian Way as set down in the Johannine gospel.

In that way the Church is not entirely in the people,the building or the institution but neither is it all in the individual and his reading and interpretation of scripture.

Vine and branches and beautiful balances.


#20

All that passed in the Life of Jesus came from God,he had no choice in the matter

If Jesus was fully human, he did have a choice in the matter. He could have sinned but He did not. If he had no free will, then what good was his sacrifice? If he could not have sinned, then the temptations he experienced were not temptations at all, if he had no choice but to refuse them.


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