Greek Orthodox Bishops accuse Pope of heresy


#23

Of course it is not a reform, you only stopped using old one and started using new one, but it is not a reform. You just composed a New Liturgy, that has elements of the old one, so it is cool. No need to worry or question it.
You even reduced Liturgical robes for the priests. They don’t even wear cossacks.

St. Photius in 9th century, warned the west that even smallest departure from Tradition will lead to doom, or for example Clown Mass.


#24

Um… ok… Then why did you use the word “reform” a few lines up?

You don’t know what you really think, do you? Just so long as it’s sufficiently anti-Catholic? Right? That is, after all, the greatest and best “glue” binding Orthodoxy together for the last 5 centuries…

So shall I find the thread where we discussed changes to Basil’s and Chrysostom’s liturgies over the years???


#25

I think you’ve been sufficiently revealed here.

Last word is yours.


#26

Of course it is a reform, i was being sarcastic. Not officially, but 99% of parishes were forced to change Liturgical life to try to please the world.

Basil’s and Chrysostom’s Liturgies have grown like a yeast in beauty. They were not cut in 1960s and re-written by a Council that tries to please world instead God.


#27

THANK GOD for Vatican II!!! Without it I would not have the choice to "Come Home!"
As for “making it easy for Protestants…” BAHAHA!!!
Conversion is not so simple as that my friend. BUT, THANK YOU HOLY TRINITY FOR PROVIDING ME WITH RESOURCES AND CALLING ME INTO FULL COMMUNION!!!
AMEN


#28

I have decided, in the spirit of asking God for the gift of patience, to excuse myself from this discussion and simply pray for you and all involved,
Have a nice day.


#29

Yes, if it were so “easy” for them, they would not be all over this forum with their issues that they still have with our 2000-year-old faith. Oh well.


#31

And in another dazzling display, Profete mocks Vatican II by posting pictures of the “Clown Eucharist” that took place at Trinity EPISCOPAL Church, located on Wall Street in NY, NY. They’re not Catholic, if you didn’t catch that.

Excellent. :+1:


#32

Are these Catholic?


#33

Well, this is a video in another language (which I can’t understand) without any provided translation. The video itself is short snippets of moments, and doesn’t show any context. Also, it’s unclear if the audio and video are completely in time-sync or not for parts of the video.

The description of the video does not have a transcript or a link to a video with more context of the situation. It looks like the first one was a children’s mass or event. It’s unclear to me any actual timeline of the events portrayed in this video.

I’m going to say doing a tango during Mass is inappropriate. Having said that, I don’t even know if mass was actually going on. There’s a snippet of mass being held, and then it goes into a couple doing the tango. That does not mean the tango was done during mass. That’s simply what the person who created the video wants you to think.

This video is completely useless without a translation and without context (preferably, a link to the full video for both events).


#34

A few years back is before the Synod of Crete and before Pope Francis visited Greece. How many years back?


#35

“The Orthodox Church as the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, in her profound ecclesastical self-consciousness, believes unflinchingly that She occupies a central place in the matter of the promotion of Christian unity in the world today. The Orthodox Church which prays unceasingly “for the union of all”, has always cultivated dialogue with those ESTRANGED from her, those both far and near. In accordance with the ontological nature of the Church, Her unity can NEVER BE PERTURBED. In spite of this, the Orthodox Church accepts the HISTORICAL name of other non-Orthodox Christian Churches and Confessions that are not in communion with her,”

Holy and Great Synod of Crete

So according to this, those not in communion with the Orthodox Church are not Church, but are church, because of historic name. Sounds like a compromise between ecumenism and Tradition. lol


#36

Oh dear, your Youtube video is linked to Lifesite News. What a shame. :open_mouth::frowning:


#37

It is not my video.


#38

Excuse me, let me clarify…You used a Youtube video from Lifesite News. Which is not really a credible news source.
THE Orthodox Church? Which one? Eastern? Greek? Russian? Constantinople? Georgia? Serbia? Jerusalem? Antioch? America? Cyprus? Etc…


#39

So there’s the Russian Orthodox Church, Greek Orthodox Church, Serbian Orthodox Church, etc all with their own patriarchs…so if an alien visited the earth and wanted to speak to the leader of the Orthodox Church, to whom shall it go?


#40

If alien visits Earth, he will speak to the United Nations, not the Pope. And if the alien falls in love with the Orthodox Liturgy, he will speak with the Ecumenical Patriarch, and then Ecumenical Patriarch will contact his fellow Patriarchs to tell them what alien told him.

Orthodox Church is a Federation of Independent Churches, just like the Early Church was, before Rome innovated universal jurisdiction causing the Schism.


#41

Ssssooo which “Independant Orthodox Church” do you belong to?


#42

On paper, the Pat. of “Constantinople”, despite the fact that this will confuse the aliens since Constantinople has, effectively, been “Istanbul” for 500 years.

But this would be a problem. While once-upon-a-time the Pat. of Constantinople was both de facto and de jure the most powerful man in Orthodoxy, the de facto Patriarch of Orthodoxy is the Russian Patriarch, since more than half of all Orthodox belong to his church. So if the Pat. of Constantinople tried to do something so momentous as to contact an alien species without the Pat. of Russia present, we’d see a fracas that not even their mutual jealousy of Rome would hold together.

Oh, and they’re “independent” until they don’t want you to be, as the deposed Patriarch of Jerusalem taught us.


#43

So they are united in their jealousy of Rome?


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