Gunman can't read, enters Maine elementary school

Yup, its clear that this guy needed to learn how to read because he seemed to completely ignore the little paper signs on the door that say GUN FREE SCHOOL ZONE. No self respecting fugitive would disobey a paper sign on a school if he could read. Obviously if the man could read then he would have left his gun in the car before going in to terrorize the children.

[INDENT]foxnews.com/story/0,2933,445569,00.html
Fugitive Gunman Tackled, Arrested After Holding Fifth-Graders Hostage in Maine

STOCKTON SPRINGS, Maine — A gunman who had been a fugitive for a week held 11 students hostage at an elementary school on Friday but was tackled outside a classroom and arrested without any harm to the children.

Police said Randall Hofland, 55, had released all the students and had turned over a loaded gun to one of the young hostages before he was taken into custody at Stockton Springs Elementary School.

The gunman walked into a classroom in the small coastal town around the start of the day. State police were called at 8:42 a.m. (1242 GMT) and Hofland was arrested about 20 minutes later after he was tackled by a state trooper.[/INDENT]
All went well in this story as the man was captured and none of the students or faculty at the school was injured. Clearly I am taking a somewhat sarcastic tone with my opening, but when will people understand that “gun free zones” simply mean there are hundreds, or perhaps thousands, of DEFENSELESS people inside?

Clearly I am taking a somewhat sarcastic tone with my opening, but when will people understand that “gun free zones” simply mean there are hundreds, or perhaps thousands, of DEFENSELESS people inside?

And yet, schools are one of the safest places you can be. The record shows that one is less likely to be shot in school than almost anywere else. How on earth can schools be safe if no one there is carrying weapons capable of killing?

:wink:

And shopping malls and churches are also some of the safest places. Just like schools,** they are safe when no violent criminals are present**.

Yet at schools, shopping malls and churches there have been killings by violent criminals.

And at schools, shopping malls and churches there have been armed citizens who have stopped violent criminals from committing mass murder.

In the same vein, the ‘Drug Free School Zone’ signs never fail to crack me up. They’re nothing of the sort.

Barbarian observes:
And yet, schools are one of the safest places you can be. . .
And shopping malls and churches are also some of the safest places. Just like schools, they are safe when no violent criminals are present.

Yet at schools, shopping malls and churches there have been killings by violent criminals.

And in places where guns are allowed, many killings have taken place by accidental shootings, disputes, etc.

Care to comment on which of these happens more frequently?

Las Vegas gets rich on your kind of thinking.

Many people believe that alcohol and guns don’t mix. Yet recently an armed citizen in Las Vegas shot and killed a gunman who started to shoot up a bar. I guess the odds makers would have a problem quantifying that.

I must confess that I always got the best drugs at school…

Many people believe that alcohol and guns don’t mix. Yet recently an armed citizen in Las Vegas shot and killed a gunman who started to shoot up a bar. I guess the odds makers would have a problem quantifying that.

No problem at all. Police keep statistics on that kind of thing, and the probabilities are well-known.

The reason we don’t have armed people in schools, is the guns pose a greater hazard than intruders.

We have armed people in school right now. Especially at the high schools. Many schools have ‘Barney Fife’ type armed security guards, some actually have real police officers roaming the halls.

This, however, happened in an elementary school. Very few schools at the younger ages (elementary to Jr High) have guards or even staff equipped to deal with violence. The high schools that have armed staff justify it based on student violence, not just shootings, but violent beatings, knife fights and gang activity in the schools. Intruders are often the least of the schools problems with violence. Most school shootings, stabbings and beatings don’t involve intruders, they involve students, authorized visitors/delivery people, etc.

This case was unusual, and again, presumably because the criminal could not read, he did not leave his gun in the car as instructed by the “Gun Free School Zone” signs and laws.

It’s so sad to get older- I was in high school 15 years ago, and there was never any trouble other than your average bullying or whatnot. I recently went to my little brothers high school for his graduation- there were not less than a dozen police officers present. The times they are a changin’, and I don’t like it at all.

and yet, gun shows are some of the safest places you can be. so are gun stores and arms depots.

I could not find even a single shooting at a gun range. I am not saying ther are not any, I just could not find them on Google.

You probably won’t find many cases of drug overdoses at pharmacies, either. But unfortunately, that’s not representative of drug use.

Nor are gun ranges representative of where most guns are.

It’s very foolish to propose to fix a hazard with a control that’s far more dangerous than said hazard.

Chicago has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the US, yet it is the murder capital. Law abiding people are the only ones who don’t have guns. The right to carry a gun by anyone who can pass a bakground check and a safety course will reduce gun violence. You have your opinion and I have one that is proven.

Just a point of fact- There are armed people in schools,

for example Utah has no restriction on carrying on school grounds, university, high school, grade school, or daycares. This was done on purpose and some parents thought it made their kids safer by having someone armed, so it would not create victim disarmement zones where they are easy targets. Any parent, staff, or teacher can carry concealed with a permit. And it is also an open carry state, where no license is needed. There are legally armed people in schools.

Chicago has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the US, yet it is the murder capital. Law abiding people are the only ones who don’t have guns.

Actually, I think Detroit or Washington has that distinction now. A few years ago, it was Dallas, and at one time, it was New Orleans. So you’re saying that the homicide rate in the Chicago schools is higher than the accidental shooting rate in the same area? I’d like to see those numbers.

The right to carry a gun by anyone who can pass a bakground check and a safety course will reduce gun violence.

So far, it hasn’t worked in Texas. We still have a higher rate of gun violence than most states.

You have your opinion and I have one that is proven.

Well, I’m always ready to learn something new. Show me those numbers.

As of April this year 24 public school students in Chicago have been murdered, most by gunfire. since then there are at least 6 or 7 more but I don’t have time to look up the statistics. I can assure you that 24 people have not been accidently shot in the state much less Chicago in this year.

Friday, July 25, 2008

Murders are up 13 percent. During the past school year, 29 Chicago-area youths were killed by gunfire. On one April weekend, 40 people were shot. Over the July Fourth weekend, nine people were gunned down - with three more killed this past weekend.

The press is dubbing Chicago "Beirut by the Lake."
washingtontimes.com/news/2008/jul/25/spiraling-murder-rate-sparking-political-spats/

Barbarian requests:
So you’re saying that the homicide rate in the Chicago schools is higher than the accidental shooting rate in the same area? I’d like to see those numbers.

As of April this year 24 public school students in Chicago have been murdered, most by gunfire. since then there are at least 6 or 7 more but I don’t have time to look up the statistics. I can assure you that 24 people have not been accidently shot in the state much less Chicago in this year.

Friday, July 25, 2008

Murders are up 13 percent. During the past school year, 29 Chicago-area youths were killed by gunfire. On one April weekend, 40 people were shot. Over the July Fourth weekend, nine people were gunned down - with three more killed this past weekend.

You’re claiming these all happened in public schools? I’m sorry, but I’ll need some documentation for that. That seems absurdly out of line with past history.

Just click on the link I provided and do a Google search on shootings in Chicago, you can spend a day or two reading about them.

So there aren’t that many shootings in the public schools after all?

Imagine that. Do you suppose that the lack of guns in the schools and the ready availability of guns elsewhere, might have something to do with it?

Though most weapon carrying is happening outside of school, tightening up school security by adding security cameras and more officers appears to be a key response to recent shootings in Chicago. Anti-violence groups contend that violence in schools remains a major problem, even though none of the recent shootings have occurred in schools.
blogs.edweek.org/edweek/eduwonkette/2008/04/a_closer_look_at_violence_in_c.html

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