We know that we are finite and God is infinite. The relationship is due to cause and effect. This means that relationship requires changes. How we could possibly have a relation with God accepting the fact that God is infinite and we are finite and the fact that God is changeless and relationship requires change?
Do both parties in a relationship have to change in order for the relationship to be changed?
If one party is changed, then that affects the relationship for both parties.
God does not change. You do. You become more like Him.
No. That is impossible since any response from God that make the relation meaningful requires change in God. We however cannot change God since He is infinite and we are finite. This is similar to trying to speak with a wall. Can you make a relationship with a wall?
That is incorrect since God is changeless.
When you are in the desert and see what looks like water on the horizon, you don’t know if it is really water or a mirage. Let’s say there is only one tree on that road in the same horizon as the water/mirage. When you travel far enough to get to the tree, you can now tell whether there is really water or not. The landscape has not changed, but you have more knowledge of the landscape.
Yes I do understand, but pure actuality deems us responsible with our co-existentially known infallible relationship with the Trinity.
I’m on a psycho holiday.
This is impossible for you, Baham, because you have your heart in book knowledge and are not in touch with your soul. That probably sounds trite to an intellectual, but what and where will all your philosophical questing take you and how will it help you find happiness or fulfilment?
It is apparent that you are ever searching, trying to find that elusive spiritual entity that you try to deny that dwells within you.
Has it occurred to you that there are no pat answers and that the finest philosophers and theologans, present and past, never found definitive answers or theories, that couldn’t be argued? You will not either.
In your concept of abstract philosophy you don’t know if you are real or just a random spark meandering through what we call the universe or the dark void. And if you are that wayward tiny burst of energy where did “you” come from? In your reality “you” don’t know if I or anyone exist or if we are just constructs of matter. Nothing comes from nothing and the search to find the “God PARTICLE” goes on and on and on…to what end? As far as speaking to walls…I might…LOL! And the “wall” might even answer back. You don’t know, but only assume, based on your finite knowledge.
OK, I’ve had a little fun with this. I hope and pray(when I speak to the wall) that you discover what, who, where “you” are, and where the “you” is going. As the tiny spark flitting about in the nothingness-watch out for moisture that may put your fire out…or better yet…be prepared to ignite into the blinding light that makes the world a better place. Peace:thumbsup:
God = Meaning
All meaning = God
Ergo we need to change to God for meaning, God need not change FOR meaning because He IS meaning :banghead:
This is similar to trying to speak with a wall. Can you make a relationship with a wall?
Bahman = wall
We all have a form of relationship with you.
But your theoretical understanding of how talking to a wall is… welcome to our world when we talk to Bahman…
You mean you’re taking a break from psychos?:takeoff:
Or you’re going crazy?:jrbirdman:
I vote yes to the break, and NO it’s not to the OP’s question.
It depends on the nature of the relationship. If we call the relationship"distance", then surely our walking closer towards the wall changes the relationship for both of us. You have to prove that this principle does not apply to a “personal” relationship as well.
That is incorrect since God is changeless.
So would a wall be (changeless, that is).
By the way, just because God is eternal and outside of time, doesn’t mean He can’t interact in temporal manner. It is just that every entry into a point of time in the “temporal world” is interacting actually with all of the temporal universe at once. It only appears to us to happen at discrete points of time because we are “stuck” in temporality.
It’s the easiest thing in the world to have a relationship with Jesus. Just hold on to him.
God always keeps his end of the bargain. It’s humanity that has failed to keep theirs.
My psyche is taking a break from ponderous threads like this one.
I for one, don’t think questions should be phrased in a way that makes them unanswerable. Not that I couldn’t answer this question. It’s just I feel the OP does not actual want an answer.
The change does not take place in God but rather the change takes place in man. God has made man his sons, therefore divine, filled with God’s own divine life. So the change is in man which God himself brought about thru his divine Son Jesus.
I don’t understand how your post is related to OP. Could you please elaborate?
You didn’t explain how this type of relationship is possible. What you are offering is simply a claim.
What do you mean?
I can have happiness and fulfilment when I find an answer to my question.
Your claim raises another question: How God could possibly dwells in me?
Your claim raises another question again: Why God left us in the state ignorance? What is His purpose?
We are intellectual beings and we enjoy practicing our intellectuality. We were ignorant in the past but we know much more know. Nothing is given for free in this world. To me understanding everything is a matter of effort.
Thanks for your praying. I hope you understand an answer to the question in this thread sometimes soon. That for sure gives you a great satisfaction.
We are talking about relation and not meaning. This does not provide a good answer to OP.
That is not correct. God is a wall and you are trying to make a relation with something changeless.