How are God and Jesus one?


#1

Can someone help me understand how God and Jesus are supposed to be ONE when Jesus refers to God as His Father and God calls Jesus His Son? and in Luke 18:19, “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. No one is good-except God alone. In what sense are they one?

What about the Holy Spirit? In what way is it one with God and Jesus?

Is God higher than Jesus, or more powerful? thank you


#2

[quote=biz]Can someone help me understand how God and Jesus are supposed to be ONE when Jesus refers to God as His Father and God calls Jesus His Son? and in Luke 18:19, “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. No one is good-except God alone. In what sense are they one?

What about the Holy Spirit? In what way is it one with God and Jesus?

Is God higher than Jesus, or more powerful? thank you
[/quote]

It is a mystery of the faith how they are all the same. No one knows the intricasies.

They are all coequal and coeternal. None is greater than the other.

In a sense God is greater than Jesus because Jesus is a man but they are equal because Jesus is God.


#3

I’m confused… Did the Bible say they are one?


#4

[quote=biz]I’m confused… Did the Bible say they are one?
[/quote]

John 10:30 “I and the Father are one.”


#5

In Deutoronomy, it says that God is one. Interestingly, the Hebrew word for “one” is not the word that would be used if someone were to say “there is only one Mount Rushmore.”

Rather, the word chosen is “one” in the sense of “e pluribus unum” which of course means one out of many.

It’s not a direct answer to your question because the fact is, the Trinity is a mystery of faith, and so is beyond our comprehension. In the exact same way as Riemannian Geometry - which holds that parallel lines intersect - is beyond our full comprehension as mediated by the senses.

But I hope this insight helps you reflect on the majesty of the Trinity. I, for one, am awe struck whenever I see the mysteries of the new testament hidden in the Hebrew scriptures, as in this case.


#6

Thank you for the passage Chesster.
Thank you Origen. Very good post. Informative.
Where does it say the Three are One? Because if it’s not in the Bible, how did it come up?

Thanks


#7

[quote=biz]Thank you for the passage Chesster.
Thank you Origen. Very good post. Informative.
Where does it say the Three are One? Because if it’s not in the Bible, how did it come up?

Thanks
[/quote]

I also find Genesis18 very interesting. In this chapter Abraham entertains the Lord but there are three of them. He addresses them as “My Lord”.


#8

[quote=biz]I’m confused… Did the Bible say they are one?
[/quote]

Hello biz, poor Saint Patrick had a hard time convincing the Druids about the Trinity, so he bent down and picked up the little 3 leafed Shamrock, 3 leaves one stem, 3 Persons, One God.
fantasy-ireland.com/images/Aon-Celtic-shamrock.gif


#9

[quote=biz]Thank you for the passage Chesster.
Thank you Origen. Very good post. Informative.
Where does it say the Three are One? Because if it’s not in the Bible, how did it come up?

Thanks
[/quote]

1 John 5:7 “And there are Three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one.”


#10

[quote=Chesster]1 John 5:7 “And there are Three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one.”
[/quote]

WOW, that is a pretty straight forward verse.


#11

Biz, you have seen just about every good answer you will ever see on this thread, thank the ones who answered you.

I can only repeat that the Trinity is one of the “mysteries” of the Catholic Church. You will not understand it while on earth, just accept it because the Holy Fathers have with the help of the Magisterium and the Holy Bible that God the Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are one but distinct personalities. The clover leaf is a good example.


#12

Biz,

Glory be to God! It seems that you are interested in learning Christian theology. Your questions are a very good start. It will unlock the hidden mysteries of God. Just be sincere and pray always to God (even if sometimes you may have doubts).

As Christians, we believe in the Trinity. The Trinity wasn’t revealed (fully) to the Jews in the OT, but was revealed by Christ Himself who came from God. He is the Only One who can give a perfect revelation of God since He is God Himself.

Creation itself reflects the Creator. As an example, a man marries a woman, and then they beget children. There is two persons involved and by their love for each other begets another person, that is, a child. There are so many created things that, with profound reflection, we will discover the mystery of the Creator, reflecting His Trinitarian beauty.

If in case you haven’t notice, the Holy Bible, especially the Gospels, reflects the Trinity in so many passages. Just a list of some:

The holy family: Jesus, Mary and Joseph
The 3 Wise men who came to visit Jesus
The 3 different gifts of the wise men
Jesus was lost for 3 days when he was a child and Mary and Joseph found him in the temple
Peter denied Jesus 3 times
Jesus asked Peter 3 times if he loves Him (reconfirming his headship for the apostles) after the Resurrection
3 nails driven on the feet and hands of our Lord
There were 3 crosses in Golgotha
He suffered for 3 hours hanging on the cross
Jesus died on the 3rd hour (3 o’clock is the hour of great mercy)
He was buried for 3 days
Jesus rose on the 3rd day (and possibly at 3 a.m. on Sunday!)
Jesus was accompanied by his 3 disciples on the Mt. of Transfiguration
To baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit (notice that it doesn’t say “in the names”)

These are just a few of what you will find out in the Bible.

Pio


#13

Hello biz

Can this possibly describe how Christ is one with the Father?

Christ loves the father as he loves HIMSELF.
The Father loves Christ as he loves HIMSELF.

Here is a short passage that uses the same language to describe one flesh.

Ephesians 5:31 For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh. This is a profound mystery- but I am talking about Christ and the Church. However each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.
If we are created in the image of God, would it make sense if the words of the greatest commandments had a meaning for the Father and Son also?

peace

Eric


#14

Thank you everyone. This really helps. :slight_smile:


#15

How about this…always helped me. The pope says that God though one is not solitary. He is in essence one like a family not one like an individual.


#16

OK biz-

I’ve got another one that just helped me last night. I am doing a scripture study (Ignatatius) on the gospel of John and one of the commentary notes on John 5:18 said this:

“By calling God his Father, Jesus claims a status of divine Sonship for himself. The three Persons of the Trinity equally possess the same fullness of divine life and Being. Although the Son is less than the Father in his humanity (14:28), he is equal to the Father in his divinity. (10:33) (CCC 253-54).”

Although, this is a mystery that we cannot fully understand in this life, I found that this passage described the relationship in a way that makes it a little more understandable. Maybe it will for you too!

In Christ,
Hikers5


#17

[quote=biz]Can someone help me understand how God and Jesus are supposed to be ONE when Jesus refers to God as His Father and God calls Jesus His Son? and in Luke 18:19, “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. No one is good-except God alone. In what sense are they one?

What about the Holy Spirit? In what way is it one with God and Jesus?

Is God higher than Jesus, or more powerful? thank you
[/quote]

Jesus and God are one because they are one in essence / nature. As Jesus Himself clearly says in John 10:30 that “I and my Father are one…” Yet it is likewise clear that Jesus is not the same Person as the Father as is clear in John 5:31-32 which says [font=Tahoma]

If I bear witness to myself, my testimony is not true;
there is another who bears witness to me, and I know that the testimony which he bears to me is true.

[/font]And similarly in John 8:17-18, Jesus says that:

“It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me”

Jesus was here clearly referring to ancient Jewish Law which states that:

One witness is not enough to convict a man accused of any crime or offense he may have committed. A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses. (Deut. 19:15)

Only persons can serve as a witness, hence we can conclude that while the Father and the Son are one in essence or Godhood, they are distinct as persons. Thus as God, Jesus Christ is good and powerful just as the Father is good and powerful. But Jesus, in his human nature, is in a sense subject to the Father.

The same applies to the Holy Spirit for as Peter, when confronting a sinful couple asked them why they have lied to the Spirit, and in so doing they have lied not to men but to God (Acts 5:3-4) which clearly identifies the Spirit with God. Thus the Holy Spirit is God. Since the Spirit can love (Romans 15:30) and be grieved(Eph. 4:30), The Holy Spirit is therefore a personal being as well, since only a person can love and be grieved.

Gerry :slight_smile:


#18

[quote=biz]Can someone help me understand how God and Jesus are supposed to be ONE when Jesus refers to God as His Father and God calls Jesus His Son? and in Luke 18:19, “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. No one is good-except God alone. In what sense are they one? In other words our Lord is telling them " think of what you’re saying" they called Him good, and rightly so, but they didn’t understand His Divinity ( Him as God )

What about the Holy Spirit? In what way is it one with God and Jesus? The Holy Ghost “decended” down ( from heaven ) upon the Son, as a dove.

Is God higher than Jesus, or more powerful? thank you
[/quote]

The Father was looked at as "greater, because He remained in heaven as the Son was here on earth, and was to suffer pain and rejection before He would return to heaven.


#19

[quote=The Dead Bishop]The Father was looked at as "greater, because He remained in heaven as the Son was here on earth, and was to suffer pain and rejection before He would return to heaven.
[/quote]

Christ was telling us to humble ourselves before the Father.

Gerry :slight_smile:


#20

From John 1

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came to be through him, and without him nothing came to be. What came to be through him was life, and this life was the light of the human race; the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

And the **Word became flesh ** and made his dwelling among us, and we saw his glory, the glory as of the Father’s only Son, full of grace and truth.


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