A good friend of mine, who is a strict Catholic, went to a Church retreat with her family and friends. During the retreat a “rival” Christian church crashed the retreat and rioted against my friend and her Church. They had picket signs and everything! They began to curse my friend (I’ll refer to her as “J”) and her family/friends for being Catholic, and even grabbed young children and told them that their parents didn’t love them because they allowed them to be Catholic! Now, I couldn’t make this up if I tried, but the Christian church then proceeded to throw used pads and other feminine products at J and her family. Riot police had to be called and brought to the scene to remove the hostile Christians. Do things like this happen often? I don’t understand HOW this could happen! J said she cried because of it, and I was sick to my stomach when she told me the entire story. I don’t think I’ve ever been in a situation where someone has tried pushing their religion on me, and if they tried I GUESS I would understand why they would, but how could one resort to doing something like that?
Simple (or not so simple) answer - hatred.
Married women threw urine at 8 year old girls at this protest.
I would hate to consumed with this degree of hatred.
HOW? look at the news. The question should rather be WHY and how on earth do they think this is WWJD and that it would possibly convert anyone?
Your religion is “Irish Catholic” although I am not aware of an Irish Catholic church. I am only aware of Latin right as opposed to several other rites that all belong to the one people sometimes call the Roman Catholic Church - this aside surely you know of the sectarian violence in Ireland that ripped neighborhoods and families apart??? … it is called the human failing .
Irish Catholic church I think mostly just refers to a Latin Catholic church with Irish customs. That aside, I have only done some brief reading on the religious conflicts in ireland, but I know there are a lot of them. There’s that little bit of northern Ireland that was so Protestant that it wanted to remain in the UK and then the rest of the tiny island that was so Catholic it wanted to be an independent country. Recipe for tension? I would imagine so.
Ireland is tiNY. Such strong opposing religious sides mashed together into an itty bitty little island is like putting vinegar and baking soda in a jar and then shaking vigorously. I think that when your ““rivals”” are so close to you, it makes matters even worse. It’s like there is that one person you dislike, and when they sit next to you in class suddenly you hate them.
It’s pure bitterness. Hatred. My guess is that there was a point in time when it was a mutual dislike that built and built and built itself into hatred. It’s an unfortunate part of being human. I guess all we can do is pray for them.
Where and when did this happen?
I feel like I need to clear a few things up. I live in California, and am Irish Catholic because my family is Irish.
This happened maybe two months ago, and I believe it was in the City of Pomona
They crucified Christ. And the reason why then, is the same reason they did it to these innocent people now. Rejection of Truth!
Dear Totherescue , I hope you take this in the well meaning way I intend it to be but I am English and I lived my first 21 years of my life with the results of the sectarian violence that was brought also to the main land. When I lived in Germany in the 80s where the IRA targeted the English ( regardless of whether they knew their faith - just because they were English ) I could be in formal attire but would never step into my car before getting down on the ground and checking under my car to see if someone had placed a bomb under it . There was even a bomb threat on the underground in London when my husband’s family from America were over for the wedding and a bomb threat at the location of our hotel and wedding reception on the very day . To distinguish yourself as Irish Catholic only highlights the sectarian division of 2 groups of people who both claimed to be Christian , which in turn highlights the very Protestant revolt in the first place. frankly it is as divisive as a southern US person flying the other flag. It also smacks against the very meaning of being Catholic which is to be one universal Church. I have never heard of someone calling themselves Polish Catholic, or German Catholic or Indian Catholic.
I would really appreciate you removing the distinction “Irish” unless you want to say Catholic - born in Ireland.
In case you are thinking I am being overly sensitive you might want to read the latest world news . Here is one quote from a May 4th 2014 AP report
“The episode has underscored the unrelenting hostility of some Protestants to Adams and his party’s ambitions to merge Northern Ireland into the Republic of Ireland. His departure from the police’s main interrogation center in Antrim, west of Belfast, was delayed two hours by a crowd of Protestants outside the front gate. The protesters waved Union Jack flags and held placards demanding justice for IRA victims. They roared with fury as a convoy of police armored vehicles came into view, thinking Adams’ car was in the middle.”
Do not worry, I am not offended by what you are trying to explain to me. I would like to apologize if I have offended you, or anyone else on this forum. Please believe that the last thing I would like to do is cause trouble here. I am terribly sorry for what happened to you and your family in London/Germany. I recognize what a threat the IRA was/is, and how terrorizing they were/are. My Irish ancestry goes back years beyond I can imagine, it’s where half my family comes from. I am Catholic, and my Irish Grandmother is Catholic; along with our ancestors. I have absolutely no idea whether or not my family had fought in Ireland over religion, who knows? When they came to the United States of America, the men in my family served and fought for our country in WWII and in the Korean War. To my knowledge, none of them were IRA terrorist; as they were too busy at the pearl harbor and overseas. To my understandings, I would not need to seek an “Irish church” here where I live, I can go to a normal Roman Catholic church and all would be the same. Irish Catholics are simply Roman Catholics who are either Irish or of Irish decent. I am a Roman Catholic who is Irish thanks to my father’s side of the family. I believe and follow everything a Roman Catholic does. I am not trying to disgrace my religion or any church by adding “Irish” in front of “Catholic”, I am simply stating what my religion is. I too have never hear of anyone calling themselves “Polish Catholic” or “German Catholic” and must admit it sounds rather silly. I would like to apologize once again if I have offended you, and I would like to say again that Irish Catholics are persons of the Catholic faith who Irish or of Irish decent. I don’t know if that isn’t know all over the world, but when I shared this information with my strict Catholic friends they told me: “There is no difference between Irish Catholics and Roman Catholics, you’re just Irish.”
I humbly suggest that you take a look around the Eastern Catholic Forum here on CAF to learn about the 22 Eastern Catholic autonomous, particular Churches that are by no means “Roman.”
This post explains it a bit more succinctly:
I have heard the hyphenated Catholicism phrases that you used, because where I grew up was (is) a working class collection of ethnic ghettos separated first by ethnicity and then by faith; we did (still do) do identify that way, if only to find common ground with others or to share an “inside joke.”
For example, you’d see a person with Pu*** willows on Palm Sunday and know, “Polish Catholic.” You’d read the sign for the Church fair and it read, “Italian Catholic.” The Germans had two monikers, “German Catholic” and “German Lutheran,” so you’d know if you were on the same page with identifying differences and similarities. Orthodox and Ruthenians? Two Towns over.
The Irish, though, didn’t even get a ghetto to settle in in my hometown; they pooled their money and built the most ornate church to call their own. It was built across the green from the Irish and English Protestant churches of the founding families.
People who shared the same ethnicities simply lived closer together and built ethnic based places of worship. It helped us to work through issues of class distinction and underscored the value of a parochial parish funded education.
Where I grew up is still that way, and it doesn’t seem to be updating itself. Perhaps it’s just Stateside, perhaps it’s limited to just little blue collar cities in New England, but while being sensitive to your experience, I am familiar with a very different connotation to identifying (not nationality) ethnicity in conjunction with religion. It does not have any nationalistic overtones because we’re nationally American.
At least the unpleasant incident is a reminder to pray for Christians who forget to act like Christians. These people in their hate, rudeness. and violence, show very unchristian attitudes and behaviour.
God have mercy on them and God put love and justice into their hearts and minds.
Special prayers for the children that their faith will be strong and that they won’t succumb to doubts due to the horrible accusations thrown at them.
God bless all involved.
Thank you for your kind words and prayers, God bless you!
I was at a Catholic Social Ministries retreat last weekend
and the speaker was an Irish Jesuit, he told us that Ire-
land was responsible for preserving European civilization
because the Libraries of the Catholic Monasteries in Ireland
were untouched by the invasion of the Barbarians in the
1st Century! What a pity that Ireland is also the cause of
so much destruction to the cause of Christianity, I am re-
minded of the verse in proverbs that says: "With her own
hands the foolish woman tears her house down"Prov 14:1
Pomona? :eek: I live in Riverside,which is about 60 miles east of Pomona. I call it pure IGNORANCE!
It really is sad about what is happening/has happened in Ireland.
Yes, it’s scary to know that something like that happened so close to where you live isn’t it? :dts:
So sad to hear about such vile behaviour from those who claim themselves as Christians. Regardless of what side of the fence anyone sits, I will include all involved In my prayers.
How dare Irish people identify as Irish if it offends English sensibilities. The horror of it…
I would like to address this post as I came across it whilst on holiday in Croatia (ironically enough a land also riven by religious tension between Christians at times) and could not respond as I was reading it from a phone on which it was hard to type. Firstly I find the notion that you imagine Irish people must define themselves according to your expectations absurdly arrogant. I have seen many people here over 5 years identify themselves as English Catholic, Spanish Catholic, Italian Catholic etc. and I have never taken it to mean anything more than that they are Catholic and either come from those nations or have roots there.
Secondly this talk of the ‘mainland’ has always been irksome, Ireland and England are both islands after all. This phrase of the ‘mainland’ was coined to try and pass of the whole conflict and to suggest overtones of rebellious natives been a bit naughty. Also, I suggest you look somewhat deeper into Irish history, you will find that Irish republicanism is in many ways originally largely a Protestant movement and the most eloquent original leaders were often northern Protestants. That was due to many facts, one the dissenters and non Anglican Protestants also suffered under legal restrictions in the north along side Catholics (although they were more severe for the latter), many Protestants in the early years of republicanism were also inspired by the American revolution which was current at that time.
I am afraid been told how to identify ourselves like puts my back up at least as an Irish person. I am Irish and Catholic, the two are not neccesarily synonymous and there are Irish people who are Protestant, atheist, Jewish, Muslim etc. who are all no more or less Irish than myself. However when those from another nation tell us we must identify ourselves as they see fit it is galling.
Sectarian violence in Ireland is something the Irish AND British both bear responsibility and both of them have indulged in it and created it over time. I have lived in London for many years now and on the whole I get on very well with English people but occasionally views like this make me shake my head just as do barstool republicans who occasionally attempt to cast the British as demons from Hell or similar.
As it turns out the poster was Irish-American and probably descended from one of the many, many immigrants from Ireland who went to the US (and many other places).
I have seen first hand the hatred in the north and can assure you both sides can dish it out up there. Although I would identify as an Irish republican I would never deny that but please consider how you in turn sound to members of a country that you ruled (at times very poorly indeed) for numerous centuries when you demand they define themselves as you wish them to.