How do I treat my brother's mistress?


#21

[quote="Ailina, post:20, topic:203881"]
Hmmmm, it takes two to wreck the home. It's not just her fault. The philandering husband too is responsible for hooking up with her in the first place. He too is just as guilty, if not more so. He discarded his wife like a piece of garbage. What does that say about him?

[/quote]

That's what I was thinking as well. Wondered why only one party was getting the blunt of the blame in this thread.


#22

Don't get me wrong. I view my brother's actions much more seriously than anyone else in this situation. But, I can be friendly with my brother as an individual without participating in any scandal. It's them as a couple that is the problem.


#23

To be perfectly honest I can't believe the lack of love for this woman and your brother on this thread. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, right? Yes, what they're doing isn't right but that doesn't give any of us the right to get up on some high horse and condemn them. We are to be little Christs and how do you think He would react in this situation? I highly doubt He would say "get $*@#%ed" and never speak to them again or wouldn't invite them to family dinners. From what I know of Jesus, which is admittedly not enough, He would welcome them, love them, lead them by example and call them to sin no longer. Jesus knew that Judas was going to betray Him, possibly the worst sin ever committed, but did He kick Judas out at the Last Supper? No. The brother and mistress' sin is one of lust and of the flesh. That is a human sin. Remember which sin belongs to the Devil, pride. We must not let our pride parade itself around as piety.


#24

I would keep a relationship with my brother but I wouldn't have my children around them as a couple at all, even if that includes missing Christmas. If they do marry sometime later then you'd have to accept them. I'd also explain to my children, if they were old enough, what was going on. Kids are smart enough to figure things out so it's better to have an explanation from their parents.

I have a close friend whose BIL was dating a married woman and brought her and her children to their families Christmas celebration. My friend and her DH made the decision after they pulled in the driveway and saw their car that they wouldn't go in. Her DH went in and explained to his parents quietly and out of the way.

I would actually call your brothers wife and ask if there is anything you could do for her. Think how she must be feeling, in my opinion, that is where the real charity should be going.


#25

[quote="AdriannaJean, post:23, topic:203881"]
To be perfectly honest I can't believe the lack of love for this woman and your brother on this thread. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, right? Yes, what they're doing isn't right but that doesn't give any of us the right to get up on some high horse and condemn them. We are to be little Christs and how do you think He would react in this situation? I highly doubt He would say "get $*@#%ed" and never speak to them again or wouldn't invite them to family dinners. From what I know of Jesus, which is admittedly not enough, He would welcome them, love them, lead them by example and call them to sin no longer. Jesus knew that Judas was going to betray Him, possibly the worst sin ever committed, but did He kick Judas out at the Last Supper? No. The brother and mistress' sin is one of lust and of the flesh. That is a human sin. Remember which sin belongs to the Devil, pride. We must not let our pride parade itself around as piety.

[/quote]

Where oh where oh where do I begin???

First, did you not ever hear of tough love?

Second, did not Christ, when giving instructions on fraternal correction, state that if they refuse to listen even to the Church, to treat them like a gentile or tax collector?

Third, Judas had a role in fulfilling prophecy regarding Jesus. I seriously doubt that the two adulterers do.

Fourth, did not Our Lady state at Fatima that it was the sins of the flesh that would send most people to hell?

Fifth, I notice that you love throwing around the "cast the first stone" quote. Nobody is talking about putting them to death. In fact, one of the spiritual works of mercy is to adminish the sinner.

Sixth, while "camping out" on the "throw the first stone" quote, have you forgotten that also in the Bible the Church in Corinth was severely criticized for toleratring a sexually immoral situation and was told to expel the sinners? So yeah, it DOES give us the right to condemn them.

Finally, in all your post about the love for the two adulterers, you said nothing - NOTHING - about the wife who was UNJUSTLY kicked out of her home. Where is your love for her?


#26

Iowander,

Another approach that you may want to take would be to warn the mistress that if your brother did it to one woman, what is to stop him from kicking her to the curb one day as well?


#27

[quote="AdriannaJean, post:23, topic:203881"]
To be perfectly honest I can't believe the lack of love for this woman and your brother on this thread. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, right? Yes, what they're doing isn't right but that doesn't give any of us the right to get up on some high horse and condemn them. We are to be little Christs and how do you think He would react in this situation? I highly doubt He would say "get $*@#%ed" and never speak to them again or wouldn't invite them to family dinners. From what I know of Jesus, which is admittedly not enough, He would welcome them, love them, lead them by example and call them to sin no longer. Jesus knew that Judas was going to betray Him, possibly the worst sin ever committed, but did He kick Judas out at the Last Supper? No. The brother and mistress' sin is one of lust and of the flesh. That is a human sin. Remember which sin belongs to the Devil, pride. We must not let our pride parade itself around as piety.

[/quote]

Um, I did say to treat them civilly. But to be warm and welcoming sends the wrong message. I'm on the side of the homeless wife kicked to the curb and abandoned by her lawful spouse. I wonder what Jesus would say to her husband about her? That it's okay, it's only a little fleshy sin?!


#28

I just don't see why there has to be "sides". Divorce is ugly for everyone involved, I know from personal experience. And of course love and charity should go to the ex wife who has been mistreated, but loving her doesn't mean hurting them.

Condoning what they're doing and treating them well don't necessarily go hand in hand. You could sit your brother down, have a chat with him, explain to him that what he's doing is wrong and why it is wrong and that you would prefer if infront of your children they don't make a display of their relationship but essentially kicking him out of your life because he made a mistake is just downright cruel.

Not all the people in my family share my beliefs, but does that make them any less family? Your brother is going through a divorce and next to losing a child that might be one of the hardest things in life to go through. He probably needs you now more than ever. Why choose his time of need to abandon him? Supporting him and supporting what he does are two very different things.

What he's doing is wrong, yes, but it's always better to leave the judging up to the one guy who c1)an actually do it, and react with love instead, love for everyone in the situation. Love for the ex-wife, what she's going through must be terrible and she could probably use all the support, financial and emotional that she can get. 2) Love for your brother, he's probably confused and hurting from the pain of a failed marriage that he's trying to fix with the band-aid solution of another woman. 3) Love for the mistress, how terrible her self-esteem must be that she doesn't expect the men in her life to treat her with the respect she deserves. If she had that kind of self-respect she would have never gone for a married man. She was so desperate to be loved that she would accept it from anyone.

I highly doubt that when we get up to the pearly gates we're going to be penalized for showing compassion (note: not accepting what they do, but accepting the people).


#29

[quote="AdriannaJean, post:28, topic:203881"]
Your brother is going through a divorce and next to losing a child that might be one of the hardest things in life to go through. He probably needs you now more than ever. Why choose his time of need to abandon him? Supporting him and supporting what he does are two very different things.

Well, he probably isn't doing too badly, considering he has his loving mistress to comfort him while he makes his wife homeless and financially destitute.

What he's doing is wrong, yes, but it's always better to leave the judging up to the one guy who c1)an actually do it, and react with love instead, love for everyone in the situation.

I think sometimes judgement is called for, particularly when someone is clearly involved in wrong-doing.

Love for the ex-wife, what she's going through must be terrible and she could probably use all the support, financial and emotional that she can get. 2) Love for your brother, he's probably confused and hurting from the pain of a failed marriage that he's trying to fix with the band-aid solution of another woman.

Hmmm, he caused the failed marriage by kicking out his wife and installing his mistress. I don't think he's hurting too much, really. 3)

Love for the mistress, how terrible her self-esteem must be that she doesn't expect the men in her life to treat her with the respect she deserves. If she had that kind of self-respect she would have never gone for a married man. She was so desperate to be loved that she would accept it from anyone.

Actually, I feel more pity for the abandoned wife than for the mistress. The mistress is greedy and stealing something that is not hers to claim.

Even King David was not let off his adultery by God until he had fully repented.

).

[/quote]


#30

[quote="Iowander, post:1, topic:203881"]
My older brother recently kicked his wife out of his house, and his new girlfriend has moved in with him. Before this all happened, my brother came to me and told me what he was planning. It was really hard for me to do (because I've never in my life told my older brother what to do), but I told him to cut off his affair, get back in good with the Church (he hasn't been practicing in a long time), and to get his marriage into counseling. This had no effect. Since then, my wife and I have been on our own in opposition to my brother's choices. My parents never got along well with my brother's wife, and so they've basically been consenting to all of this. The day after my mother found out, she was investigating getting him an annulment (as if he even remotely cared about his standing in the Church).

Everyone else in my brother's life has met his new girlfriend, and everyone treats this as though there is nothing at all wrong with it - it's just the new normal. They go out to dinner with my parents, she joined his softball team, everyone is friends with her on facebook, etc. My brother hasn't tried to introduce us yet, but he's gotten clothing gifts for my kids which I know were made by her.

What am I supposed to do? Am I supposed to be civil to her? Am I just supposed to be ok with taking my kids to family Christmas with her there? I've read a lot on these forums about people contemplating attending weddings for couples like this, but I'm nowhere near that point.

[/quote]

Like she is -- a sinner who needs to see the light!!


#31

"I agree. As I'm learning how this process works, it makes me sick how easy it is for someone to unilaterally divorce a spouse with little consequence in terms of property or otherwise."

It is terribly sad what happens to some women and children in a divorce and the courts no longer give a hoot about adultry---unless your Elan and Tiger. This is why I feel it is imparative that a married woman is able to support herself and her children (Keep her day job) and NOT rely on a husband for financial support.

Honestly, I could not ever sit across a dinner table from your cheating brother and his mistress and be able to keep my dinner down.

"I would actually call your brothers wife and ask if there is anything you could do for her. Think how she must be feeling, in my opinion, that is where the real charity should be going."

The ex wife needs to be the focus and NOT your brother and his mistress. Do make every effort to get in touch with your sister-in-law and let her know that you will assist her in any way that you are able to. Imagine how desperate she must feel---emotionally and financially. It will help her immensly that you are there for her while sending a clear message to your cheating brother and his "lady friend".

I wish you all the best and I will pray for your sister in law that she finds much strength in leaning on Christ at this trying time.


#32

Oh goodness me what a hard situation!

I read nothing of this thread, only your initial question BTW.

First off, I would really have a talk with your parents telling them to have a talk with your brother and say he must work it out with his wife, also they should NOT ever entertain him in their home with his "mistress". This is simply not right. He, their son is committing adultery. This is SERIOUS. Hello?

I would do the same, as his brother. Do not be afraid. Pope John Paul said just this for us Christians to NOT BE AFRAID in this life of doing and standing for the right thing.

Your brother may shun you. Oh well. Scripture and the Lord warns us of this.....mother will turn against daughter, etc., Matt. 10: 35. Read it.

I would do this for now. You never what happen in the future. Take that as it comes.

God Bless. Do not be afraid,.:thumbsup: Encourage your bro to go back to his wife. Also I would tell the mistress to leave married men alone and to get lost......***


#33

[quote="PatriceA, post:6, topic:203881"]
Well I'd be careful in painting the new girlfriend as a horrible, scarlet wearing woman before you've even met her. I'm not condoning the situation, but you can only make it worse if you make her the target of all the ill feelings you have about the situation. You really can not predict the future, this girlfriend could very well end up as you future SIL. I know it happened to me. My brother too ended his marriage, moved his girlfriend in before divorce was final and they eventually did marry, and have been for almost 20 years.

You can hate how its all coming about, how your brother is acting, but I would advise against taking any hard stance against the girlfriend. At least until you've met her and have gotten to know her. I would refrain from making any judgements that she is just looking for his money, or will cheat on your brother, like a previous poster already suggested. If that proves to be true, then you give your brother all the support he needs.

[/quote]

I total disagree with what Patrice says. I would tell this mistress to get lost. If I were you.Tell her she's a dishonorable woman to take up with a married man. Oh I could spit in her face......this makes me furious how such a woman can be so non-chalant about cheating with a married man. makes me sick!


#34

[quote="Ailina, post:12, topic:203881"]
I'd be civil but not overly "warm and welcoming" to either of them. How was your brother able to kick his lawful wife out and not face legal repercussions? Is she now homeless?

What is wrong with the world today, where people turn a blind eye to this kind of behavior? By making it seem no big deal, we are all complicit in devaluing marriage in society. I think people should be making a bigger deal of it, quite frankly.

[/quote]

YES me too Ailina! What did your parents say when this brother of yours "kicked his wife out"? What did you say? Did you sit back and say/do nothing? Don;t people stand for anything anymore today or have any morals/values?

I am extremely pissed hearing this. It makes me ill. You OP need to do something/or say something at least and not be a weakling, and I am very disappointed in your parents' doing/saying nothing either. What is their problem?

My in-laws are the same way. They just have sat back saying/doing nothing ALL the times my husband was committing adultery with a stripper for God;s sake and he moved out of his wife's home and in with them. They enabled him, lettting him drive their new car, tooling around to strip joints, etc. They never ONCE encouraged him to get the hell off his thrills and go make it right with your wife.......SHAMEFUL! People like this are wolves in sheep clothing IMO.


#35

This is Not an occasion to act and be all charitable towards this "home-wrecker", which is exactly what she is.! This is a situation where family needs to act. say and do something, IMO. If they end up married one day, maybe things will be different, but I strongly believe Christians need to stop being such weenies and stick up for what is right. This is simply not right, Christian like, moral, or anything of the sort. This family is sick, weak, and needs to stand up for what is right and honorable. Maybe the parents could even pay for some marriage counseling for this couple, like a Retrouvaille retreat or something. Maybe YOU OP could suggest it!

Call the whore, tell her she's a home-wrecker, leave your brother alone, and then tell your brother to work it out with his wife, and tell your parents to do the same. It is time to stand up today for a change, and not to accept such immorality in our culture. If the salt loses its flavor, with what is it ever salted with again?????

Sorry, poster who claims "those without sin cast the first stone". There is a time and place for this, it is not in this case.

Now act brother. The cat does not have your tongue. Also encourage your dear brother to come back to his faith. Invite him to church with you this Sunday. TELL him he needs to get right with the Lord.:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


#36

[quote="Corinne3, post:34, topic:203881"]
YES me too Ailina! What did your parents say when this brother of yours "kicked his wife out"? What did you say? Did you sit back and say/do nothing? Don;t people stand for anything anymore today or have any morals/values?

[/quote]

To my parents' credit, they did tell him bluntly that he was not to kick his wife out of the house. But, he had some kind of schedule in his mind for when he wanted his girlfriend to move in, and he acted on it. I have told my parents that they should take a more forceful stand on the whole situation, and their attitude has been "well, he's an adult, and we can't tell him what to do." Also, they're of the opinion (despite what I've told them) that my brother and his wife's marriage isn't a real marriage anyway because it was performed by a justice of the peace. Thus, they think it's ok for him to get a divorce. His marriage may indeed not be valid, but I explained that's not for us to presume, and it he shouldn't be "dating" in the mean time.

I think I have said the things that need to be said to my brother, but it hasn't been convincing at this point in his life.

FWIW, back when they were planning their wedding, I suggested that they talk to a priest about getting their marriage blessed or whatever, and it kind of blew up into a big fight, and I've gotten a lot of grief for it. I attended the wedding, but my wife didn't. I have felt pretty ****** about this rift all along, and they have been offended that we didn't ask them to be the godparents of any of our kids, and so it only seemed to be getting worse. However, since the separation, my SIL has expressed regret to me that they didn't take my advice. So, hopefully, at least it'll help toward someone's conversion.


#37

The best you can do is what you've already done... spoken clearly that this is wrong. Now, since he has decided to move forward with this wrong, you should probably maintain some distance and when appropriate, from time to time, make it clear again and again that it is wrong (in the most loving way possible).

Here's an example in my fam. Most of my sibs are living with significant others (most have left the Church). I do not hide my beliefs .. there is no doubt I live differently. But at the same time, we are very polite and occasionally get together and enjoy each others' company. Our nieces and nephews are still too young to understand the complexity of it all but when they are, we will lovingly explain why we live differently and why we pray for their aunts.

Your situation is more complex b.c like you pointed out, your kids WILL be confused. I would acknowledge their confusion and sadness and tell them that a sad thing has happened and Aunt and Uncle are no longer together. :( I would reassure them that this is NOT going to happen w/ Mommy and Daddy and that you are praying for Aunt and Uncle. Then just be socially polite and speak up when you can - which maybe rarely or never. :(

Definitely acknowledge the sadness and confusion w/ your kids tho... my parent are divorced and I hated how people acted like divorce was no big deal to us kids. We were sad and we needed affirmation that it is okay feel sad about something that IS wrong and sad and confusing. Kids aren't dumb... they know when something isn't right.


#38

Interesting thread. AdriannaJean said it well about showing compassion to people. Showing compassion and being civil to people does not condone their sin – especially if you are the conduit to lead them back to Christ!

Lowander, it seems that you are concerned about the impact of the relationship on your kids – and rightfully so. As parents, we have an obligation t provide our children with knowledge of right and wrong so that they may evaluate situations for what they are. It drives me nuts when people say “you have no right to judge” because we do have the moral obligation to evaluate situations and avoid those that cause scandal or provide possibility for sin. People sometimes get judging and evaluating confused. I’m not advocating labeling your brother or the woman. But it is proper to let children know the demands of a Sacramental, Catholic marriage. And, to also let children know that all people make bad choices at some point and that their uncle has made a bad choice.

I can relate from personal experience. I am a former spouse – the one my (now ex)husband left to pursue his mistress. It’s difficult to be around them when they come to pick up our child for visitation and our child has expressed her interest in spending time alone with her father because at 6, she is old enough to know that what her dad chose to do destroyed our family and violated God’s law. She prays for her dad and the gf every day – God bless her little heart! Maybe her example will be enough for them to reclaim the faith!


#39

This is such a horrible situation. I was the once the wife who got left by her husband only to have his parents welcome the mistriss into their life with open arms just days after i moved out because they 'always knew their son didn't love me'. Turns out the mistriss they were so fond of is a drug abusing bi sexual who has their perfect son hooked too. You should let your brother know how much the situation bothers you, let him know you'd rather not be around her until the divorce is final and they get married. Don't condone his behavior and let him not have the natural consequences of what he has done and what he is doing. Stay strong and pray for his soul.


#40

Well, I'm a latecomer to this thread, but my opinion is this: Treat your brother's "mistress" as you would treat any other human being -- that is, with love and respect. If I do not believe in being a "mistress," then I would not be one. If my own brother had a "mistress," I would hope I would treat her with the same regard as I would any human being.
Love, Alisa


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