How do you know that Jesus is God?


#1

Do you know Jesus or just about Him? How do you know “The Ancient Canon of the Scriptures”, the Christian Bible, is the Word of God? Why do you believe Jesus is God? Is it because of some people in a church, a friend, or maybe your parents? Why do you believe?

Knowing Jesus in a very personal way, to know from Him, that He is God, and keeping
your eyes on Him are becoming of greater importance every day. The world (Satan) is deluding Christian people more and more.


#2

I agree with you, knowing Christ is important. I believe in God, and Jesus in particular, because he called be back from the very gates of hell. (a story for another thread if enough PM to hear it). Christ established his Church, the Church wrote and codified the Canon, and that is the Canon I accept.

Yes Satan is deluding more Christians every day. His greatest strike to date splintered the Church. Our adversary seduced a monk to do his bidding and speak the venomous words of the Devil. Now, because of that one monk, Christ’s Church which was to be one is now splintered into thousands of denominations with hundreds more forming every day. And if you were wondering who caused this grevious wound to the body of Christ, it was Martin Luther.

“We define “heretics” as those who have been previously banned from the church and also those later anathematised by ourselves: and in addition those who claim to confess a faith that is sound, but who have seceded and hold assemblies in rivalry with the bishops who are in communion with us.” - from the sixth canon of the first Council of Constantinople (381)


#3

[quote=But for Grace]I agree with you, knowing Christ is important. I believe in God, and Jesus in particular, because he called be back from the very gates of hell. (a story for another thread if enough PM to hear it). Christ established his Church, the Church wrote and codified the Canon, and that is the Canon I accept.

Yes Satan is deluding more Christians every day. His greatest strike to date splintered the Church. Our adversary seduced a monk to do his bidding and speak the venomous words of the Devil. Now, because of that one monk, Christ’s Church which was to be one is now splintered into thousands of denominations with hundreds more forming every day. And if you were wondering who caused this grevious wound to the body of Christ, it was Martin Luther.

“We define “heretics” as those who have been previously banned from the church and also those later anathematised by ourselves: and in addition those who claim to confess a faith that is sound, but who have seceded and hold assemblies in rivalry with the bishops who are in communion with us.” - from the sixth canon of the first Council of Constantinople (381)
[/quote]

You didn’t answer my questions, is it because I didn’t make them clear enough? I will try again. You believe Jesus is God and so do I, but my question is how do you know He is God? You must believe “The Ancient Canon of the Scriptures”, the Christian Bible, is the Word of God. How do you know that is true? The Moslems think their Bible is from God, and Jesus is just a prophet. You seem to believe the Catholic Church is the one true Church, how do you know?


#4

To prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt that Jesus is God is impossible. It is a matter of faith to believe in Jesus’ Divinity just as it is also impossible to “prove” the existence of God. However, both are not, in my opinion, unreasonable to believe.


#5

[quote=TOME]To prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt that Jesus is God is impossible. It is a matter of faith to believe in Jesus’ Divinity just as it is also impossible to “prove” the existence of God. However, both are not, in my opinion, unreasonable to believe.
[/quote]

I agree no one can prove to someone else that Jesus is God, but if a person has a personal relationship with Jesus than Jesus will teach that person all about Himself.

I know Jesus is God and the Bible is His word, because He has personally told me.


#6

The Church is very skeptical of private revelation.

That your private revelation is true doesn’t change the fact that it is private.

The entirety of scripture professes and foretells the divinity of Christ. Early Jewish converts were convinced by Psalm 110 which is considered a strong claim for the divinity of Christ because David refers to his own descendent as My Lord.

If private revelation were allowed in free-for-all fashion, the Church would scandalize itself by splintering into thousands and thousands of sects, like what happened to the reformation sects.


#7

[quote=adnauseum]The Church is very skeptical of private revelation.

That your private revelation is true doesn’t change the fact that it is private.

The entirety of scripture professes and foretells the divinity of Christ. Early Jewish converts were convinced by Psalm 110 which is considered a strong claim for the divinity of Christ because David refers to his own descendent as My Lord.

If private revelation were allowed in free-for-all fashion, the Church would scandalize itself by splintering into thousands and thousands of sects, like what happened to the reformation sects.
[/quote]

Right on. Private revelations are gifts, not prerequisites to salvation.The reason they are only binding on the one receiving it, is that there is no way to rule out the possibility of self-delusion.

Scott


#8

[quote=Robert Heibel]I agree no one can prove to someone else that Jesus is God, but if a person has a personal relationship with Jesus than Jesus will teach that person all about Himself.

I know Jesus is God and the Bible is His word, because He has personally told me.
[/quote]

You mean He actually spoke to you?

When you ask about knowing, there is an important semantic distincition to be made. You cannot “know,” not in this vale of tears. If you “knew,” there would be absolutely no need to have faith. Abraham never “knew” how it was going to work out, answering what he believed to be the call of God, but he pick up one foot and set it down in front of the other and kept repeating the process until he had walked out of Ur and become the father of millions. That’s faith, not knowledge. We don’t know, but we pick up our cross and follow Christ in faith.


#9

[quote=adnauseum]The Church is very skeptical of private revelation.

That your private revelation is true doesn’t change the fact that it is private.

The entirety of scripture professes and foretells the divinity of Christ. Early Jewish converts were convinced by Psalm 110 which is considered a strong claim for the divinity of Christ because David refers to his own descendent as My Lord.

If private revelation were allowed in free-for-all fashion, the Church would scandalize itself by splintering into thousands and thousands of sects, like what happened to the reformation sects.
[/quote]

(Acts 4:32) “**The whole group of believers was ** **united, heart and ** soul; no one claimed for his own use anything that he had, as everything they owned was held in common.

(Hebrews 8:11) “There will be no further need for neighbour to try to teach neighbour, or brother to say to brother,’ Learn to know the Lord’. No, they will all know me, the least no less than the greatest,”

Jesus (Holy Spirit) isn’t going to teach us different if we let Jesus teach us we will all be united, heart and soul.


#10

As the Eye Needs Light

To see visible objects we need the eyes of the body.
To understand intelligible truths we need the eyes of the mind.
To have the vision of divine things we cannot do without faith.
What the eye is for the body, faith is for reason.
To be more precise; the eye needs the light which puts it in contact with visible things; reason needs faith to show it divine things.
Theodoret
The Cure of Pagan Diseases


#11

[quote=JKirkLVNV]You mean He actually spoke to you?

When you ask about knowing, there is an important semantic distincition to be made. You cannot “know,” not in this vale of tears. If you “knew,” there would be absolutely no need to have faith. Abraham never “knew” how it was going to work out, answering what he believed to be the call of God, but he pick up one foot and set it down in front of the other and kept repeating the process until he had walked out of Ur and become the father of millions. That’s faith, not knowledge. We don’t know, but we pick up our cross and follow Christ in faith.
[/quote]

Yes, Jesus has spoken to me, and still speaks to me often. When I accepted Jesus call to His ministry, I asked Him what seminary to attend and Jesus told me “No! Don’t read about me I’ll teach you about me”

Jesus has been teaching me for over thirty years now, and everything I have been taught is Scriptural, and how to live a Christian life in love.

Jesus is my Lord and my God, and I love Him by obeying His Word.

Did Paul have faith? He heard Jesus.


#12

Robert - No disrespect, but how do you know that your revelation was from Jesus and not another source? It is the same with many of us, how do we know that the Church is the revelation of God. It all boils down to faith and trust. There are many instances of men being decieved by their own opinions, Martin Luther, Arius, Joseph Smith, etc. Especially in the case of the Joseph Smith, he relied on his open “prophetic” visions and ended up leading many into error.

Christians thus have good reason to be warry of those who come claiming that God has spoken to them. Private revalation is good when it builds up the individual, but for the Church to properly function, it is necessary for some sence of order to be maintained, without this we would wander aimlessly.

If you truly loved God you would obey his Church, which is his visible and spiritual body. It is only the Catholic Church that has an authoritive voice for Christians, it is the Catholic Church that wrote, codified, and preserved the scriptures. It is the Catholic Church which has retained the Apostalic Office in its Magesterium. Anyone who rejects the Body of Christ rejects Christ, hence it is said, there is no salvation outside of the Church.


#13

Robert- perhaps you seek a more “apologetic” explination of why we belive Jesus is God. I found a very good explination on catholic.com in one of the answer sections (I can’t quite remember which one). It basically said the following- you look at the new testement and take it has historically accurate; that is, there was a man named Jesus, he claimed to be the son of God, he had followers, etc. Now, he was either the son of God, or he was a complete lunatic. There is absolutely no middle ground. If he was a lunitic, then he didn’t rise from the dead; in other words, his disciples created this elabortae hoax, snuck his body out of the tomb, and then claimed “Look, he’s gone! he has risen from the dead!”. Thats a fair argument. However, here’s the thing; All of his 12 disciples (except John) went on to die horrible, horrible deaths. They were all martyred for their faith, even St. Paul who was beheaded. People don’t die terrible deaths just for a hoax. These men all believed 110% that Jesus was the son of God, devoted their lives to him, and were killed for it. In fact, I believe the first 12 popes were killed as well. To me, this gives strong evidence supporting the fact that Jesus rose from the dead. A lot of people gave good, personal reasons that they believe, and thats fine. As I said above, this is the exact argument given on catholic.com, I just can’t remember where I saw it. Hope that helps to answer your question!


#14

[quote=But for Grace]Robert - No disrespect, but how do you know that your revelation was from Jesus and not another source? It is the same with many of us, how do we know that the Church is the revelation of God. It all boils down to faith and trust. There are many instances of men being decieved by their own opinions, Martin Luther, Arius, Joseph Smith, etc. Especially in the case of the Joseph Smith, he relied on his open “prophetic” visions and ended up leading many into error.

Christians thus have good reason to be warry of those who come claiming that God has spoken to them. Private revalation is good when it builds up the individual, but for the Church to properly function, it is necessary for some sence of order to be maintained, without this we would wander aimlessly.

If you truly loved God you would obey his Church, which is his visible and spiritual body. It is only the Catholic Church that has an authoritive voice for Christians, it is the Catholic Church that wrote, codified, and preserved the scriptures. It is the Catholic Church which has retained the Apostalic Office in its Magesterium. Anyone who rejects the Body of Christ rejects Christ, hence it is said, there is no salvation outside of the Church.
[/quote]

You ask me how I know if it was Jesus or someone else, I assume you mean Satan, who has been talking to me. Jesus told us in Scripture, that His people would hear

His voice and follow no other. For over thirty years now I have been following Jesus. He has taught me to love, and I have heard His Word and I live His Word.

Jesus hasn’t taught me to do less than what the Christian Church is teaching, but has been teaching me to live the Word more fully.

I have been baptized in the Holy Spirit and have been given some gifts of the Holy Spirit.

I was chosen to give a word to God’s Church. Why I don’t know, but Jesus once told my wife and me that He didn’t make perfect people, but He chose to use us anyway. Jesus also told me He is God and the Bible is His Word.

I have had long talks with two Roman Catholic Bishops and talked with two others. One bishop sent me to his spiritual adviser. His adviser told me one of my letters was God’s challenge to His Church. Another bishop sent me to a group of people starting a Christian community. The two with whom I spent the most time with told me to keep doing what Jesus told me to do and asked how they could help me.

Jesus personally told me He is God and that the Bible is His Word.

Jesus is my Lord and my God.


#15

Robert - if this is so, and you really do have two bishops backing your story, then why not just come out with what you have to say?

Let us hear what you were told to tell us. Just remember that many Catholics are hesitant about accepting this type of things, leaving personal judgement until it has been deemed valid by the proper superiors. The Catholic Church has a deep history of Christian Mystics (St. John of the Cross, St. Teresa of Avila, St. Catherine, St. Faustina, etc.) and of aparitions (mainly of Mary). This sort of other worldly experience is nothing new to us, but we do withold judgement until proper judgement is rendered, so as to cause no harm to come to the faith of others.

If it is to long to simply post, then e-mail it to me. (honestly it is the statement about two bishops accepting it that intreques me)

PAX


#16

[quote=But for Grace]Robert - if this is so, and you really do have two bishops backing your story, then why not just come out with what you have to say?

Let us hear what you were told to tell us. Just remember that many Catholics are hesitant about accepting this type of things, leaving personal judgement until it has been deemed valid by the proper superiors. The Catholic Church has a deep history of Christian Mystics (St. John of the Cross, St. Teresa of Avila, St. Catherine, St. Faustina, etc.) and of aparitions (mainly of Mary). This sort of other worldly experience is nothing new to us, but we do withold judgement until proper judgement is rendered, so as to cause no harm to come to the faith of others.

If it is to long to simply post, then e-mail it to me. (honestly it is the statement about two bishops accepting it that intreques me)

PAX
[/quote]

I am a man, who grew up a Catholic. Went to Catholic schools and from the age of twenty-five to forty went to Mass and Communion almost every day. At age thirty-eight Jesus started calling me to His ministry, using many signs and even miracles. I was married at the time He started calling me, and I already had two children. Being a minister, to me, meant being a Catholic priest. So I would say yes to God, but instead of asking Jesus what He wanted me to do, I would assume what He had for me to do. This went on for two years, and then my third child was born blind. We already had a child with Downs Syndrome. When the baby came down with an eye infection and our doctor wouldn’t see her until the first of the week, my wife just broke down in a very heart felt prayer, and asked God to heal her. She was healed, both the eye infection and her eyesight. Our baby is now twenty-eight and has twenty/fifteen vision, where the rest of us need glasses. Soon after this Jesus let me know that I was to give Him an answer, I said yes. But I wanted to know for sure, if it was really Jesus who was calling me. I asked to be given the gift of tongues that night. I spoke in tongues for the first time that night. Next I asked Jesus to let me know what seminary I was to attend? He told me “NO! Don’t read about me I’ll teach you about Me.”

I called then auxiliary Bishop [REMOVED] of [REMOVED]. We talked on the phone for a long time. He told me about a group who were starting a community, which was led by a Catholic priest, can’t remember his name right now, but anyway my family and I became part of that community. That was great until at a prayer meeting where the priest was giving a talk, the Holy Spirit told me to get up and tell everyone that no matter who tells them anything about God be it a bishop, priest or anyone they were to ask Jesus if it was right or wrong. The priest got so angry I was scared he was going to physically attack me. The priest told me to leave the meeting. After the meeting he came over to talk with my wife and me. He told me I could never again talk at one of his meetings, so my wife asked him if he thought Jesus would lead us away from God? He said yes. Right after that Jesus told us to sell what we had and move to [REMOVED]. We left [REMOVED] with two hundred and forty dollars. We were driving my wife’s old 1964 Valliant packed with camping gear, three babies and a dog. We lived in a tent for five weeks.

After living in [REMOVED] for a few months I got in touch with the Catholic Bishop and after we talked for a while he thought I should get in touch with the dioceses’ spiritual director whose name was [REMOVED]. After a long visit and many question he asked to read one of my letters. He then said that what I wrote was God’s challenge to His Church, and had me make up a very formal letter to be presented to the Bishop. I was never contacted again so when a new Bishop [REMOVED] came to [REMOVED] I called him and was invited to his residence where we talked for a long time. He told me that his job was to administer the Church that I should go and do what God had for me to do. I asked if he would let me talk in the churches of his diocese he said yes, but that would be up to the pastors. I remember going to one church and explaining what I wanted to do. The pastors said he would have to talk to the Bishop first. When I came back the pastor told me the Bishop said no. I called the Bishop and he told me he never told anyone I couldn’t talk in his church. After [REMOVED] left, he became [REMOVED], [REMOVED] became the Bishop of [REMOVED], so right away I asked to see him and was invited to his residence and again our talk lasted a long time, but I think my story scarred him, so at the end he ask what he could do to help me. I didn’t think he had any idea what was happing and was just patronizing me. I told him to ask Jesus what he should do for me and left.


#17

[quote=Robert Heibel]… Why do you believe Jesus is God?

.
[/quote]

Why do I believe Jesus is God? Umm; because the Jehovah Witnesses say he is not.:smiley: :smiley:


#18

okay, I am intrigued. So what is the message that you are to deliver? Please do not spare the details, they help our understanding.


#19

Notice:

This thread is now closed. Thanks to all who participated in the discussion.


DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.