How does Jesus feel...?


#1

I know you guys have read my concerns for the CC when they are attacked by anti-Catholics perhaps? My question is and I don’t know if anyone here can answer it:

What/how did Jesus think and feel when the Reformation began in the 1500s? How does He feel with all these different denominations and all? If He had His ONE Church, I wonder what He thought about different kinds of churches separating from the CC?


#2

It is pretty hard for anyone to say how Jesus felt as we are just humans of course. But you can see the result of the idea, of the Holy Spirit leading the protestants reformers to all truth.

This is how I see it, they wanted their own interpretation, God gave it to them. We shouldn’t judge people, as many, many of our separated bretheren truly love God and believe they are doing what is right, when they start a new Church.
On the other hand…
I can’t help but think about the Tower of Babel as a parallel in this case. That is the closest I can get to thinking what Jesus feels when thinking about this subject.

Jesus prayed that we would be one, as He and the Father are one. I really believe all these denominations can qualify as going against that. There really is no invisible unity.


#3

[quote=Paris Blues]I know you guys have read my concerns for the CC when they are attacked by anti-Catholics perhaps? My question is and I don’t know if anyone here can answer it:

What/how did Jesus think and feel when the Reformation began in the 1500s? How does He feel with all these different denominations and all? If He had His ONE Church, I wonder what He thought about different kinds of churches separating from the CC?
[/quote]

I would imagine He definitely did not like it, especially the following rejection of the Eucharist. He wants us to know the truth, not to believe falsehoods about Him.

I always find it interesting that just as so many left the Church during the Reformation, Our Lady appeared in Mexico and quickly replaced them with new converts in Latin America.


#4

Also remember that the Church is the body of Christ on earth. What if parts of your body suddenly decided they no longer wanted to be part of you?
I don’t imagine that would feel good. It would also weaken the rest of you terribly. If your fingers decided to leave, for instance, you would be unable to type to even ask your question – or you’d have to take a lot of extra time finding a way to adapt and do it differently. Typing would no longer be ideal for you in its intended form.


#5

Sorrowful.


#6

If I had to guess It would be somewhere between Matt16:18 and the Cross.


#7

i can’t read God’s mind, but I bet He felt terribly sad during the reformation.


#8

I don’t think He feels sad, because (a) He knows how it all ends up (b) He has told us that some will not believe and be saved © He knows all, and has from before the beginning of time.

I believe Jesus is sad about lost souls, but He is not sad about the events, as He has known them for a very long time.


#9

[quote=scylla]This is how I see it, they wanted their own interpretation, God gave it to them. We shouldn’t judge people, as many, many of our separated bretheren truly love God and believe they are doing what is right, when they start a new Church.
[/quote]

this makes me think of an allegory i read in one of Pat Madrids surprised by truth books:
in the old tesiment, the people werent satisfied with manna… the were mad at God, and wanted more, so He gave them more, soo much more that they eventually started dying off from the plague produced… then, God as their king wasnt good enough… the wanted a human king… so God game them that too, lots of em, and lo and behold what happend, that crashed and burned too, leaving them in exile… now lets flip to about 1500AD, the people arent satisfied, again, with what God gave them, the CC… they want more, so God gave them more… and now, looky looky, a good 40-60 thousand denominations… hmmm i see a pattern here… im just wandering how long till all of this will come crashing down on all of the protestants who fail to see the beauty of the truth Christ himself instituted… i can only pray that when that day comes, they all come home, rather than run like rebelious teenagers…
God Bless
James


#10

Hello Paris Blues,

We do not have scripture to tell us how Jesus felt during the Protestant reformation in the 1500. We do have scripture to tell us how God felt when Korah wanted to schism from the Israelite Church.

**NAB NUMBERS 16 **

Korah, son of Izhar, son of Kohath, son of Levi [and Dathan and Abiram, sons of Eliab, son of Pallu, son of Reuben] took two hundred and fifty Israelites who were leaders in the community, members of the council and men of note. They stood before Moses and Aaron, to whom they said, “Enough from you! The whole community, all of them, are holy; the LORD is in their midst. Why then should you set yourselves over the LORD’s congregation?”

When Moses heard this, he fell prostrate. Then he said to Korah and to all his band, “May the LORD make known tomorrow morning who belongs to him and who is the holy one and whom he will have draw near to him! Whom he chooses, he will have draw near him. Do this: take your censers [Korah and all his band] and put fire in them and place incense in them before the LORD tomorrow. He whom the LORD then chooses is the holy one. Enough from you Levites!”…

…Moses said to Korah, “You and all your band shall appear before the LORD tomorrow–you and they and Aaron too. Then each of your two hundred and fifty followers shall take his own censer, put incense in it, and offer it to the LORD; and you and Aaron, each with his own censer, shall do the same.” So then all took their censers, and laying incense on the fire they had put in them, they took their stand by the entrance of the meeting tent, the glory of the LORD appeared to the entire community, and the LORD said to Moses and Aaron, “Stand apart from this band, that I may consume them at once.” But they fell prostrate and cried out, “O God, God of the spirits of all mankind, will one man’s sin make you angry with the whole community?” The LORD answered Moses, “Speak to the community and tell them: Withdraw from the space around the Dwelling” [of Korah, Dathan and Abiram]…

…Moses said, “This is how you shall know that it was the LORD who sent me to do all that I have done, and that it was not I who planned it: if these men die an ordinary death, merely suffering the fate common to all mankind, then it was not the LORD who sent me. But if the LORD does something entirely new, and the ground opens its mouth and swallows them alive down into the nether world, with all belonging to them, then you will know that these men have defied the LORD.” No sooner had he finished saying all this than the ground beneath them split open, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed them and their families [and all of Korah’s men] and all their possessions. They went down alive to the nether world with all belonging to them; the earth closed over them, and they perished from the community. But all the Israelites near them fled at their shrieks, saying, “The earth might swallow us too!”

NAB JUDE 1:10

[indent]They have abandoned themselves to Balaam’s error for pay, and like Korah they perish in rebellion. These men are blotches on your Christian banquets. They are wild ocean waves, splashing their shameless deeds abroad like foam, or shooting stars for whom the thick gloom of darkness has been reserved forever. [/indent]NUMBERS 16 continued:

**Punishment of Korah. **So they withdrew from the space around the Dwelling [of Korah, Dathan and Abiram]. And fire from the LORD came forth which consumed the two hundred and fifty men who were offering the incense.

The LORD said to Moses, “Tell Eleazar, son of Aaron the priest, to remove the censers from the embers; and scatter the fire some distance away, for these sinners have consecrated the censers at the cost of their lives. Have them hammered into plates to cover the altar, because in being presented before the LORD they have become sacred. In this way they shall serve as a sign to the Israelites.” So Eleazar the priest had the bronze censers of those burned during the offering hammered into a covering for the altar, in keeping with the orders which the LORD had given him through Moses. This cover was to be a reminder to the Israelites that no layman, no one who was not a descendant of Aaron, should approach the altar to offer incense before the LORD, lest he meet the fate of Korah and his band.

Peace in Christ,

Steven Merten
www.ILOVEYOUGOD.com


#11

You know, I’m not a big fan of anti-Catholicism, especially out of ignorance, BUT, have you all noticed that God didn’t subvert the truth during the Reformation & following completely? I mean, YES!, fundemental truths are denied, BUT, the old timers up till the non-denoms of today DO believe in The Virgin Birth, The Crucifixion, and The Resurrection. They belive that they are sinners. They read their Bibles (albeit, probably not the best translations…BUT, they aren’t bad & completely perverse). AND, they believe the same way we do for the most part. They are there with us during abortion rallies, they were heard during the Schiavo situation, & because of us & them working together, we re-elected a President and made a movie # 1 at the Box Office. …I kinda think, and, maybe I’m just being hopeful here, but, I would LIKE to think, that God, in His wisdom, knows what He’s doing & that Protestants WILL come back to His Church. There’s been more of an open dialogue than ever. I personally liked, when, Oh! I don’t remember WHICH televangelist, I THINK it was Billy Graham, I was thumbing through a book of his in a Protestant book store & something about Purgatory was mentioned and he simply stated something like, “Some Christians believe there will be a need for purgation before one enters the Kingdom of God. I don’t believe this to be the case.” And that was it. I was all like, :eek: Wow. He didn’t go on to say WHY HE believed that and how WRONG those Christians are, it just ended there. AND, if you note, he does call us Christians. Not ALL Protestants still afford us this. They are obviously wrong and need prayer, but, neither side is now looking at the other thinking, “They are going to burn in hell.”…and, well, call me deliriously over zealous, but, I think that’s progress.


#12

[quote=awalt]I don’t think He feels sad, because (a) He knows how it all ends up (b) He has told us that some will not believe and be saved © He knows all, and has from before the beginning of time.

I believe Jesus is sad about lost souls, but He is not sad about the events, as He has known them for a very long time.
[/quote]

Hi awalt,
I used to think in this vane,but I kep finding scripture saying how much God grieved, weeped bitterly, agonised over us etc etc. It started me thinking. This is the direction of my thoughts. We are made in His image. That is why we feel sad, weep, have tears and are grieved etc. We shouldnt be surprised that God mourns but that we do. How blessed we are that He who is love has made us in His image. I guess any one who can love as deeply as He can and does , weeps bitterly over us as well. We do have free choice and He must have hope, as we have hope. See Jeremiah 13:17 God and Luke 19:41 Of Jesus " Now as He drew near, He saw the city and wept over it"


#13

While I do not believe Christ is too happy with divisions in His Church, I believe He is equally unhappy with those who are arrogant (including many Catholics) in insisting that we have a monopoly on the truth. Of course we will always have differing opinions on a variety of issues, but to say that Protestants are heretics is in my opinion the height of arrogance. I believe we should attempt to understand and respect their beliefs and not be so hung up on whether they accept our Catholic doctrines or live our way of life.

Blessings,

John


#14

You asked how did Jesus feel when Luther and the others left His Church and started new Churches.

Well dont you think Jesus felt just like God did when the great angel that God created named Lucifer rebeled and tried to take over the universe? What did God do with the rebelling Lucifer? He threw him out of heaven.

So you would have sound reasons to say that the protesters of the 1500s were thrown out too.


#15

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