I am a Conservative Catholic


#1

I am against ordination of women.

I am against abortion.

I am against premarital sex.

I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason.

I am against an agressive war, but -reluctantly- for a defensive one, or whatever the Church decides.

I am against the marriage of priests.

I am against homosexuality, and of course, child-molestation.

I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.

I am for Tradition (Church Tradition, Fathers of the Church, that is).

Marriage is only between a Man and a Woman.

My loyalty for the Catholic Church is unshakable.

I hope future Holy Fathers will be like Jean-Paul II and Benedict XVI.


#2

Hello,
I am also.

In Christ,
selvaraj


#3

Is anyone “for” anything :slight_smile: ?

The amount of damage done by people for whom Christianity means disapproval of anything enjoyable or good or kind or not explicitly Churchy, is terrible to think of :frowning:

Kill-joy Catholicism converts no one: why lead a joyless monochrome life when you can live in full colour ? If Jesus had gone round perpetually girning at the world, He would never have attracted anyone. In fact, He explicitly forbids long-faced piety: He has a lot to say in commendation of joy - too often, his servants lack joy: it’s the very thing that makes Christians indistinguishable from worldlings. :slight_smile:

To quote the title of a book from about 60 years ago - “Saints are not Sad” :slight_smile: ##


#4

I hate to ruffle any feathers here, but these two positions are irreconcilable. The Church Fathers and Doctors never taught that the Church could decide which wars were just or unjust. Furthermore, they never claimed that purely defensive wars were the only just form of warfare.


#5

[quote=USCatholic]I am against ordination of women.

I am against abortion.

I am against premarital sex.

I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason.

I am against an agressive war, but -reluctantly- for a defensive one, or whatever the Church decides.

I am against the marriage of priests.

I am against homosexuality, and of course, child-molestation.

I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.

I am for Tradition (Church Tradition, Fathers of the Church, that is).

Marriage is only between a Man and a Woman.

My loyalty for the Catholic Church is unshakable.

I hope future Holy Fathers will be like Jean-Paul II and Benedict XVI.
[/quote]

Well 1,2,3,4,9 & 10 should be on any Catholic’s list.

5 - There have been saints against any violence whatsover. Certainly,
In Catholic tradition war can only be justified as a last resort, when all other means of resolution have been exhausted. To go to war is to admit failure of the complex machinery
of negotiation. As Pope John Paul II has said: “War is the most barbarous and least effective way of resolving differences between nations”.
scmo.org/_titles/view.asp?id=129

6- is a western church discipline and is open for debate. Good reasons for and against.

7- in respect of the against homosexuality, it is well worth bearing in mins the following to avoid any misunderstanding that Catholic’s ‘hate’ homosexuals

**2358 **The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

**2359 **Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.

scborromeo.org/ccc/ccc_toc.htm

8- it depends what you mean by progressive. Progressive, by definition,
6 entries found for progressive.

 **pro·gres·sive**   [cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/JPG/pron.jpg]("https://secure.reference.com/premium/login.html?rd=2&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdictionary.reference.com%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dprogressive")  ( P )  [**Pronunciation Key**]("http://dictionary.reference.com/help/ahd4/pronkey.html")  (prhttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/GIF/schwa.gif-grhttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/GIF/ebreve.gifshttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/GIF/prime.gifhttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/GIF/ibreve.gifv)

adj. [list=1]
*]Moving forward; advancing.
*] Proceeding in steps; continuing steadily by increments: progressive change.
*]Promoting or favoring progress toward better conditions or new policies, ideas, or methods: a progressive politician; progressive business leadership.
[/list] dictionary.reference.com/search?q=progressive

So things that move the Church forward positively in terms of spreading the gospel or improving the condition of the world etc are good.

I assume you are refering to ‘progressive’ ideas such as allowing same sex marriages, which in the Church’s eye’s are not progressive at all but regressive.

9 - We could all do worse than heed the Church Fathers.

12 - Well different popes have different strengths for different times though holiness is always essential and on that count if future popes have holiness in the same measure we will be in good hands.


#6

[quote=USCatholic]I am against ordination of women.

I am against abortion.

I am against premarital sex.

I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason.

I am against an agressive war, but -reluctantly- for a defensive one, or whatever the Church decides.

I am against the marriage of priests.

I am against homosexuality, and of course, child-molestation.

I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.

I am for Tradition (Church Tradition, Fathers of the Church, that is).

Marriage is only between a Man and a Woman.

My loyalty for the Catholic Church is unshakable.

I hope future Holy Fathers will be like Jean-Paul II and Benedict XVI.
[/quote]

In my opinion ‘I am against…’ statements are agressive and lead to tension when dealing with people who we wish the Lord to convert.

Far better to state what you are for and still keep your statements the same. For example if your list was written with ‘I am for…’ statements, it would read:

***I am for a male only celibate Priesthood as established by Christ.

I am for Chastity according to ones state in life

I am for Life

I am for Peace

I am for Catholic Orthodoxy and Tradition

I am for the sacrament of Marriage as laid down by the precepts of the Catholic Church***


#7

USCatholic,

You wrote: " I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason."

For your information, the Catholic Church is not against all stem cell research—adult stem cell research (such as from nasal linings, etc) and research on stem cells from cord blood is perfectly in accord with Catholic teaching. Don’t make the mistake of lumping all research together—know why the Church holds the positions she does. Embryonic stem cell research is against Church teaching because it destroys life.

You wrote: “I am against the marriage of priests.”

So am I—but only within the Roman Rite, of which I am a member. If Byzantine Catholics or other Eastern Catholic rites wish to have a married clergy, I think that is fine: it’s a discipline, not a doctrine. I happen to think that the theological reasons for having a celibate priesthood are very good, and so I support the Roman rite’s tradition in this, but I see no reason to impose it on other rites against their wishes.

You wrote: “I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.”

Well, words like “progressive” and “liberal” only are meaningful in reference to their context, which is subject to change. A “progressive” in one era can be “conservative” in the next, though the principles one is standing upon are the same. It would be far far better to describe yourself as “orthodox” or “faithful to the Magisterium”, which always mean the same thing regardless of what century you happen to live in.

Others have noted other problematic aspects of your manifesto. Maybe you should brush up on your Catechism, particularly in the areas of just war and on homosexuality (I’m hopeful that you meant to say that you are against homosexual acts; those who suffer from homosexual tendencies are to be treated with compassion, and should be encouraged to live chaste lives just as all of us should be encouraged to live chaste lives).

Oh—and it’s “John Paul II”, not “Jean-Paul II”.


#8

[quote=USCatholic]I am against ordination of women.

I am against abortion.

I am against premarital sex.
et cetera
.
[/quote]

what you are is a Catholic
conservative, liberal, orthodox, heterodox doesn’t enter into. either you believe, hold and profess all that the Catholic church teaches, and are initiated into the Church through the sacraments, in which case you are a Catholic. or you dissent and deny essential Church teaching, or live in ways that directly, publicly reject those teachings, in which case you are no longer a Catholic, having chosen excommunication for yourself.


#9

[quote=Fergal]***I am for a male only celibate Priesthood as established by Christ.

I am for Chastity according to ones state in life

I am for Life

I am for Peace

I am for Catholic Orthodoxy and Tradition

I am for the sacrament of Marriage as laid down by the precepts of the Catholic Church***
[/quote]

Now THIS I can agree with. :thumbsup:


#10

[quote=Sherlock]USCatholic,

You wrote: " I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason."

For your information, the Catholic Church is not against all stem cell research—adult stem cell research (such as from nasal linings, etc) and research on stem cells from cord blood is perfectly in accord with Catholic teaching. Don’t make the mistake of lumping all research together—know why the Church holds the positions she does. Embryonic stem cell research is against Church teaching because it destroys life.

You wrote: “I am against the marriage of priests.”

So am I—but only within the Roman Rite, of which I am a member. If Byzantine Catholics or other Eastern Catholic rites wish to have a married clergy, I think that is fine: it’s a discipline, not a doctrine. I happen to think that the theological reasons for having a celibate priesthood are very good, and so I support the Roman rite’s tradition in this, but I see no reason to impose it on other rites against their wishes. …

You wrote: “I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.”

Others have noted other problematic aspects of your manifesto. Maybe you should brush up on your Catechism,…Oh—and it’s “John Paul II”, not “Jean-Paul II”.
[/quote]

Thank you for this post.

As a cancer survivor, I would also like to point out that stem cells have been used when they take the stem cell from the cancer patient, clean them up and then re introduce them to the patient, often along with meds.

Nothing wrong with umbilica cord stem cells from new born infants. I understand that these are comparable to those of the unborn.

It is the agenda of Pro Abortion folks to focus in on embrionic stem cells without addressing these others. Please, Catholics, don’t follow them into this rhetoric.


#11

[quote=USCatholic]I am against ordination of women.

I am against abortion.

I am against premarital sex.

I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason.

I am against an agressive war, but -reluctantly- for a defensive one, or whatever the Church decides.

I am against the marriage of priests.

I am against homosexuality, and of course, child-molestation.

I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.

I am for Tradition (Church Tradition, Fathers of the Church, that is).

Marriage is only between a Man and a Woman.

My loyalty for the Catholic Church is unshakable.

I hope future Holy Fathers will be like Jean-Paul II and Benedict XVI.
[/quote]

How horrible these “conservative” beliefs are!


#12

Robertaf,

You wrote: “It is the agenda of Pro Abortion folks to focus in on embrionic stem cells without addressing these others. Please, Catholics, don’t follow them into this rhetoric.”

AMEN!! Also, it’s worth pointing out that the medical advances that have been made with stem cells have been entirely with adult stem cells or cord blood. There are exactly zero, zip, nada successful treatments using embryonic stem cells.


#13

It doesn’t look like you will find too much disagreement here. It appears most folks here are conservative Catholic also. Although I used to classify my self aa a liberal (ages gone by during the JFK, RFK eras), I pretty agree with you.


#14

RESOURCES:

[quote=USCatholic]I am against ordination of women. AND distorting, changing the Scriptures, playing with the WORD of God to satisfy the feminists or any individual.
[/quote]

catholic.com/library/Women_and_the_Priesthood.asp

catholicplanet.com/articles/conservative1.htm

wf-f.org/OrdSac.html

wf-f.org/FemLangLit.html (on using feminine -politically correct- language in bible and liturgy)

wf-f.org/WFFFAQ.html (role of women)

[quote=USCatholic]I am against abortion.
[/quote]

catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=3797

[quote=USCatholic]I am against premarital sex.
[/quote]

americancatholic.org/Newsletters/CU/ac0603.asp

catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=4114

[quote=USCatholic]I am against stem cell research - and any research that kills the unborn, for any reason.
[/quote]

americancatholic.org/News/StemCell/default.asp

flacathconf.org/issuesinfo/041028%20FL%20Catholic.htm

sentinel.org/articles/2005-22/13974.html

cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=31374

solidgroundministry.com/sg_news/black_catholics%20mobilize.htm

usccb.org/prolife/programs/rlp/01usal.htm

geocities.com/seapadre_1999/16thSunday-c.html

catholicplanet.com/articles/article95.htm

[quote=USCatholic]I am against an agressive war, but -reluctantly- for a defensive one, or whatever the Church decides.
[/quote]

ewtn.com/expert/answers/just_war.htm

americancatholic.org/News/JustWar/Iraq/

christusrex.org/www1/CDHN/fifth.html

[quote=USCatholic]I am against the marriage of priests.
[/quote]

americancatholic.org/Messenger/Jun2001/Wiseman.asp#top

atheism.about.com/od/romancatholicism/a/celibacy_p.htm

americancatholic.org/Newsletters/CU/ac0100.asp

catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=4114

[quote=USCatholic]I am against homosexuality, and of course, child-molestation.
[/quote]

abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=824513

americancatholic.org/Newsletters/CU/ac0799.asp

americancatholic.org/Messenger/Jul2002/Feature2.asp

americancatholic.org/News/Homosexuality/default.asp (see also “marriage” below)

[quote=USCatholic]I am against any progressive, liberal, and immoral ideas.
[/quote]

americancatholic.org/Messenger/Oct1999/Editorial.asp

americancatholic.org/Messenger/Jul1996/Editorial.asp

newadvent.org/cathen/09212a.htm

saintaquinas.com/modernism_intro.html

saintaquinas.com/modernism_error1.html

[quote=USCatholic]I am for Tradition (Church Tradition, Fathers of the Church, that is).
[/quote]

newadvent.org/cathen/15006b.htm

americancatholic.org/Newsletters/CU/ac1081.asp

[quote=USCatholic]Marriage is only between a Man and a Woman.
[/quote]

Speaks for itself. The enitre Bible is for it.

americancatholic.org/News/Homosexuality/default.asp

americancatholic.org/Features/Sacraments/Marriage.asp

[quote=USCatholic]My loyalty for the Catholic Church is unshakable.
[/quote]

No comment.

[quote=USCatholic]I hope future Holy Fathers will be like Jean-Paul II and Benedict XVI.
[/quote]

A Conservative Holy Father.


#15

Conservative or Liberal is something the media has imposed in the Church. The Catholic Church is what it is. Jesus Christ and his teachings were not soley liberal or soley Conservative… They were outside the political spectrum.


#16

[quote=Rand Al’Thor]How horrible these “conservative” beliefs are!
[/quote]

You made a blanket statement here. Which “conservative” beliefs do you find so horrible and why?


#17

[quote=Sooner4Christ]Conservative or Liberal is something the media has imposed in the Church. The Catholic Church is what it is. Jesus Christ and his teachings were not soley liberal or soley Conservative… They were outside the political spectrum.
[/quote]

The Catholic Church SHOULD be what is it as Jesus founded her.

Unfortunately, the terms “liberal,” “traditionalist,” “conservative” came during and after Vatican II.

It is a fact now that there are those who want to spread liberal, sometimes immoral, ideas in the Church, and those, as myself, who want to preserve the original Traditions of the Chruch as founded by Jesus, and continued by John Paul II, and Benedict XVI.


#18

I am for loving the father and my savior with all my heart body and soul.and loving my neighbor as myself,and also doing unto others as i would have done unto me.I,m a traditional christian! in christian unity, celt


#19

[quote=Gottle of Geer]## Is anyone “for” anything :slight_smile: ?

The amount of damage done by people for whom Christianity means disapproval of anything enjoyable or good or kind or not explicitly Churchy, is terrible to think of :frowning:

Kill-joy Catholicism converts no one: why lead a joyless monochrome life when you can live in full colour ? If Jesus had gone round perpetually girning at the world, He would never have attracted anyone. In fact, He explicitly forbids long-faced piety: He has a lot to say in commendation of joy - too often, his servants lack joy: it’s the very thing that makes Christians indistinguishable from worldlings. :slight_smile:

To quote the title of a book from about 60 years ago - “Saints are not Sad” :slight_smile: ##
[/quote]

For someone who is clearly not Catholic, you have a lot to learn. There is much Joy and Freedom in following Jesus and His teachings. I can appreciate that you are not at that point yet. There was a point in my life that I couldn’t even stomach walking into a Catholic Church.

It is so hard to let go and “Let God”. I pray that through the intercession of our Blessed Mother, you open yourself enough to ask and seek - then you will truly recieve and find.

God bless you on your journey to Christ!

Donna


#20

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