[quote="Trevor_Stamm, post:8, topic:274985"]
And Adam and Eve did not need God while in their state of innocence?
they did, his believes that because that innocence has been lost the only way to God is thru the merits of christ and that merit is for sinners ONLY. So according to his arguement unless mary sinned, the merits of christ can not be applied
This is what happens when the Eucharist is completely taken out of Christianity, everything falls. We were created to know, love and serve God; The Fall does not change the highest reason for our being. I suggest you present the Scotus view of the Primacy of Christ, Franciscan Thesis, to your friend. It deals with the Immaculate Conception but mainly, presenting the maximum reason for the Incarnation of Christ. This video is a great introduction. If he doesn't want to hear philosophy or logic, coupled with Sacred Scripture, then at least you might learn something from this thesis. I'll post more videos that breaks it down further for deeper study.
To state the Incarnation is contingent of sin, such ignorance! :mad:
thank you for the thoughtful response, there is a problem though; im using a phone so i cant watch the video you provided, i would appreciate anything in written form. Thanks again, you really helped.