I See So Many Dissention Threads Here, Why Do You Insist? Know The Truth!!!!!


#1

Friends: As I even browse through all the numerous threads here in this “Non-Catholic” religion thread, I can’t help but noticing ALL the various dissentions, disagreements, challenges, world views, quarrels, assertions, etc. I ask you all, don’t you just want to REST IN OUR LORD? Why all the skuflle? Why all the confusion/;dissention? You must all know, I have been there, done that, and that it leads no-where. The Catholic Faith is THE ONLY TRUE FAITH of JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF. Why can’t you all just believe this?

If you must constantly bicker back and forth, I, personally can only tell you, it WILL cause strife for you and in your life. REST IN JESES. HE is your source of salvation, and in Matthew 16: 18-20 we can ALL rest assured in THE Church Christ established here on earth.


#2

Would that folks would only listen, and be convinced of the Truths offered by our faith. But a little convincing is needed that is why I started the Most Spectacular Miracles" thread, also in this forum.
God has allowed His saints to demonstrate His love and power to us. We only have to look for His voice in the great works that He has performed through these great saints.

Many of the greatest relics and miracles in Catholic history are available for us to see, in Mexico (the cloak of Juan Diego, in Europe, the incorrupt bodies of ST Catherine and St bernadette, in Japan, the Eucharistic miracle of Akita)

IF today you hear God’s voice, harden not your hearts ! (it could be eternally fatal)

wc


#3

sparkled wrote:

You must all know, I have been there, done that, and that it leads no-where. The Catholic Faith is THE ONLY TRUE FAITH of JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF. Why can’t you all just believe this?

If you must constantly bicker back and forth, I, personally can only tell you, it WILL cause strife for you and in your life. REST IN JESES. HE is your source of salvation, and in Matthew 16: 18-20 we can ALL rest assured in THE Church Christ established here on earth.

It is precisely because our faith is to be put in Jesus Christ and Him alone that there is disagreement by non-Catholic Christians with the RCC. I can also say, with regard to Roman Catholicism, I have “been there, done that” and must find agreement with Peter who said in Acts 4:12: “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”

Unfortunately, over the centuries the RCC has confused millions into believing that salvation comes through it, that the RCC is what one must put its faith into, that it is the “One True Church” that saves, not Jesus.


#4

Sparkle,

Anyone from any ideology could say the same thing. Mormons,
Communists, anyone. We argue and question because we are not convinced. We are seeking the truth. You should encourage and respect us instead of making cheap remarks like this.

By “us” I mean those of us who show Catholicism respect. I certainly understand your getting annoyed at those who attack Catholicism bombastically without understanding it.

Edwin


#5

I remember a few years back I was having a casual chat with some friends of mine at lunch back in High School. We talked about politics, video games, religion, our classes etc. etc.

I recall someone moving from the table next to us, comming right up to me and proclaiming rather loudly “do you know what it’s like to be burned? Because that’s what it’s going to be like -forever- after you die unless you change your beliefs” I stared at him for a few seconds rather shocked about what he had said to me. He stared back, almost as if staring down at your opponent in a gunfight at high noon. He wandered off after a few jeers from my friends but came to me the next day with a few video’s his church put out, and a few that his friends did. It was standart new-age christian stuff. In fact… now that I think about it I remember it sounding a lot like something from those nuts at Chick Publications.

It was about that time I started finding little drawings in my locker… a rather cartoonish man labled “Al Gore” holding a headless baby upside down by the foot umbilical cord and all in one hand and a bloody knife in the other. Or, another cartoonish man also labled “Al Gore” holding a cigar, the caption implying lewd things were done with it. (obviously trying to attack Bill Clinton)

I had a class with him, and he always made sure to remind me once a day at least about the burning that I was sure to receive for my dirty hethen thinking as well as a few more propaganda-ish drawings. I was also harassed by several of his friends along the same lines in various ways and places. They even so much as dedicated a page of a website to how awful a person I was because I voted Democratic, and was a non-beleiver. It was pretty much a caricature, the site. Though they obviously did try to make it hurtful. They even started a mudslinging campaign when I was nominated for the Homecomming Dance royalty. Looking back I can see that in his own way he ment well though his actions were clouded by the prejeduce of his youth.

But the idea stuck with me. He tried to scare me into a belief.

Now… I’ve taken to listening to the EWTN affiliate in my hometown (I guess I’m a philosophy nut) and the station runs Catholic Answers Live on it. I recall a guest, or perhaps the moderator mention that Faith by definition has to be not only an act of the heart (blind devotion) but it has to be an act of the mind. Faith has to be a choice you make. There has to be a logic behind it. And when I hear people trying to “put the fear of God in me” I just sit there and think how they’re neglecting the other half of it all.

I’m not sure what I beleive. My parents raised me with the understanding that they were Christian and that they would like to see me also be Christian, but that I was encouraged to go and find the beleifs that work for me. My mother helped me when I had questions, and even helped me find answers about other religions. I find things that I can beleive in various religions, western and eastern. My point being I’m not quite sure I’m ready to commit.

In essence, I’ve basicly told myself that I won’t allow myself to be bullied into any religion. Especially a religion that defines Faith as clearly as Catholicism does. And I’m not sure that God wants beleivers who are scared into doing so, if that is how he has made his church define Faith.


#6

You must all know, I have been there, done that, and that it leads no-where. The Catholic Faith is THE ONLY TRUE FAITH of JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF. Why can’t you all just believe this?

Because I don’t. Why can’t you just respect that? It doesn’t really matter where you’ve been and what you’ve done, since you’re not me.

I think defining one’s relationship with God is one’s highest duty in life. You, apparently, have found your spiritual home. I am happy for you, and respect your choice.


#7

[quote=sparkle]. I ask you all, don’t you just want to REST IN OUR LORD? Why all the skuflle? Why all the confusion/;dissention? You must all know, I have been there, done that, and that it leads no-where. The Catholic Faith is THE ONLY TRUE FAITH of JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF. Why can’t you all just believe this?

[/quote]

I notice two reasons. One: because the sole purpose of posting here is to save our poor Catholic souls. Most of these posters become sefl-evident anti-Catholics who ignore logic, feed us lies and are quickly banned.

Two: because truth matters. Many posters here believe in the reality and importance of absolute truth. But how does one come to that truth without struggle, debate and time? We must be patient with each other and maintain discussions as charitably as possible. Most people believe what they do for good reason. While two contradictory postitions can not be true, resolving differences is laborious. Thanks be to God that with Him, all things are possible.


#8

Most of the arguments come from Protestants like arcturus who insist on misunderstanding Catholic teaching. In their hearts they know they cannot refute what we really believe, so they create straw man arguments to make themselves feel better.


#9

[quote=arcturus]Unfortunately, over the centuries the RCC has confused millions into believing that salvation comes through it, that the RCC is what one must put its faith into, that it is the “One True Church” that saves, not Jesus.
[/quote]

Never heard that one before.:confused:


#10

[quote=Rhubarb]In essence, I’ve basicly told myself that I won’t allow myself to be bullied into any religion. Especially a religion that defines Faith as clearly as Catholicism does. And I’m not sure that God wants beleivers who are scared into doing so, if that is how he has made his church define Faith.
[/quote]

BE NOT AFRAID!


#11

[quote=Mickey]Never heard that one before.:confused:
[/quote]

That is why cestus called it a strawman. It is an arguement against an easy to win, but untrue, doctrine.


#12

I am going to use my dear husband’s own words here… God is a good “businessman”…it doesn’t matter what type of denomation you choose…he’s got one of everyone and eventually, He will find you.

I personally don’t see “dissention”…I just see discussion and absoultely love this forum although I am not Catholic.


#13

Because I don’t. Why can’t you just respect that? It doesn’t really matter where you’ve been and what you’ve done, since you’re not me.

I think defining one’s relationship with God is one’s highest duty in life. You, apparently, have found your spiritual home. I am happy for you, and respect your choice.

it all comes down to absolute truth. we catholics believe that absolute truth exists and we can come to conform ourselves to the this truth. this truth exists regardless of us recognizing it. therefore, we ‘force’ (within reason) the truth on others because it is the truth. either way, you can never avoid forcing your views or religion on someone else. it is impossible. we are only being consistent with what we believe.


#14

[quote=arcturus]sparkled wrote:It is precisely because our faith is to be put in Jesus Christ and Him alone that there is disagreement by non-Catholic Christians with the RCC. I can also say, with regard to Roman Catholicism, I have “been there, done that” and must find agreement with Peter who said in Acts 4:12: “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”

Unfortunately, over the centuries the RCC has confused millions into believing that salvation comes through it, that the RCC is what one must put its faith into, that it is the “One True Church” that saves, not Jesus.
[/quote]

This can help clear up your confusion:

catholic.com/library/pillar.asp

**The Church Is One (Rom. 12:5, 1 Cor. 10:17, 12:13, CCC 813–822)
**Jesus established only one Church, not a collection of differing churches (Lutheran, Baptist, Anglican, and so on). The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but *one *spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church.

His Church also teaches just one set of doctrines, which must be the same as those taught by the apostles (Jude 3). This is the unity of belief to which Scripture calls us (Phil. 1:27, 2:2).

**Does your Church have an unbroken history for 2000 years?
**
AN UNBROKEN HISTORY

Jesus said his Church would be “the light of the world.” He then noted that “a city set on a hill cannot be hid” (Matt. 5:14). This means his Church is a visible organization. It must have characteristics that clearly identify it and that distinguish it from other churches. Jesus promised, “I will build my Church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it” (Matt. 16:18). This means that his Church will never be destroyed and will never fall away from him. His Church will survive until his return.

Among the Christian churches, only the Catholic Church has existed since the time of Jesus. Every other Christian church is an offshoot of the Catholic Church. The Eastern Orthodox churches broke away from unity with the pope in 1054. The Protestant churches were established during the Reformation, which began in 1517. (Most of today’s Protestant churches are actually offshoots of the original Protestant offshoots.)

Only the Catholic Church existed in the tenth century, in the fifth century, and in the first century, faithfully teaching the doctrines given by Christ to the apostles, omitting nothing. The line of popes can be traced back, in unbroken succession, to Peter himself. This is unequaled by any institution in history.

Even the oldest government is new compared to the papacy, and the churches that send out door-to-door missionaries are young compared to the Catholic Church. Many of these churches began as recently as the nineteenth or twentieth centuries. Some even began during your own lifetime. None of them can claim to be the Church Jesus established.

The Catholic Church has existed for nearly 2,000 years, despite constant opposition from the world. This is testimony to the Church’s divine origin. It must be more than a merely human organization, especially considering that its human members— even some of its leaders—have been unwise, corrupt, or prone to heresy.

Any merely human organization with such members would have collapsed early on. The Catholic Church is today the most vigorous church in the world (and the largest, with a billion members: one sixth of the human race), and that is testimony not to the cleverness of the Church’s leaders, but to the protection of the Holy Spirit.


#15

Dear arcturus,

“Unfortunately, over the centuries the RCC has confused millions into believing that salvation comes through it, that the RCC is what one must put its faith into, that it is the “One True Church” that saves, not Jesus.” quote, arcturus

Well, I’ll say one thing about your position:

I’ve often noticed how, in non-Catholic Christian
Churches, the name “Jesus” is frequently heard.
Whereas, in Catholicism, the word “Church” is
frequently heard, not to the exclusion of the name
of Jesus, certainly, but there is an overweening
emphasis, to me, on “Church.”

This has always confused me, too.
I once wrote a paper on the term “ecclesia”, so
it’s not like I’m unfamiliar with same. Still,
it bothers me, and I can understand where you
are coming from, doctrinally.

reen12

“To say that I understand what you are saying
does not necessarily imply that I agree with same.”
-reen12

“God’s Freelance:)”


#16

[quote=arcturus]sparkled wrote:It is precisely because our faith is to be put in Jesus Christ and Him alone that there is disagreement by non-Catholic Christians with the RCC. I can also say, with regard to Roman Catholicism, I have “been there, done that” and must find agreement with Peter who said in Acts 4:12: “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”

Unfortunately, over the centuries the RCC has confused millions into believing that salvation comes through it, that the RCC is what one must put its faith into, that it is the “One True Church” that saves, not Jesus.
[/quote]


arcturus, I have to tell you that you are either confused or have been misinformed! You say the RCC has confused millions. You speak about “salvation”. You talk as if the RCC says that you will be saved through the actions of the Catholic Church. No, not true, it is Jesus who saved us. And it was Jesus who started His Church, the RCC.

Go back and get informed by true Catholics - not Jack Chick. Jesus Christ is the one Redemer, the one who saved us. Look in a Catholic Church sometime. You will see Jesus Chrrist right up fron, in the center. Jesus is the CENTER of the RCC. Believe it or not! You have posted as if you are uninformed.


#17

The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but *one *spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church.


#18

Dear Eden,

That’s not my point.

An analogy that would be better suited might be:

It’s like talking about “marriage” [Church] a good
deal of the time, while marginalizing the
"Bridegroom" [Jesus]. cf. post #15

Just my take,
reen12

“God’s Freelance:)”


#19

[quote=reen12]I’ve often noticed how, in non-Catholic Christian
Churches, the name “Jesus” is frequently heard.
Whereas, in Catholicism, the word “Church” is
frequently heard, not to the exclusion of the name
of Jesus, certainly, but there is an overweening
emphasis, to me, on “Church.”

[/quote]

Sorry, I couldn’t resist:D Here goes:

sacred-texts.com/chr/lmass/ord.htm
Number of times used during the Mass:

17 Jesus or Jesus Christ
22 Christ (without Jesus next to it)
5 Lamb of God
9 Son (when used alone, not in conjunction with Jesus)

Total=53 mentions of Jesus (not including all the references to God, Father, Lord, or the Holy Spirit, which are all also extremely numerous)

This also does not include the Scripture readings.

Also, the central aspect of the Mass is the Eucharist, Jesus Himself. How much more emphasis can there be?

4 Church.
(these four times include the one mention in the Creed, and the rest are asking Jesus or God to bless the Church.)

Now, do you really think the Church is emphasized too much? An anti-Catholic preacher will focus on the Church more times than that:rolleyes:


#20

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