Idolatry


#1

Exodus 20:3-5

***You shall not have other gods besides me. ***
You shall not carve idols for yourselves in the shape of anything in the sky above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth;
you shall not bow down before them or worship them.


Muslims and non-catholics often use the above passages of the 10 commandments to attack the Catholic faith. They say that pictures, icons, and statues are prohibited by God.

I want to know in exact how muslims will explain the above passages more eloquently.

Pio


#2

I have a question to muslims: Is kissing the Quran not an “idolatry”?Pio


#3

[quote=hlgomez]Exodus 20:3-5

***You shall not have other gods besides me. ***
You shall not carve idols for yourselves in the shape of anything in the sky above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth;
you shall not bow down before them or worship them.


Muslims and non-catholics often use the above passages of the 10 commandments to attack the Catholic faith. They say that pictures, icons, and statues are prohibited by God.

I want to know in exact how muslims will explain the above passages more eloquently.

Pio
[/quote]

You mean what does islam say about idolatry? Or what do I think about how catholics act compared to the above verses?


#4

[quote=hlgomez]I have a question to muslims: Is kissing the Quran not an “idolatry”?Pio
[/quote]

No more than kissing your wife/kids/friends. If you love it, feel free to kiss it, as long as it isnt like…your neighbors wife or anything (unless youre a woman, then thatd be okay…but you get the point)


#5

[quote=Eetaq]No more than kissing your wife/kids/friends. If you love it, feel free to kiss it, as long as it isnt like…your neighbors wife or anything (unless youre a woman, then thatd be okay…but you get the point)
[/quote]

I second that. Kissing something/someone doesnt equal worship.

However, praying TO a dead person and asking them for things (whether someone in their grave or a picture on the wall or a statue on the table), DOES


#6

You mean kissing is a form of worship to Catholics.

wa salam


#7

What do you call the mad scramble to touch the kabaa if possible ?


#8

[quote=un_dhimmi]What do you call the mad scramble to touch the kabaa if possible ?
[/quote]

i call it a crowd of muslims ignorant of the fact that the only reason it’s recommended to touch it is because prophet muhammad did so, not because it’s obligatory to do so, or because the stone means anything significant other than it being one of the cornerstones of the ka’bah.

umar bin al-khattaab, during one of his pilgrimages, spoke aloud for the people to hear him, and said to the stone, “the only reason i touch you, is because i saw the prophet (s) touch you.” indicating that the stone is not to be worshipped, nor is it of any particular significance.


#9

[quote=un_dhimmi]What do you call the mad scramble to touch the kabaa if possible ?
[/quote]

well I dont call it worship


#10

I read all you replies, my muslim friends. And I can say that that is exactly what we do in Catholicism. Kissing, showing reverence, touching, are not automatically acts of worship, but reverence.

But so many of you misunderstood those acts and calls it idolatry or a sin against the commandments of God.

Pio


#11

Pretty typical.

When muslims do it, its not Idolatory, just showing reverence.

When christian do it, bingo, it’s idolatory.


#12

Pretty typical.

When muslims do it, its not Idolatory, just showing reverence.

When christian do it, bingo, it’s idolatory.

You got it right…

Muslims have a copy of the Quran which is made out of tree, made by human hands, and starts kissing it and giving it reverence (probably, they bow to it), for them this is not idolatry.

When Catholics make icons and images and pictures of Jesus and the Saints and starts kissing them and showing reverence, this is idolatry.

Pio


#13

[quote=hlgomez]You got it right…

Muslims have a copy of the Quran which is made out of tree, made by human hands, and starts kissing it and giving it reverence (probably, they bow to it), for them this is not idolatry.

When Catholics make icons and images and pictures of Jesus and the Saints and starts kissing them and showing reverence, this is idolatry.

Pio
[/quote]

We do not bow down to anything/anyone but Allah almighty ALONE.

We respect the Quran because it is God’s words and we also love it for that reason. I personally dont go around kissing my Quran. I do what God has commanded me to do with it…READ IT AND LIVE BY IT.

Just curious, how do you interpret the verse from the bible that says taht you shouldnt be making images?

Again, i honestly want to know the answer. Do you ask the saints for things (like health, peace, etc?)


#14

[quote=un_dhimmi]Pretty typical.

When muslims do it, its not Idolatory, just showing reverence.

When christian do it, bingo, it’s idolatory.
[/quote]

We dont make images of anything or anyone…b/c it eventually leads to a form of worship. It’s happened to people in the past…and its probably one of the reasons we dont have a picture of Mohamed (pbuh) even though we know enough about how he looked like to make one.

We worship God alone. We bow down to God alone. We pray to him ALONE…there are no distractions in between :slight_smile:


#15

Do you have a photograph of yourself ?


#16

[quote=un_dhimmi]Do you have a photograph of yourself ?
[/quote]

yeah! But i dont expect that after my death my sister will sit there prostrating and asking me for stuff :smiley:

p.s. answer the questions!

edit…ohhh i get it…b/c i said we dont make images of anyting or anyone…i meant people like prophets and messengers…although i do have to say, that i ahve heard some muslims reject the idea of ANY images even pictures of oneself


#17

Just curious, how do you interpret the verse from the bible that says taht you shouldnt be making images?

It’s just that you probably not notice the immediate word that says; “…you shall not worship them.” This is the key word. We make images not to worship them. Just as a book is useless to people who can’t read and write, but images will say something and remind them of their faith.

Again, i honestly want to know the answer. Do you ask the saints for things (like health, peace, etc?)

We ask for their intercession. And there are innumerable miracles attributed to them.You can investigate them by yourself or go search the lives of the Catholic saints.

Pio


#18

[quote=hlgomez]It’s just that you probably not notice the immediate word that says; “…you shall not worship them.” This is the key word. We make images not to worship them. Just as a book is useless to people who can’t read and write, but images will say something and remind them of their faith.

We ask for their intercession. And there are innumerable miracles attributed to them.You can investigate them by yourself or go search the lives of the Catholic saints.

Pio
[/quote]

im curious…give me an example of what a catholic would say to one of these saints. I think we have a different definition of worship


#19

[quote=Faith101]im curious…give me an example of what a catholic would say to one of these saints. I think we have a different definition of worship
[/quote]

First of all, we don’t think of the saints as “dead.” They are more alive than we are. They are perfected in charity and live in the divine presence. We don’t ask THEM for things like health or healing or spiritual gifts, we ask them for the only thing they can give us: their prayers.

“Blessed St. Pio, through your intercession many have been healed. In your kindness, please pray to Our Lord that in his mercy, and according to his holy will, our brother Jonathan will be healed of his cancer if it will be expedient for him and to the glory of Almighty God.”


#20

[quote=mercygate]First of all, we don’t think of the saints as “dead.” They are more alive than we are. They are perfected in charity and live in the divine presence. We don’t ask THEM for things like health or healing or spiritual gifts, we ask them for the only thing they can give us: their prayers.

“Blessed St. Pio, through your intercession many have been healed. In your kindness, please pray to Our Lord that in his mercy, and according to his holy will, our brother Jonathan will be healed of his cancer if it will be expedient for him and to the glory of Almighty God.”
[/quote]

Thanks mercygate :slight_smile: Do you think it would be as effective or even more effective if you just prayed to God directly. Being that you believe that the power is in His hands to heal. Being also, that He is much more merciful that any saint? Thats what we do in Islam…cut out the middle man…go straight to the source :slight_smile:


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