If God Exists...


#1

Why does he not reveal himself more? Please allow me to state that I am not trying to be rude or get myself banned. I am a science student who has been trying to find some evidence of a higher power, but I just can’t seem to feel any being trying to relate to me. I have had what one might term “spiritual” experiences. For example, one summer vacation during my high school years, I was extremely happy. I stayed up until dawn many days and listened to music. I biked in the sun, and I was happy. To me, it was the essence of being alive. I still experience happiness, but it is not as often and usually only occurs after I have completed a great deal of work. When I think of the halcyon days of my childhood, I feel as though there could have been a God figure involved, but many of my current days are too repetitive and seem to make me think that life is a long series of pointless actions and reactions. Now that I need a God figure most, I can’t seem to find any. I hate the idea of living in delusion, and I want to know: Has anyone really felt a connection to a higher being?


#2

He has revealed himself to you and to all nations and peoples. The most obvious way is the most basic, and the way in which you are most attuned to him, as a science major, in the world which He created. Study of that world, real objective study without preconceived definitions of truth, are the beginning of His revelation. He has gone on to reveal himself by becoming involved in human history, as those who approach that study with openness and willingness to see, hear and believe discover. Finally His revelation is complete and entire in the Person of His Son, Jesus Christ, True God and True Man, who deigned to become one of us and share our human nature in order that we may become fully human, escape our wounded nature and bondage to sin and become perfect in our humanity, so that we may approach His divinity. You will find that story recorded, as other humans have received, protected and transmitted the Word, in the Bible. Begin with Mark’s gospel, which you can read in an evening, and read it as if, hey, He’s talkin’ to you, man.


#3

Thanks for your response, but I still don’t feel like it is a “personal” enough relationship.


#4

you can’t have a personal relationship with someone you don’t know yet. and He initiates the relationship, which He is doing, which is why you are seeking Him. you don’t call the shots, He does. If you want to get to know a girl who looks attractive, don’t you begin by asking friends who know her to introduce you? Try to find something about her before striking up a conversation?


#5

Well, I’m a girl, so not really haha. I see what you’re saying, but I still don’t think that I have found much in the way of a God figure, which is leaving me disappointed.


#6

He’s there, Et Cetera, and if you seek Him out, you will find Him - promise made, promise kept, billions of times. But you have to accept that you are the creature, He is the Creator, and so if you humble yourself before Him, and seek the truth earnestly and diligently, He will reveal Himself to you. Since you’re into science, do a scientific experiment: assume that God exists and the Bible is His Word. How could you prove if such a supposition is true? Let’s see how good of a scientist you are! :cool:


#7

Hi Et Cetera,

I suggest you think not about God existing but about God transcending existence. When we say God exists, it implies that God is somehow inside the natural universe and we can test His existence and get empirical evidence.

As a scientist, I would suggest you try an experiment - practice the Cathollic Christian faith for one month. In order to fully understand Christianity as an adult you have to live it.

To perform this experiment start by praying daily. You can start the prayer by saying. “God, I don’t know if can hear me but if you can, . . .”

In order to set time apart for God, you should also go to Catholic Mass. Daily is best. If you are not a member of the Catholic Church in good standing, you should not recieve communion. You can pray at Mass and ask God to reveal himself - espically in the Eucharist.

In order to start to understand God better, you should also commit to completing two books within the month. Topics include philosophy, morality, history, theology, spirituality and others. You might be overwhelmed with the breadth and depth of the subject matter so getting good recomendations for introductory books is a good idea.

As you go through the experiment, if yo have specific questions, you can post a thread on the forums and we’d be glad to help.

Dr. Peter Keeft has written about this experiement in his artice on Joy.

I am praying for you. If you decide to take up the experement / challenge, keep us posted on how it’s going.

cheers,

Maranatha!


#8

This is a perfectly reasonable question and since you haven’t gotten a good answer so far I’ll throw in my two cents.

Clearly, “if God exists”, he could reveal himself more explicitly for everyone. Asking this question does not necessarily deny that God has revealed himself explicitly to others in history.

You might ask, for example, why God himself does not occupy the position of Pope.

I think there are several possible explanations:

  1. There is a Jewish saying, if God lived on earth, people would break his windows. There are many who would be even more anti-religious if they had to face God directly because they don’t like the way he runs the universe.

  2. Humans are naturally disobedient. If God were more present we would have no excuse. God’s distance give us space to learn to love him.

  3. God wants us to figure things out for ourselves as far as possible so that we take responsibility for our choices. God’s intrusion in human affairs has tended toward the minimal.

  4. God wants us to focus our attention on each other first, and then only on him.

While all of these seem credible to me, my point in offering them is mainly to refute the idea that God’s lack of observable presence in our every day lives is proof that God does not exist.


#9

Thank you for your response, Bubba Switzler.

What I’m really looking for is some type of “higher plane” experience. I want something out of the ordinary because the day-to-day can leave me feeling empty. Has anyone felt a connection with a higher being?


#10

God gave us free will, if he revealed himself he’d be taking that away, because basically you’d have no other choice but to believe in God if you saw him right?

Anyway, faith without seeing means a lot more to God than seeing him and then believing only based on that. Have you ever had a friend or group of friends who only hung out with you because you did their homework, had lots of money, or increased their social status in one way or another? Doesn’t feel too good, huh? Now, have you ever had a friend who hung out with you no matter what situation you were in, whether you were poor or not, helped them pass a class or not etc.? It feels good that you have someone who cares about you who isn’t only looking for the benefit of themselves, so you tell me why God doesn’t reveal himself, which is the one that means more to you :wink:

Also, God is much like a billionare in homeless man’s clothes. How many people would hang out with a poor, homeless person and roll down a red carpet for him and treat him like royalty? Not many, considering people only are after something for themselves in those situations most of the time. Now what if those people found out the poor, homeless person had all the riches and money and gold in the world? They’d quickly change their tune, but in the end the homless person wouldn’t feel too good about their new-found friendship because he can clearly see that they don’t like him for who he is or what he’s done but rather only the money he possesses.


#11

If anyone wishes to follow Me he will take up his cross daily and follow Me.

If HE wants to give you a “higher plane” experience He will do so in His own good time, but it will be HIS definition of a higher plane, not yours. It is not for you to tell Him what you want, how you wish to know Him. He became Man for our sake, to meet us in the day-to-day, because that is where we need Him. “Feeling empty” is not a reliable guage of spiritual experience or growth. your role is to learn all you can about Him from people who already know Him, learn from their experience, and be open to Him, ready to hear especially when He speaks through others, and most especially, through His Church.


#12

Cause it impresses Him more that we believe despite everything. If he showed himself to everyone whats the point of following because then we know the truth beyond a reasonable doubt.

That being the said if everyone knew what the truth was without doubt there would be no reason to chose taking away free will.

He wants us to come to Him on our terms not His.

I have felt it. Its been a while though.


#13

I think everyone at some point would like some reassurances that God or the spiritual realm exists. Very few of us actually get that experience until the very end. The very nature of the spiritual plane excludes us from encountering it until our death. At least that is the case for most of us.

What we have left is, the accounts or witness of the few special folks who are lucky enough to have such encounters.

Fortunately, there are more than enough encounters with the supernatural to give us all hope that what people say is true. IF we study the lives and experiences of the saints and mystics, we see that God’s special friends experienced special favors that often showed us encounters with the other realm.

And in some cases, there is physical evidence that there is proof positive that these encounters were real. IF we look at the cloak of St. Juan Diego, or the incorruptible bodies of St. Bernedette or St Catherine of Sienna, or St. Padre Pio, we can see that the spiritual and physical realm can sometimes be breached.

Miracles are necessarily rare, but evidence of them can be easily found if we take the time to look for them. You may also want to look up Eucharistic Miracles on the following site:

therealpresence.org/eucharst/mir/a3.html


#14

God spoke to me once. I heard him clearly in my mind. Does that qualify as a connection with a higher being?

But what I really want to talk about is cats. I’m a cat person, the sterotypical spinster with multiple cats. This morning before reading your post I was thinking about cats and God, and when I read your post I needed to share my thoughts.

I am to my cats as God is to me. I meet all their needs and I answer all of their prayers (sometimes the answer is no). I love them all the time, even when they are in another room and don’t know I’m thinking about them. Often when they come to me I will scratch their ears or rub their tummies. But sometimes I don’t, my hands might be full or I might be doing something else or I might not be home. They may feel that their god has deserted them. I haven’t of course, but that may be how they feel. The personal connection between my cats and I is always there even when they don’t feel it or are unaware of it. In fact, I’m pretty sure my cats have no idea how much I love them. Their attitude (cats being cats) is generally, “but what have you done for me lately?”

You may not sense a personal connection with God, but that doesn’t mean you don’t have one. He feels very personally connected to you. Remember St. Teresa of Avila? She was a cloistered nun and a mystic, and yet sometimes she would go for long periods of time with no sense of God’s presence, when she did mystically feel God’s presence she considered them great graces and out of the norm.

My advice, just considered yourself one of God’s cats. Keep rubbing against His legs and He will reach down and scratch your ears.

Marsha


#15

Galatians 4:6"And because ye are sons
God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son
into your hearts
crying Abba Father"

ask God to **send **his **Spirit ****into **your heart

Luke 11:13 “…how much more shall your heavenly Father
give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him”


#16

Et Cetera,

I can answer your question with a definite YES. There was a time in my life when I was starting to despair after having had a near death experience. I started reading the Bible and going back to Church, but in my heart I could not honestly say I believed that God existed. Just because someone says God exists does not make it so. I can remember a specific moment when I cried out and said the first “real” prayer in my life - “God, IF you exist, please help me to know it.” I was literally starting to despair that life was utterly meaningless. (I could go on and on about that … but it isn’t the main thing I wanted to tell you.)

I can honestly say that if God had not answered my prayer, I probably would be dead today. Here is a little bit of the rest of my story … click on the link below and go to post # 97

forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=287813&page=7

You are very special to God and I know if you seek, you will find. God wants you to because that is the very reason you were created - to know and love God - to be in a relationship with Him for the rest of eternity as His adopted daughter - a relationship that will never end - eternal life.


#17

I do remember the euphoria of earlier days quite well. I used to wait for that next manic episode so I could enjoy it. At times I felt like I knew the answer to every question, and that every mystery in the universe was revealed. And all without drugs! I get whiffs of that today, most often when the sun is exceedingly bright or a certain smell comes along. I then find myself walking along the railroad tracks of my youth for a moment or two.

But I haven’t had any lasting such episodes for the last ten years. It’s obviously a physiological thing related to aging and health. I do find that the better my level of fitness the better I feel, and the more often I get those whiffs of earlier days.

I never once equated those episodes with any higher beings or entities of any kind. They were just overwhelmingly euphoric.

I should add that they were also reflected in my dreams. The better I felt during the day, the more enjoyable the dreams I had.


#18

crowonsnow, smells and bright sun can do the same for me. My experiences sound similar to yours; I think that they mostly were the result of brain chemistry. I appreciate everyone else’s responses as I realize that you are trying to help, but all these words don’t mean much to me without any proof. You say, “God is great; God is loving,” but where is the evidence? In the sick and dying that fill the earth? In disease and abuse of power? There is also a great deal of good, but everything seems so unbalanced and unjust. Why are some poor and sick while others are rich and in good health?


#19

We don’t know. For those of us who have a faith, we accept that we cannot know the mind of God. I accept that that is how things are, and whilst I (we) can work to overcome injustice and to help the poor, sick and suffering, this *is *a fallen world.

(btw its not incompatible with an acknowledgement that brain chemistry & the environment has important effects on our emotions and subjective experiences. For example, I see no reason to dismiss the idea that God may work through our brain structures & chemistry - He created us after all!)


#20

Either he doesn’t exist.

Or he doesn’t need for humans to acknowlege him.

The point of life, is either meaningless, or God has already designed it into our being.

There are lots of arguments about how we “MUST” be faithful to an invisible being, but I think a lot of us realize how silly that is. Let’s just follow a human religion, believe people "had " god revealed, or you HAVE ALL HELL TO PAY.

Pffft…

Either God does not exist, or God does not require belief.

God may require something…but it certainly ain’t belief… lol !!


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