If women could be priests


#1

Would they be?

Is there anything that might deter a woman from the priesthood if she were attracted to other types of celebate religious life?

Just curious.


#2

As a woman, I wouldn’t want to cause division and possible defections because of my desire to be a priest. Why should my desires be more important than the good of the community and the good of the Church? Look what happened in the Episcopalian Church because of one man’s determination to become a priest.

*A note to clarify: I DO NOT have a secret desire to become a priest, so don’t jump on my back. I was putting myself in a hypothetical situation. :smiley:


#3
  1. The Priestesshood is not a vocation, and is not God’s calling
  2. The call to the religious life is distinct from the call to the Priesthood
  3. What St Peter and his successors bind and loose on earth, is considered bound and loosed in heaven.
  4. Defiance of the Christ’s representative on Earth is defiance of Christ himself.

#4

And for those reasons, this should be a very short thread.


#5

A religious vocation is often incompatible with a priestly one. Although some monastic orders ordain virtually all of their monks, others ordain just those needed by the community. Nuns can’t be priests anyway, but neither can a monk without the support of his abbot.


#6

Women cannot be priestesses. That has been settled (repeatedly) by the Church and most recently by Pope John Paul II who said the Church did not have the authority to ordain women.

Therefore, any woman who desires to be a Catholic priestess is not following the will of God.

And yes, this should be a short thread.


#7

It seems to me that the original post was a “what if” question that no one has answered not a “why not” question

I suppose that if they were allowed to be they would be encouraged and deterred by some of the same considerations that effect men.


#8

What if the sun could rise in the West and set in the East?

Why would you ask such an impossible question?


#9

I think that the answer is a clearly, “Yes!” The experience of women in ministry (whether that be non-clerical assisting roles within the Catholic Church or more formal ones in other communities) suggests that many most certainly would jump at the opportunity.

That said, perhaps some of the functions would be seen as difficult. Many women like to talk, to share. Would it be more difficult for them to offer the Sacrament of Reconciliation? How would men feel about receiving guidance from women (especially on sexual issues)?

Perhaps part of the conundrum comes from varied understandings of what the nature of the ministry is. If it is seen as something which is more intrinsic to the male’s instinct to lead and protect, it may be perceived as different than women offering their instincts of nurturing. So, this too would be a question of concern.


#10

Indeed. It’s a hypothetical which can help us to get at a different aspect of the issue which is little discussed. The arguments may even lead us to discover that there could be challenges little recognized which may deter women from exploring that path, afterall. Or, it may assist us in finding concerns which are genuine in addressing the sincere desires of some women to enter ordained ministry.

Perhaps it could be argued that the exercize, itself, is more “pastoral” in nature than “dogmatic”, then.


#11

http://www.pritchettcartoons.com/illustration/pigs-fly.jpg


#12

First and foremost the role of the Priest is to be the alter Christus, and while the ordained Priesthood is ministerial, it offering of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass and the other sacraments is of the uttermost importance. It is not just about being good at ministering to people, it is about having a vocation and being sustained by Christ. Especially in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, the Priest is offering the sacrifice in persona Christi. For those who don’t already realise, all the prophecies of the coming of Christ pointed to a male, and when Christ came into this world, he came as a male, not as some gender neutral entity. As such acting in the person of Christ, requires a male.


#13

Oh, that is sooo funny! I love it! I’m going to steal it from you to use on my blog. :smiley:


#14

Check the last sentence of my op.


#15

Thanks.

You said what I meant.


#16

This has rustled out a thought I had about the OP question.

If the Gospel and the Truth are different for women and for men, then neither women or men would be qualified, would they?

The constant nagging for women priests SAYS that the male priesthood is flawed, or presumes it to be flawed.

Which leads to the question, what would the Gospel look like with the woman’s touch? Or, to be more direct, what are we supposedly missing?

We all have a duty to support evangelization, as Pope JPII and now BXVI have reminded us.

In his book, Jesus of Nazareth, the Pope brings out that the Sabbath is narrowly interpreted as being a day of rest. More broadly, it is a day for praise and worship of God. And, counting backward in Genesis, creation of woman to be a partner of man, we also sometimes narrowly construe in just the procreative aspect, instead of looking at it as the perfect way for human worship of God.

The woman carried the seed of all future generations, so even with Eve, from a Christological standpoint, she was the original ark of the covenant, bearing the seed of Christ. So, it was not without her that the work of creation was done and the worship of God was made at least humanly perfect. And the verse about the seed of Eve supports this view of her role, the New Testament hidden in the Old.


#17

The only real qualification required for a vocation is an actual calling from Christ. To know whether or not there is a calling, one journeys with a spiritual director.

The constant nagging for women priests SAYS that the male priesthood is flawed, or presumes it to be flawed.

Ordination confers no charism of perfection.

Which leads to the question, what would the Gospel look like with the woman’s touch? Or, to be more direct, what are we supposedly missing?

Well if you read the Gospel of St Luke, you can already see that some parts concerning the Christ in his days as a youth could have only come from the Virgin Mary herself.

The woman carried the seed of all future generations, so even with Eve, from a Christological standpoint, she was the original ark of the covenant, bearing the seed of Christ. So, it was not without her that the work of creation was done and the worship of God was made at least humanly perfect. And the verse about the seed of Eve supports this view of her role, the New Testament hidden in the Old.

Bearing the bearer of the seed from which springs a vocation is still distinct from the vocation itself, just as the roles of men and women are distinct. Women have a significant role to play in the Church, the Priesthood however is not part of it.


#18

If they could be- then God the Son would have become incarnate in a female body.

The Sacrifice for our redemption also would not have happened as it did- on Calvary/ what you see happen at every Mass on the Altar of Sacrifice.

It wouldn’t be a woman on a cross, that’s for sure. Sorry, but I cannot even begin to think “what if women can be priests” because they can never ever be a priest.

If you really want to know- look at those heretical groups that allow them, Episcopalians for example. The “Church of England” has “female priests”. Simply ask that question from them and I am sure you can get an answer.

On a side note - all their priests and bishops are not priests and bishops at all. They are invalidly ordained due to Cramner’s changing of the Ordination Rite back in the middle ages. The fact that the gender of some of them are not male is another invalidity.

Jesus Christ is a man - never forget that. The priest at Holy Mass must also be a man since Christ is a man for the priest is Alter Christus. But if you change the doctrine of the Mass (Jesus Christ is NOT offered in Sacrifice to the Triune God) and also remove “Transubstantiation”, it becomes easier to accept “female priests”.

Ken


#19

:rotfl: about the pigs flying :rotfl:


#20

Not only is Jesus the groom – and the Church is His Bride (foreshadowed in the OT and explicitly revealed in the NT) … but I’ve always liked being reminded that the priest acts “in persona Christi” – in the person of Christ – during mass, during Reconciliation, etc.
Jesus is male.

It irks me that so many Catholics, including priests, still believe the Church will change her “position” on this – as if this isn’t doctrinal teaching. Just recently, while attending a class at a conference for catechists, the instructor was asked about married priests – and he gave a good explanation about the discipline re: celibacy. Then the attendee asked him what about ordination for women. The instructor went on about how we won’t see this in our lifetimes, that the world isn’t ready yet … listing sociological reasons. I interrupted, and said “sociological reasons aside, the Church’s doctrine will not allow this to happen.” He interrupted me, and went on that in places like South America, women still are fighting for the “place in society” and culturally, the the cultural imbalances between the sexes needs to change before the Church allows this. Again, I raised my hand and said “excuse me (so-and-so), it’s for more than sociological or cultural reasons that the Church will not ordain women – she has doctrinally proclaimed …” and the instructor interrupted me, and continued on about why there will be women priests in the future. I’m a volunteer catechist. He is a professional teacher with a master’s degree in Theology from Notre Dame and has taught thousands of people for well over 20 years … so guess who people will listen to?

Any ideas on what a catechist can do when we hear this stuff from people entrusted by our bishops to hand on the Church’s teachings faithfully to us?


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