Ignatius of Antioch

I have been defending the faith on a protestant forum and several people have said we do not even know if Ignatius existed. They say his writings surfaced in the 16th century, by Rome, to disprove Protestantism. Does anyone know anything about this? I cannot find a source that states this. I love his writings. How do I defend this.

[quote=katiem]I have been defending the faith on a protestant forum and several people have said we do not even know if Ignatius existed. They say his writings surfaced in the 16th century, by Rome, to disprove Protestantism. Does anyone know anything about this? I cannot find a source that states this. I love his writings. How do I defend this.
[/quote]

Ask THEM for their source.

I would start with Jurgens “The Faith of the Early Fathers, Volume 1” and then search out other reference material on the early fathers.

Writing about Ignatius Jurgens states that because the letters present so clear a view of a hierarchical church the authenticity of the letters was questioned by Protestants. However, he states the geniune nature of the letters is now almost universally accepted, having been vindicated by J B Lightfoot, Adolph von Harnack, Theodore Zahn, and FX Funk.

I think this is in the realm of “heavy duty” scholarship… so I’ll get off at this stop and wish you luck on the rest of the search.

Ignatius of Antioch was described in Eusebius’ Church History in the 4th century. It’s in Book III. You can view it under the Church Fathers section at newadvent.org

Check out

www.earlychurchfathers.com

They got lots of links to Ignatius of Antioch’s writings AND many of them are protestant sites!

They surfaced in the 16th century to disprove protestantism? Well tell that to those protestants who host them! :slight_smile:

Another outstanding book is:

Four Witnesses : The Early Church in Her Own Words
Clement of Rome
Ignatius of Antioch
Justyn Martyr
Irenaeus of Lyons

by

Rod Bennett

Ignatius San Fransisco

ISBN 0-89870-847-8

The denial of history seems to be a peculiarly modern phenomenon. It’s akin to relativism. We can’t know what truth is. We can’t know what happened. That’s nonsense.

JimG

Ignatius of Antioch did not just show up in the Reformation era. However, some longer versions of his epistles did show up at the time that are now considered forgeries and anachronistic. There are also 8 other letters that are universally considered forgeries.

His actual epistles were to the Ephesians, Magnesians, Trallians, Romans, Philadelphians, Smyrnaeans, and Polycarp, and it is believed that the shorter versions - found in books like Penguin’s Early Christian Writings are the genuine ones.

Here’s a short intro to
earlychristianwritings.com/ignatius-intro.html

Protestant Church Historian Schaff has this to say
ccel.org/s/schaff/hcc2/htm/v.xv.vii.htm

Many Protestants sing a song titiled “Faith of our Fathers.”

Humm…ask them where the faith of their fathers came from and who are their fathers. Seems to be to answer that question if they go back before the reformation and we know everyone does…well gee whiz, their fathers were Catholic or Orthodox.

However, it is my understanding that they have taken writings of some of the Early Church Fathers and made them come from a Protestant perspective. So I am not certain what the name of the book is, I just remember it being talked about on EWTN.

Pani Rose

Ask your friends if Polycarp Irenaus were also made up? They refer to Ignatius in their writings as well.

Dan

[quote=dschaertel]Ask your friends if Polycarp Irenaus were also made up? They refer to Ignatius in their writings as well.

Dan
[/quote]

Bishop Papias was a younger contemporary of the apostles and Ignatius and certainly preceded Irenaeus. I hope they would not deny his existence as well. :slight_smile:

Gerry

The easiest way to create doubt about he validity of a person and discredit their writings is to question their very existance, especially when it is nearly impossible to empirically prove it. It’s not like you are gonna go to Antioch Town Hall and ask for a copy of his birth certificate.

[quote=MiddleBear]Another outstanding book is:

Four Witnesses : The Early Church in Her Own Words
Clement of Rome
Ignatius of Antioch
Justyn Martyr
Irenaeus of Lyons

by

Rod Bennett

Ignatius San Fransisco

ISBN 0-89870-847-8
[/quote]

reading it now, starting Justin Martyr, great book!!!

I have to say that the Story of this person is incredible, what a man of faith for the Catholic Church.

[quote=katiem]I have been defending the faith on a protestant forum and several people have said we do not even know if Ignatius existed. They say his writings surfaced in the 16th century, by Rome, to disprove Protestantism. Does anyone know anything about this? I cannot find a source that states this. I love his writings. How do I defend this.
[/quote]

The authenticity of Ignatius of Antioc is not just recognized by the Catholic Church. All of the Eastern Orthodox Churches and virtually all serious Protestant scholars recognize the historical facts of his existance and writings. If want Protestant affirmation, tell them to read J B Lightfoot, or Adolph von Harnack. There are also many others.

[quote=katiem]I have been defending the faith on a protestant forum and several people have said we do not even know if Ignatius existed. They say his writings surfaced in the 16th century, by Rome, to disprove Protestantism. Does anyone know anything about this? I cannot find a source that states this. I love his writings. How do I defend this.
[/quote]

In book 7 of the constitution of the Holy apostles it mentions that Ignatius was ordained by Paul. This is in volume 7 of the early church fathers.

St. John Crysostom gave a homily on Ignatius and Babylas in volume 18 of the early church fathers.

He is mentioned several times in books 3,4, and 5 of Eusebius’ church history.

He is mentioned in the ecclesiastical history by Socrates scholasticus book VI.

All these works mention him. They are all in volume 26 of the church fathers.

[size=2]DIALOGUES–THE “ERANISTES” OR “POLYMORPHUS” OF THE BLESSED THEODORETUS, BISHOP OF CYRUS, DIALOGUE I: THE IMMUTABLE[/size]

[size=2]DIALOGUES–THE “ERANISTES” OR “POLYMORPHUS” OF THE BLESSED THEODORETUS, BISHOP OF CYRUS, DIALOGUE II: THE UNCONFOUNDED[/size]

[size=2]DIALOGUES–THE “ERANISTES” OR “POLYMORPHUS” OF THE BLESSED THEODORETUS, BISHOP OF CYRUS, DIALOGUE III: THE IMPASSIBLE[/size]

[size=2]LETTERS OF THE BLESSED THEODORET, BISHOP OF CYRUS, LETTERS LXXVI TO CXX[/size]

LETTERS OF THE BLESSED THEODORET, BISHOP OF CYRUS, LETTERS CXXI TO CL

LETTERS OF THE BLESSED THEODORET, BISHOP OF CYRUS, LETTERS CLI TO CLXXXI
[size=2]JEROME: ILLUSTRIOUS MEN [/size]

He is also mentioned here in volume 27 of the church fathers.

DE SYNODIS – COUNCILS OF ARIMINUM AND SELEUCIA (PARTS I, II & III)

In volume 28 Jerome mentions him in “the perpetual virginity of Blessed Mary, Against Helvidius”

He also quotes him against the Pelagians.

To Be Continued

St. Gregory the Great mentions him in volume 35 here

[size=2]REGISTER OF THE EPISTLES OF SAINT GREGORY THE GREAT, BOOK V[/size]

He is also mentioned several times in volume 37

[size=2]THE NICENE CREED[/size]

[size=2]SYNOD OF LAODICEA, HISTORICAL INTRODUCTION & CANONS[/size]

THE CANONS OF THE 318 HOLY FATHERS ASSEMBLED IN THE CITY OF NICE, IN BITHYNIA (CANONS I TO XX)

[size=2]THE THIRD ECUMENICAL COUNCIL–THE COUNCIL OF EPHESUS[/size]
[size=2][/size]
[size=2]THE COUNCIL OF GANGRA, HISTORICAL NOTE, SYNODICAL LETTER & CANONS[/size]

[size=2]APPENDIX CONTAINING CANONS AND RULINGS NOT HAVING CONCILIAR ORIGIN BUT APPROVED BY NAME IN CANON II OF THE SYNOD IN TRULLO.[/size]

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