Is fasting...wrong?


#1

DOCTRINE: Catholics do not eat meat on Friday’s.

**BIBLE: Doctrine that teaches to abstain from certain foods is a “Doctrine of demons” (1 Timothy 4:1-3)

**


#2

[quote=PMV]DOCTRINE: Catholics do not eat meat on Friday’s.

BIBLE: Doctrine that teaches to abstain from certain foods is a “Doctrine of demons” (1 Timothy 4:1-3)

[/quote]

The catholic Church does not teach anything about abstaining from certain foods. Once again what you are referring to is not a doctrine but a discipline. Alot of your questions I think are confusing DOCTRINE with Discipline. The Church teaches catholics the discipline of abstaining from meat on Fridays in **LENT **as an act of self-denial. It is a small sacrifice complared to the supreme sacrifice Jesus made for us. Jesus himself fasted and prayed for forty days in the desert.


#3

We used to not eat meat on every Friday.

This is a discipline, not a doctrine.

A doctrine is an article of faith which we must believe as Catholics.

A discipline is a way to practice a particular article of faith.

Since Vatican II, we fast from meat on Fridays only during Lent.

Some folks don’t realize that during the rest of the year (not Lent), on Fridays we are to do an act of mercy or compassion instead of not eating meat.


#4

1 Now the Spirit manifestly saith that in the last times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to spirits of error and doctrines of devils, 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy and having their conscience seared, 3 Forbidding to marry, to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving by the faithful and by them that have known the truth. 4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be rejected that is received with thanksgiving:

In context, the problem isn’t with fasting, but with the division of edibles into clean and unclean, which is offensive to God who made all things good.

See: Asceticism

Justin


#5

I’ll just repeat what others have already written: abstaining from meat is not, and never was, a “doctrine”. Also, the abstaining from meat is not done because Catholics regard the foods as “unclean”, which is what Paul is referring to. Abstention is simply done as an act of self-denial, a denial of something that is good.

Veronica Anne, let me clarify something you stated: you wrote: “Some folks don’t realize that during the rest of the year (not Lent), on Fridays we are to do an act of mercy or compassion instead of not eating meat.”

Actually, it’s not “instead of” eating meat. On Fridays we are to make some penitential observance of Christ’s Passion, and it can take any number of forms. One can abstain from meat, or fast, or some other act of self-denial, or, as you suggest, do some act of compassion or mercy. Vatican ll did not do away with the Friday observance, nor say that one shouldn’t abstain from meat. Vatican ll merely widened the scope of penitential observances, in effect saying that we can choose our own. People are free to abstain from meat if they wish.


#6

PMV,

As long as we’re picking bits out of the Epistles, 1 Timothy 4:7 tells us to “Avoid profane and silly myths.”

I hope you are willing to keep an open mind and learn the TRUTH about the Catholic faith on these boards, rather than abide by the myths which you apparently have been taught.


#7

[quote=PMV]DOCTRINE: Catholics do not eat meat on Friday’s.

BIBLE: Doctrine that teaches to abstain from certain foods is a “Doctrine of demons” (1 Timothy 4:1-3)

[/quote]

If fasting was wrong, Jesus would not have fasted for 40 days in Matt 4:2. If fasting was wrong, Jesus would not have told his disciples how to fast in Matt 6:16-18. If fasting was wrong, early Christians would not have fasted in Acts 13:2-3 and 14:23.


#8

[quote=joshua1]The catholic Church does not teach anything about abstaining from certain foods. Once again what you are referring to is not a doctrine but a discipline. Alot of your questions I think are confusing DOCTRINE with Discipline. The Church teaches catholics the discipline of abstaining from meat on Fridays in **LENT **as an act of self-denial. It is a small sacrifice complared to the supreme sacrifice Jesus made for us. Jesus himself fasted and prayed for forty days in the desert.
[/quote]

But,when I was growing up, it was a sin to eat meat on Fridays. Or so they told us little children…


#9

I do not believe these myths, but would rather like to find some good answers to give to a Protestant who is challenging Catholics with the issues I posted. Of course I believe in Catholicism; my point is to just clear some issues up that Protestants have with us.
I wonder what that verse actually meant then…


#10

[quote=PMV]I do not believe these myths, but would rather like to find some good answers to give to a Protestant who is challenging Catholics with the issues I posted. Of course I believe in Catholicism; my point is to just clear some issues up that Protestants have with us.
I wonder what that verse actually meant then…
[/quote]

The verse is in reference to Jewish Law which prohibits eating pork, shell fish, etc.


#11

Hey PMV I’d like to suggest a good book for you to read : Catholicism and Fundamentalism
Karl Keating
You can order it at:
shop.catholic.com/cgi-local/SoftCart.exe/online-store/scstore/p-B0121.html?L+scstore+jdcz6288ff9e129e+1101366240
May the peace and love of our Lord, Jesus the Christ, be with you
Tom


#12

Okay, this is mostly a reply to Veronic Anne and SP38. This is from the most recent issue of This Rock:

"Regarding the norms for fast and abstinence, the Code of Canon Law makes this provision for the national bishops’ conferences: ‘The episcopal conference can determine more particular ways in which fasting and abstinence are to be observed. In place of abstinence or fasting it can substitute, in whole or in part, other forms of penance, especially works of charity and exercises of piety’ (CIC 1253, emphasis added).

“Accordingly, in 1966 the National Conference of Catholic Bishops decided that ‘Friday should be in each week something of what Lent is the entire year. For this reason we urge all to prepare for that weekly Easter that comes with each Sunday by freely making of every Friday a day of self-denial and mortification in prayerful remembrance of the passion of Jesus Christ; among the works of voluntary self-denial and personal penance that we especially commend to our people for the future observance of Friday, even though we hereby terminate the traditional law of abstinence as binding under pain of sin, as the sole prescribed means of observing Friday, we give first place to abstinence from flesh meat. We do so in the hope that the Catholic community will ordinarily continue to abstain from meat by free choice as formerly we did in obedience to Church law’ (Complimentary Norms on Penance and Abstinence, emphasis in original).”

So the “act of mercy or compassion” is not “instead of eating meat,” unless one chooses to do so. Abstinence and fasting are still preferred, and some act of penance is required of the faithful on Friday’s throughout the year. In my family, my wife and I fast every Friday, and never eat meat on Friday’s. My kids eat 3 suqares, but abstain from snack and junk foods, as well as meat.

For those unfamiliar with the practice of fast and abstinence, it may help to think of it as spiritual exercise. Whenever my stomach grumbles on a Friday, I think of the sacrifice Christ made for me on the cross. My fast and abstinence is a constant check on my own pride and vanity, and helps me achieve deeper communion with Our Lord and Our Faith.


#13

[quote=SP38]But,when I was growing up, it was a sin to eat meat on Fridays. Or so they told us little children…
[/quote]

I hear what you are saying and Im not sure how to answer. I converted long after the changes of vatican II. The only question in my mind, did they teach it as a mortal sin or a venial sin? TO tell you the truth, why did they remove the obligation from every friday to fridays just during Lent any way. Why the change?


#14

[quote=SP38]But,when I was growing up, it was a sin to eat meat on Fridays. Or so they told us little children…
[/quote]

But the sin wasn’t in the eating of meat per se, but rather it would have been a sin of disobedience.


#15

A biblical basis for abstaining from meat as a sign of penance for our sins is found in the book of Daniel, where the prophet mourns over the sins of Israel:

“In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia . . . ‘I, Daniel, mourned for three weeks. I ate no choice food; no meat or wine touched my lips; and I used no lotions at all until the three weeks were over.’” (Daniel 10:1-3)

PMV, how about you provide the name of the person, or the name of the book that you are reading. I can assure you it is very toxic to your faith and it will jeaprodize your ability to reason.

Anti-Catholic literature distorts the bible in order to justify their false teachings and hatred for the Catholic Church. They play on peoples ignorance and fear in order to make lots of money.Some is satanic in nature, so if you would be so kind as to reveal who they are, or the name of the book or web site you have beern exposed to, then we can discuss the evil nature of such things in general.

I have been observing anti-Catholic “bible-Christian” hatred for some time on the internet, and I am very concerned for you.

Please keep this in mind. THERE IS NOT ONE “BIBLE-CHRISTIAN” WEB SITE THAT TEACHES THE TRUTH ABOUT CATHOLICISM. Some are more viscious than others, and some are just plain evil.

kepha1


#16

[quote=PMV]DOCTRINE: Catholics do not eat meat on Friday’s.

BIBLE: Doctrine that teaches to abstain from certain foods is a “Doctrine of demons” (1 Timothy 4:1-3)

[/quote]

Paul is referring to abstinence and any other practice that is performed apart from Christ’s teachings. Fasting, on the other hand, is done in obedience to Christ’s teachings of taking up our cross and following Him, by participating in His sufferings so we can share in His glory. When citing this verse, these Protestants do not explain why Jesus prophesied that his followers would fast and gave instructions on how to fast.

A biblical basis for abstaining from meat as a sign of penance for our sins is found in the book of Daniel, where the prophet mourns over the sins of Israel:

“In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia . . . ‘I, Daniel, mourned for three weeks. I ate no choice food; no meat or wine touched my lips; and I used no lotions at all until the three weeks were over.’” (Daniel 10:1-3)

You need to be on alert, PMV, for anti-Catholic literaure: books, web sites, pamphlets that distort the Bible in order to justify hatred for the Catholic Church. There is not one “Bible-Christian” web site or book that teaches the truth about the Catholic Church.

I have been observing Catholic hatred over the internet for some time, and I am really concerned for you. I have seen the same fundamentalist scripts on the internet over and over again, so please, tell me the name ofthe source where you get all this false information. Celibacy, fasting. Mary and the saints is usually next, they will call the Church the Whore of Babylon. Have you seen that one yet? Oh, the Pope, he’s the anti-Christ. He deceives the world by telling all of us to follow Jesus. What a deception!!!

Think, PMV. And stop reading that hateful satanic garbage.

kepha1


#17

PMV,

What sort of “Catholic” are you?

Pio


#18

A Catholic’s answer to any instance of an evangelical or Protestant taking phrases of Scripture out of context would be that it is not for individual men to interpret Scripture. The reason is, there are social and historic contexts that render literal language ineffective in some places, and altogether ludicrous in others. Without a solid understanding of all the factors surrounding a piece of Scripture, the Scripture itself is useless. The Church is the only reliable source to turn to for learning what Scripture means, because of her unbroken line of apostolic succession and years of tradition dating back to the time when Jesus actually walked on the Earth.


#19

[quote=Cherub]A Catholic’s answer to any instance of an evangelical or Protestant taking phrases of Scripture out of context would be that it is not for individual men to interpret Scripture. The reason is, there are social and historic contexts that render literal language ineffective in some places, and altogether ludicrous in others. Without a solid understanding of all the factors surrounding a piece of Scripture, the Scripture itself is useless. The Church is the only reliable source to turn to for learning what Scripture means, because of her unbroken line of apostolic succession and years of tradition dating back to the time when Jesus actually walked on the Earth.
[/quote]

I would only add that our Lord Jesus the Christ promised His Church would be led to all truth, not any individuals, not each follower, only His Church.


#20

[quote=hlgomez]PMV,

What sort of “Catholic” are you?

Pio
[/quote]

I seriously do not know straight out what kind of Catholic I am, because I was baptized Roman but confirmed Byzantine. I know this is rare, and I don’t excactly know the reason, but that’s what happened. Baptized Roman; confirmed - what am I, Roman Catholic or Byzantine? I’d like a straight out answer.


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