Is it "lucky" to die in a state of grace


Latin - We all, with just a very few exceptions, are imbued with both choice and the knowledge of good and evil/right and wrong; God will not {as much as He loves us all, interfere with our choice to do as we choose.

The ‘pre-destination’ you refer to is one in which our choices in this life play their part.


God does NOT interfere with our free wills and our choices, God AIDS our free wills TO CHOSE THE GOOD, without God’s aids/ gifts of efficacious graces we would chose ONLY acts of sins.

Our salvation is God’s gifts of efficacious graces, God gives His gifts of salvation whoever He chooses to give, it is SOLELY up to God.
We don’t have the ability to go to Christ to save us, the choice is NOT OURS it is Christ’s choice.

John 6:44; No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them.

While St. Thomas says that man turns to God by his own free will, he explains that free-will can only be turn to God, when God turns it.

John 15:16; You did not chose Me, but I chose you.

Jesus is very clear, our fates are not in us but our fates are in God and in His choices, I believe God’s Universal Salvific Will, I also believe He has chosen everyone of us.
Do you believe MountCarmel, our salvation is God’s GIFT and He gives it whoever He chooses, regardless whatever we do, we CANNOT obtain God’s gifts?

This is the way God prepares us to say YES to His gift of salvation.

CCCS 1990-1991; Justification is God’s free gift which detaches man from enslavement to sin and reconciles him to God.

Justification is also our acceptance of God’s righteousness. In this gift, faith, hope, charity, and OBEDIENCE TO GOD’S WILL are given to us.
CCCS 1996-1998; Justification comes from grace (God’s free and undeserved help) and is given to us to respond to his call.

This call to eternal life is supernatural, coming TOTALLY from God’s decision and surpassing ALL power of human intellect and will. End quote.

I hope MountCarmel now you believe, it is God’s choice and we FREELY SAY yes to our salvation because in His gift includes faith, hope, charity, and OBEDIENCE TO GOD’S WILL.

We are not puppets because with His efficacious graces God enlightens our minds end we freely choose the good.
Our salvation and our predestination is God’s gifts, it is SOLELY God’s decision without regard to any future supernatural merits (prævisa merita), our life in this side of eternity plays big role on our glories and our positions in heaven but plays ZERO role on our predestination.

Please remember: You DID NOT chose Me, but I chose you.
God bless


I believe Oliver109: you just summed up correctly our situation.

I wonder about the majority of Catholics believe Thomism or Molinism.

I personally believe Thomism + God’s Universal Salvific Will = God saves everyone.
The most celebrated Catholic theologians; John Salza, Fr. William G. Most, etc. teaches Thomism, their teachings are excellent.


The Mystery of Predestination by John Salza. Page 83.

In the light of the teachings of Scripture as explained by Church councils and St. Thomas, the Molinist position appears incorrect.
Grace, Predestination, and the Salvific Will of God by William G. Most. Page 369.

Actually, the Molinistic theories owe more to speculation than to revelation.

I never heard a Catholic priest teaching Molinism but I read and heard many Catholic theologians who are teaching Thomism, some of them teaching Thomism + God’s Universal Salvific Will = God saves everyone.

Then who are those who are teaching Molinism?
God bless


The mention of dying in a state of grace gives me , on this Feast of St Francis Xavier , the chance to mention the Novena of Grace in Honour of St Francis Xavier , a novena I have been praying annually for the last 60 plus years .

The primary intention of this novena is expressed in the novena prayer : " I implore thee to obtain for me, through thy powerful intercession, the greatest of all blessings–that of living and dying in the state of grace . "


You really don’t get it - while it is totally true that salvation is ‘God’s Gift’, He also requires us to play our part in accepting that salvation, not by only paying lip service to your belief in Him, BUT by putting ‘our money where our mouths are - so to speak’ - by being a living example of a loving follower - by making proper use of those ‘talents’ He has endowed us with.


I’m sorry MountCarmel I don’t know from where you get the idea that I don’t believe what you have written above.

I have the same view on the subject.

By the aids of efficacious graces we do our works, NOT because we have to but because we love to, out of sheer love for the glory of God and out of sheer love for others.

Our Christian supernatural works are really important, not because we believe our works saves us (God is our savior) but because we want do it out of love.

God bless


Correct me if I am wrong, but one of the promises of the Rosary is that a faithful prayer of the Rosary (regular use, don’t believe it has to be daily but regularly) will either never die in a state of mortal sin or will never die without having a chance to confess this mortal sin, whether confession or last rites. So if you are praying the rosary then it is a promise so its not just by chance. That said it is a grace from God to have this promise so we are lucky to have merited this grace!

Come Holy Spirit, kindle the hearts of your faithful and you will renew the face of the Earth,

  • Matt


Yes - when it comes to loving God and loving our fellow ‘man’, Jesus Himself said this was the way to eternal life, when He was quizzed. Indeed, it is all about Love, since God is the ultimate expression of Love - including the expression of that Love through His works.


This question may slide well into a thread I just created:


But I think the problem is the finititude of man’s deliberation leading to an eternity of damnation.

Because of the OP’s understanding that someone goes in and out and in and out of the state of grace, it suggests many people are hardly ever THAT determinate about their final destination.

Maybe the issue is how we understand mortal sin. Maybe it’s not THAT easy to “fall” into.


Thank you for your common sense response, few people i believe intend to offend God forever! What i dont understand is this idea where you are “frozen” in your sins at death, we commit mortal sins but i am sure we never intend to die in a sinful state but it happens inevitably… Will God have mercy on those people?


I believe, at our judgment our love what is really count.

God bless


This is one thing I cannot possibly wrap my head around that hitler confesses at the last minute he can go to heaven but Mother Teresa commits a mortal sin on her deathbed she’s doomed to hell. I personally don’t believe that.


Yes, the Dominicans and various other Saints have held this belief about the rosary and how powerful it is . I think it’s still considered private revelation and so people can choose to believe it or not. It’s not a requirement of the faithful.


I’m gonna jump in here. I think that 1 mortal sin “could” send a person to hell but I don’t think it means that 1 mortal sin always does.

CCC - 1037 God predestines no one to go to hell; for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end.

I think this last line is pretty important to remember. What does “persistence in it until the end” mean?? Does it mean somebody who commits a mortal sin and doesn’t make it to confession? Does it mean a person who struggles with certain mortal sins but keeps confessing them and one day dies before he makes it to confession?

If 2 people commit mortal sins and they both die and person A had no intention or desire of confessing the sin but person B would’ve if he had the opportunity, are they both in the same boat?


This is why we have purgatory. And death bed mortal sin probably doesn’t have consent of the will or knowledge involved because you are about to die, probably not in a good state of mind


I take this persistence to be after you die, at the Final Judgement are we still persistent in our errored ways due to pride?

This is Sinning Against the Holy Spirit which Jesus says is the only unforgivable sin because we chose the devil over God after God has been revealed to us.

“And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.” - Matthew 12:31


Yes CCC 1037 says that.

But the crux of the matter of 1037 is:
God predestined from all eternity His elect to heaven by an absolute decree and without regard to any future supernatural merits, and then, in consequence of this decree, decided to give them all the graces necessary for its accomplishment (prævisa merita).
Furthermore, at their Initial Justification every elect received God’s special efficacious grace The Gift of Final Perseverance, this special gift of grace INFALLIBLE protect every elect from to die in the state of mortal sin, without this special grace NO ONE can be saved (DE FIDE).
Furthermore, The Catholic Encyclopedia Predestination of the elect says; the rest of the human race predestined from all eternity not to go to heaven.

With official words: Merely implies the absolute will not to grant the bliss of heaven, though not positively predestined to hell, yet they are absolutely predestined not to go to heaven (cf. above, I, B).
As you see Mtdobbs, in the light of Catholic Soteriology 1037 comes to the light, which is:
According to the Catholic Encyclopedia Predestination of the elect (which is a de fide dogma) if we are counted among the predestined to heaven we will infallible die in the state of grace, if we are counted among the predestined not to go to heaven we will all infallible die in the state of mortal sin. – Set from all eternity.
I personally believe, God predestined to heaven every one of us, which is God’s Universal Salvific Will, and the whole Church (1058) praying for the fulfilment of it.
According to Catholic Soteriology, THERE IS NO SALVATION apart from predestination to heaven.

Everyone who are familiar with Catholic Soteriology knows the above Theological Fact.NO predestination to heaven, NO salvation.
God bless


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