Is modesty for girls the same type of thing in terms of guys?

I understand that if a girl took her shirt off (with a bras on of course) that it would be a sin, right?

Well, suppose that a guy took his shirt off while playing a sport with other guys. Would that be a sin like it is for girls?

No.

What about strapless shirts for girls, are they ok? I’m talking about shirts where there is no cleavage or huge amounts of bare back.

No as in…

Great thing about Christianity is that all rules apply the same to men and women.

That means its no more excusable for a guy to take off his shirt than it is for a woman.
(We of course realise that women’s breasts are more sexual than a man’s… so she has her bra on and he has nothing on and thats the same).
No more excusable for a guy to look at porn or masturbate than it is for a woman.
No more excusable for a woman to gossip than it is for a man.
the same goes for everything else.

The other day I saw a bunch of guys with no shirts on at the bus stop. I thought: “where is the moderacy? why are they not respecting their surroundings?” And yes… it actually does tempt some women to have dirty thoughts when confronted with such nudity in the public space.

I am not against bikinis and bathing shorts on the beach… there is a place where its alright to be less moderate than on a street or in a church…

If a woman were to take her shirt off for the purpose of being provocative to men in the room, that could be sinful.

If the woman just spilled hot coffee and pulls the shirt off in reaction to the burn, that would not be.

For anyone, it is about intent and audience.

:confused: :shrug:

I remember a guy in my neighborhood back in PA, who would mow the lawn without his shirt on…and the summers never got that hot outside. lol He was a younger guy–maybe late 20’s, but I remember a few of my female neighbor friends who would comment that they would have a glass of afternoon tea and ‘take in the view.’ (meaning him) I didn’t like it. I’m not a prude, but my eyes are meant to look at my husband in that way…and we are called not to look at others with lust, even our spouses! Now, there is healthy sexual attraction between two spouses, but it should be reserved for spouses.

I also think it’s gross to be honest, when I see a guy jogging with no shirt on…who do they think they are anyways? Are you so much more hotter (I mean temperature wise haha) than the rest of us that you have to remove your shirt to exercise? :rolleyes:

Anyways…I agree…men should keep their shirts on–unless they are swimming, at the beach, or in a boxing ring…keep your shirts on.

How can a woman clad only in a bra be any different that a woman wearing a bikini?

Last time I checked, the church didn’t list bikini tops as inherently sinful.

The human body and the human sexual function is not inherently sinful. If it was, the pope shouldn’t go anywhere near the Sistine Chapel.

true–there’s a place and time for everything…on the beach…a man without a shirt…a woman in a bikini–not wearing a bikini top while at the park…or a man without a shirt walking down the street. I guess the Church doesn’t say anything about a person just being tacky.:smiley:

What about those societies were the women run around topless, such as in Africa? I seem to recall a pic of an African woman who was dressed in native dress (topless) receiving Holy Communion from our late Holy Father. I wouldn’t know how to go about finding the picture though. :blush: I would think it would depend on the culture.

Here in the US it (obviously) is.

Why is it that the mere thought of the human body has become so “dirty” that people are inventing sins where none exist. A shirtless woman is not sinning. A shirtless man is not sinning. Look at any renaissance art lately? The human body is an object of beauty; we are not Puritans.

Hehe… not puritans, huh?
You remind me of the letters I have had from politicians lately - ‘moderate socialists’ that have let our country be infected with pornography and the “beautiful naked human female body” on every street corner so far and who have now said women are allowed to bathe without covering their breasts in the swimminghalls in Denmark’s capital. As I pointed out that neutralising the human body and denying its sacredness as well as its sexual power is illogical as well as morally wrong… the elected politicians wrote back to me and called me a prude and … yes… a puritan. Maybe I really am a puritan.

Yes I do believe its a sin for men and women to show themselves naked to people who are not their spouses.

who have now said women are allowed to bathe without covering their breasts in the swimminghalls in Denmark’s capital.

Ack! Not bare breasts!!! Whatever next?! :rolleyes: There is a difference between acknowledging the human body as a beautiful and sacred creation and using it for obscene purposes. The problem is where to draw the line.

Yes I do believe its a sin for men and women to show themselves naked to people who are not their spouses.

Feel however you like; the Church disagrees with you. In holding that position you are also declaring many of the works of Michelangelo, Raphael, etc… sinful. Yep, Puritan sounds about right.

Actually I dont think the Church disagrees with me. See, you keep saying “Michelangelo etc” as some kind of mantra… but you forget that those are pictures… there are no naked real men or women walking around inside the sixtine chapel… or in Sct. Peters basilica for that matter. On the contrary… in many churches you cant even show your knees… so whats that all about? we are all puritans ?

I’m gonna have to agree with Grace on this one. The paintings you are referring to are just that - paintings - and no one that sees them is going to look lustfully at them. I can guarantee you, though, that if girls started walking around in bras or less, guys will be spending a lot more time outdoors…

“Maybe I am a puritan”

And you have that right. Each of us has to decide for ourselves where we draw the line when it comes to appreciation of the human body. Some people can walk through a stadium of naked people and not be bothered. Others can hear the number six and it gets them thinking … Especially if you’re thirteen or so. :slight_smile:

Weren’t the puritans trying to break away from the Church’s authority? Thus…they were ‘purifying themselves’ from Catholicism? I saw something about this a few weeks ago on the history channel.:confused:

So are strapless shirts ok you think?

For me personally yes. I see nothing sexy in strapless shirts or bare arms… I don’t think cleavage is okay though.
But I respect that there are limits to both men and women and how they should dress… fx. not showing their torso… in order for the weak ones to be helped.

But I am a girl and I never ever knew that guys had a problem with these things… until I became a Christian and went to a pilgrimage. I wore a very beautiful white dress with no sleeves and a “very catholic” man talked to me as though as to a prostitute infront of a whole bunch of people.
On the same trip I was told to wear some longer pants by another catholic man, who was at the same time wearing no shirt at all…

at that time I found out two things: male purity can be a cover for an underlying desire to dominate woman … the other is that “for those who are clean, all things are clean”. I knew that the men I encountered had problems in themselves and that if they had had pure eyes they would not have found it necessary to treat me like they did… they were the ones having impure hearts and minds, not I… They were weak, not I… I was naive and stupid for not knowing the male “visual” thinking until I was 20 years old… but impure and trying to seduce anyone, No Way.

I’ve been reading these posts and they have been really interesting. Their seems to be so many views that I’m confused. But that’s alright–I appreciate that you are replying.

Just to make things clear:
So its wrong for a guy to take his shirt off during sports practice?

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