Is saying prayers like Chaplet of Saint Michael NOT a sin ??

Hi,

I was thinking about this prayer Chaplet of Saint Michael I wanted to pray it but found this prayer a bit strange after a while.

Namely, I remember that it is mentioned in the bible quite clearly that it is FORBIDDEN to pray to angels.

Now, I wonder were they talking about FALLEN angels or what ? Think about all those psychics who claim they receive special blessings from angels which are obviously not those angels who stayed in paradise.

Or are those angels in general that the bible talks about. I mean angels who serve God are NOT allowed to be treated as gods. They serve God and if God allows for something then they do it, heal someone or something like that.

It’s God’s will not their.

Also, one more thing seems suspicious, namely that this archangel told Antonia he would like to be honored. From what I understand Angels are very humble and here he somes and tells her that he’d like to be honored. Strange but maybe it’s just me…

What do you think about this all ? I mean I don’t want to commit a sin.

Hi,

I was thinking about this prayer Chaplet of Saint Michael I wanted to pray it but found this prayer a bit strange after a while.

Namely, I remember that it is mentioned in the bible quite clearly that it is FORBIDDEN to pray to angels.

Now, I wonder were they talking about FALLEN angels or what ? Think about all those psychics who claim they receive special blessings from angels which are obviously not those angels who stayed in paradise.

Or are those angels in general that the bible talks about. I mean angels who serve God are NOT allowed to be treated as gods. They serve God and if God allows for something then they do it, heal someone or something like that.

It’s God’s will not their.

Also, one more thing seems suspicious, namely that this archangel told Antonia he would like to be honored. From what I understand Angels are very humble and here he somes and tells her that he’d like to be honored. Strange but maybe it’s just me…

What do you think about this all ? I mean I don’t want to commit a sin.

Where? I am not being argumentative, I really want to know. I know the Bible does clearly state not to worship anyone or anything other than God, but I really don’t know where it says not to ask for the help or intercession of the angels.

We are not to worship angels, but we can ask them to intercede for us.

**Not a sin, from Fr. Serpa:

The angels are spiritual beings who have a free will and an intellect that is far superior to our. The evil ones dwell in Hell and the holy ones dwell in Heaven and are therefor considered to be saints. Whoever is in heaven is a saint. God uses them as messengers, guardians and all-around helpers to us—as well as reflecting His glory.

In the book of Tobit 12:12 the Archangel Raphael said to Tobias, “So now when you and Sarah prayed, it was I who brought and read the record of your prayer before the glory of the Lord, and likewise whenever you would bury the dead.” In Tobit 12: 14b-16 we read further, “And at the same time God sent me to heal you and Sarah your daughter-in-law. I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand ready and enter before the glory of the Lord. The two of them were shaken; they fell face down, for they were afraid.”

For more, see “Angel” at the original Catholic Encyclopedia**

Please tell us where in the bible you have found this.

Would the Church give a prayer to the Church if it were a sin?

First, where do you find that praying to angels is forbidden? I don’t think I’ve ever read that part (may have missed it).

Second, in Revelation 8 we see that angels are taking incense (which are the prayers of the faithful) to God, just like in Revelation 3 says the same thing, but with elders in heaven. Why would they be receiving the prayers if the prayers were not directed towards them? I would suggest looking at the Catechism for more on prayers to the Saints.

Pray the Chaplet of St Michael, it’s very powerful.

We are not praying TO Saint Michael (or any of the saints), we are asking them to pray to God for us and by honoring them, we honor God because He has made them.

It depends on which definition of prayer you are using. The generic definition of “to ask of” does apply because we are asking the saints to pray for us. Prayer as in “to ask of a deity”, which is what most people today (especially many non-Catholic Christians) think of when the word pray/prayer is mentioned, is not in play with the saints with the exception of them praying to God.

This is a dangerous distinction to try to make, even though I understand your point. We ARE praying to St. Michael. That is, we ARE directing our words and thoughts to him. Nothing wrong with that. What we are NOT doing (and what certain flawed Protestant notions of prayer would falsely accuse us of doing) is directing to St. Michael that worship and adoration which is due to God alone.

It was actually about worshiping, but I thought that if you pray to someone you worship him. And if one adds that all healers/those who do occult stuff claim they have some kind of contact with angels from whom they get those super powers (yet you know they are obviously not religious) … then you know… I simply got suspicious. BTW I do pray to Mary, some saints but feel uncomfortable about praying to angels when I’m not sure.

I know that when you ask someone else to ask GOD it’s OK and not sin it’s just that I can’t find much info about that Antonia to be honest. Also archangel Michael telling Antonia what HE likes and what he doesn’t like. I mean angels of God are very humble, they don’t say what THEY like , they say what God likes. Fallen angels on the other hand are full of pride and it’s always what they want that matters the most.

It’s a bit unusual if you compare her to say St. Faustina. Lots of information/books about that great nun.

Here’s the quotation I was thinking about

St. John kneeling in front of Angel Rev 19, 10

Then I knelt at his feet to worship him, but he said to me, ‘Never do that: I am your fellow-servant and the fellow-servant of all your brothers who have in themselves the witness of Jesus. God alone you must worship.’ The witness of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Well, now you know that it not true.

Well, we cannot really help what false religions do. That does not mean we need to stop doing what is perfectly legitimate.

Angels are Saints. St. Michael’s feast day in the Church is September 29 along with Sts. Gabriel and Raphael. The Feast of the Guardian Angels is Oct 2.

I think you need to focus on what the **CHURCH **teaches about angels-- read the Catechism. It is also instructive that they have official feast days in the Church AND that prayers to the angels are also official prayers of the Church.

Which has nothing to do with praying to angels.

The Chaplet of St. Michael the Archangel

Since I did not know the Chaplet, I took the liberty of looking it up (linked above). It is so interspersed with Our Fathers and Hail Marys and concludes with a prayer to The Almighty and Everlasting God, that I really don’t see how this could be construed as being directed solely at Saint Michael the Archangel.

Thank you though, kmax, for your indirect introduction to the Chaplet, since I probably wouldn’t have found out about it if it hadn’t come up in this thread. :slight_smile:

no problem :wink: just remember that this is a PRIVATE revelation and Church was always very skeptical about them. Even John of the Cross claimed that private revelations are rather a risk that can be brought to mystic life and stated it can cause pride.

Also there was a case where private revelation was in fact demonic:

A common demonic source of false revelations is demonic possession. Satan can appear like an angel of light and rebuke people for their sins, and mimic the miracles and revelations of God. The most famous case is Magdalena de la Cruz, through whom Satan uttered false prophecies and fabricated miracles, including uncreated light, stigmata, levitation, ecstasy, and extraordinary fasting (she allegedly survived solely on the Eucharist).

**Here’s more **if you’re interested: Click me and Click me **Info about Antónia d’Astónaco: **Click me

Nevertheless most revelations are 100% real. As far as chapletsgo, I like the most, Chaplet of Divine Mercy, Rosary of the Holy Wounds, Rosary of the Seven Sorrows, Rosary and of course I like saints that had these revelations :slight_smile:

In Psalm 103 we pray, “Bless the Lord, O you his angels, you mighty ones who do his word, hearkening to the voice of his word! Bless the Lord, all his hosts, his ministers that do his will!” (Ps. 103:20-21). And in Psalm 148 we pray, “Praise the Lord! Praise the Lord from the heavens, praise him in the heights! Praise him, all his angels, praise him, all his host!” (Ps. 148:1-2)

Not only do those in heaven pray with us, they also pray for us. In Revelation, John sees that “the twenty-four elders [the leaders of the people of God in heaven] fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints” (Rev. 5:8). Thus the saints in heaven offer to God the prayers of the saints on earth.

Angels do the same thing: “An] angel came and stood at the altar [in heaven] with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God” (Rev. 8:3-4).

Jesus himself warned us not to mess with small children because their guardian angels have guaranteed intercessory access to the Father: “See that you do not despise one of these little ones; for I tell you that in heaven their angels always see the face of my Father who is in heaven.” (Matt. 18:10).

Tobit 12:12 So when you and Sarah prayed, it was I who brought the record of your prayer into God’s glorious presence, and likewise when you used to bury the dead. (said the Angel Raphael)

And in Joshua 5:14, “Neither,” he replied, “but as commander of the army of the LORD I have now come.” Then Joshua fell facedown to the ground in reverence, and asked him, “What message does my Lord have for his servant?”

If bowing to others out of reverence is a sin, how do protestants explain: Joshua 5:14, Ruth 2:8-10, 2 Kings 4:37, Genesis 19:1. 1 Samuel 24:8, 1 Kings 1:16, 25, Genesis 33:3, Genesis 27:29?

And if asking others to intercede for us is a sin, why does S.t Paul ask others to pray for him in his Epistles? why doesn’t he just pray directly to God?

A great book I would recommend on this topic is, "Any Friend of God is A Friend of Mine, by Patrick Madrid.

I think the most likely answer is the John was a little disoriented and confused the angel for Christ and the angel was just trying to re-orient him, not condemning him for idolatry. Imagine yourself witnessing the events of the Book of Revelation in person and I bet you would be a little disoriented too! It would be absurd for John, an Apostle, for no reason whatsoever to deliberately engage in idolatry and give adoration to the angel that is due to God alone. The angel is not accusing him of idolatry.

I forgot to mention a websites which teaches devotion to the Angels therealpresence.org/archives/Angelology/Angelology_018.htm & opusangelorum.org

Devotion to the Angels

by Fr. John A. Hardon, S.J.

I do not hesitate to say that devotion to the angels is one of the hallmarks of being a true Christian. It was an angel who first appeared to our Lady to announce her conception of Jesus Christ at Nazareth. It was an angel who appeared to the shepherds at Bethlehem to tell them that the Messiah had been born. It was an angel who consoled our Lord in His agony in the Garden of Gethsemane. It was an angel who told the women who visited the tomb in which Christ had been buried, that the Savior was risen from the dead. It was angels who told the disciples staring into the sky at Christ’s ascension that He would return from heaven to earth even as He had ascended from earth to heaven. It was an angel who delivered Peter from prison where he was chained for his proclaiming Jesus as the Messiah. It will be angels who will announce the coming of Christ on the last day of time and the first day of eternity to judge the living and the dead.

What devotion to the angel means:

Devotion to the angels means venerating the angels.

Devotion to the angels means praying to the angels.

Devotion to the angels means promoting the apostolate to the angels.

Devotion to the angels means imitating the angels.

Praying to the angels means talking with the angels; telling them how we admire their nearness to God and look forward to joining them after we finish our trial here on earth. Praying to the angels is thanking them for the many favors they have done for us over the years and how much we appreciate their angelic care for our needs. Praying to the angels is asking them for what we need. Certainly we could go directly to God with our petitions. But we know what sinners we are and how close the angels are to the all holy One. We are therefore sure that their nearness to God makes them powerful intercessors on our behalf. Praying to the angels is begging them to plead for us at the throne of the merciful God whom we have offended and from whom we hope to obtain His forgiving mercy.

All of this is locked up in the single phrase, “Praying to the angels”. You might change the preposition if you wish, and say that we pray through the angels to God, being assured that their nearness to Him makes their influence with Him greater than would be our addressing God by ourselves. If Christ in His agony was strengthened by an angel of the Lord, who are we to think we can dispense with angelic assistance in our lives?

No, I don’t think so. Can you please give us the passage that says that? (Book, chapter and verse).

All through the Bible there are examples of people talking to the Angels and even Archangels like Raphael, Gabriel and it is always portrayed as a good thing.

I must say I was shocked when I read your post. I pray for the angels help all the time and love this chaplet. What bothers you about this prayer? It’s an intercessory prayer, much like many others where we will address a Saint in heaven and ask them to pray for us. There certainly is no worship involved. I pray this chaplet every day, if I can.

By the intercession of St. Michael and the celestial choir of Seraphim MAY THE LORD MAKE us worthy to burn with the fire of perfect charity. 1 Our Father, 3 Hail Mary’s

By the intercession of St. Michael and the celestial choir of Cherubim MAY THE LORD GRANT US the grace to leave the ways of sin and run in the paths of Christian perfection… etc, etc

The end prayer is particularly great which sums up that God has appointed the Archangel St. Michael as a prince of the Holy Church of Jesus Christ and through God’s mercy and desire for salvation for all men, He has given us St. Michael and the other angels, to deliver us from evil. This talking about the unseen spiritual battle that comes against us constantly-- not delivering us from evil in the sense of salvation (Christ’s role).

I have always thought of any intercessory prayer as praying to the Lord through a saint. I ask for that saint to join me in my prayer and give it to the Lord from their righteous hands-- for any saint in heaven is more righteous than I am and the prayer of the righteous avails much! However, it does take the assumption that God has given that saint the power to hear our prayer which many protestants don’t believe in that. Personally, I think God giving saints the ability to hear us and intercede is much like a charism is for us. If we can receive the gift of tongues or the power to heal or work miracles (see 1 Cor 12) then I reason that it is certainly possible that God’s heavenly army has been given all sorts of grace to help Him save souls.

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