Islam or christianity which is true and why do you believe it is


#111

What he taught has been subjected to 2000 years of scrutiny by brilliant scholars, philosophers and theologians.

So, when you say “We don’t really know what he taught,” you need to speak ONLY for yourself.

Clearly, you seem to have no clue what he taught.


#112

Jesus is not simply a prophet; he is God made Man. He is the ONLY way and the ABSOLUTE truth. No man can be saved without Jesus.

Muhammad and the bloke who founded Baha’i are false prophets - wolves in sheep’s clothing. I find it very insulting that the Holy Name of Jesus would be mentioned alongside charlatans.


#116

You are assuming too many things. Nowhere does Scripture say that Christians did not free slaves. And St. Paul recommended that Onesiphorus be freed by his master. In addition, even today, Christians are buying slaves in order to free them from Muslims. Only to see Muslims take more slaves.

And again, Christianity has ruled against the taking and keeping of slaves. Whereas, Islam has not. Islam continues to take slaves to this day but uses their religious obligation to lie in support of jihad to fool non-Muslims into believing that they no longer approve of that which is permitted by the book which they claim was given to them by Allah.


#117

You can choose to believe whatever you wish for whatever reasons you wish to believe what you do. One thing I am certain of is that we will all be held accountable for the things we do based upon what we allow ourselves to believe. My conscience is clear in that respect.


#120

[quote=“TomMartin, post:119, topic:451994, full:true”]
Of course some Christians likely freed some slaves. Still, the Bible does not command Christian masters to free their slaves…

Read my lips. Catholics are not people of the book. That is why Catholics were the first to free slaves at the command of the Pope. Only to have Muslims spread the practice throughout the world.

Again, it is the Catholic Church which first ended the practice of slavery. Muslims continued to this very day.


#121

This point highlights the gulf that exists between the True Faith and Islam. Modern liberals imbued with the spirit of political correctness preach that Islam means love. Islam does not mean love; it means submission. The followers of Muhammad are slaves to a cruel and distant God. The followers of the Jesus have been made sons of God - partakers of the Divine Nature. Jesus delivers man from bondage into the ‘glorious liberty of the children of God.’ Islam subjugates, subdues and spreads itself like a virus through the sword.


#123

But Muslims continue to capture slaves to this day and they use their book as justification for the practice. Their religion tells them that it is lawful to do so.

among them plenty of centuries before the Catholic church ended the practice of slavery among Catholics. Good for the Ebionites. Plenty of Catholics owned slaves in the south of the US, until slavery was outlawed by the US.

There are disobedient Catholics to this day. But the Catholic Church condemned the taking of slaves repeatedly and many centuries ago.

Whereas, Muslims continue the practice and can’t condemn it, because there is no central authority with the power to do so. Muslims are more and more like Protestants. They each read their Quran and interpret it the way they like. Since they are human and afflicted with a fallen nature, they interpret it in the basest possible way. And that is why we see the horrors that we see today emanating from that religion.


#125

Good point. Much like the first written account of creation doesn’t mean the first account of creation


#126

I had posted earlier on this thread and wanted to comment that I had found no intrinsic contradiction between the Gospel account and the Qur’anic account. I also wanted to offer a way both the Gospel and the Qur’an could be in harmony:

Look again at Surih 4 verse 157

Translation of A.Yusuf Ali

That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah”;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-

and consider in Surih 2:154

And say not of those who are slain in the way of Allah: “They are dead.” Nay, they are living, though ye perceive (it) not.

The verse focuses on the reality of the spirit of the martyr who was slain! The spirit is living.

The same can be said in my view to the Surih 4:157… while the corporeal body was crucified the Spirit of Jesus was not killed…but in verse 158:

Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise;-

There is also very lovely way this is confirmed by the Gospel of Luke…

The last words of Jesus on the cross according to the Gospel of Luke translated in the Jerusalem Bible read:

…and when Jesus had cried out in a loud voice, He said, "Father, into Your hands I commit my Spirit" with these words he breathed His last.

~ Luke 22:46

So Jesus committed His Spirit to God and the Qur’an says Allah raised him up unto Himself.strong text


#127

The key difference is that Catholicism teaches theosis or deification as well. God became man that man might become God. Those in a state of grace partake of the Divine Nature and become divinised; they are made sons of God.


#130

[quote=“TomMartin, post:128, topic:451994, full:true”]
Sunni Muslims are indeed like Protestants, in that they have no central authority to make decisions, …

There are many, many, types of Muslims.

None of them are subject to one another. And the list grows on.


#131

There are elements of truth and sanctification in most religions but only one religion has the complete truth - and that religion is Catholicism. You’ll might say that the other religions make the same assertion and I wouldn’t disagree with you. However, I’d tell you to investigate the impact that the Catholic Faith has had on the world. Look at what the Saints have accomplished in the realms of science, culture, academia etc. The Catholic Faith has been a tremendous force for good in the world. Once you realise this fact, you’ll want to go to the source of this goodness: Jesus Christ.


#132

There is a profound difference between the Muslim view and the Catholic one. When the New Testament speaks of being “slaves” to Christ, that binding of oneself to Christ is done with complete willingness, by loving God with one’s whole heart, mind and being. It is a commitment of the will following Christ’s model – “MY WILL is to do the will of the Father.” In other words, we will by our own free choice to do God’s will. That is why conversion is a process in which we actively, willingly and knowingly arrive at unity with God, with full knowledge and assent. And that assent is never coerced.

The Muslim view is that conversion can be accomplished with the blade of the sword and individuals can be forced to submit to God’s will, provided that they do submit – that is all that matters. How they got there is irrelevant. Whether they chose to or not, either one is permissible. What counts is the submission.


#133

Thank you. More to it than I thought. But then, prophets didn’t come to reestablish covenants but to remind the people of the covenant they have with God.


#134

Good points. We could also say that the difference stems from the fact that Christians know God as a loving Father; and they know they’re sons and daughters of God. We are slaves in the sense that we choose to follow the will of Our Father - but we do this because we love him and not because we fear him. The false God of Islam is cold and distant and certainly not a loving Father.


#135

If God could just “fix evil people” with no regard for free will, then why doesn’t he do that in this life and save everyone the misery? Universalists are clearly wrong because God will not “fix” those who do not want to be fixed.


#138

Crusades were not about conversion, but about protection. Read authentic historical accounts and not polemical diatribes. The other groups like the Hussites were heretical revolutionaries and the Church wasn’t attempting to convert them. Most of the religious wars were about states and monarchs trying to unify their realms. The only episode that comes anywhere near the level of “forcing conversion” in Church history was Charlemagne dealing with the Saxons via the Capitularies and that was largely to secure the safety and unity of his realm. For thirty years the Saxons had led marauding expeditions to the Rhine burning churches and monasteries, killing priests, and sacrificing their prisoners of war to their gods.

Islam is the undisputed leader of forced conversions and dhimmitude in the world.


#139

:thinking:


#140

You keep trying to equate Islam with Christianity. Yes, there are similarities but there are great differences between the two religions. And as I’ve stated previously, one can see these differences by comparing the the culture of death that Islam produced with the culture of life that Christ produced. In addition, it’s important to remember that Islam came long after Christ and Muhammad used gnostic Christianity as a source for his Quran.


#141

Uh, not so much…


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