Islam? Pretty interesting, but there has to be someting wrong with it!


#1

I went to this website:

www.islamicity.com

I got to say, i learned quite a bit from this. What surprised me is the fact that they believe Mary was a Virgin, the annunciation story is so similar to that of us Christians, it seemes so perfect, it kinda makes since to, that after Jesus, another Prophet came and that was that. They believe they got their word directly from God. So my question is this, whats wrong with islam? It can’t be that perfect. Please no bashing, I just wanna no what is false about this religion, and what doesn’t make it Gods true faith.


#2

I could understand the Islam of the early 600’s surviving… the religion of “peace”. But since then 623 till now, it is not a religion of peace. The peaceful members are far outnumbered by fundamentalists and their supporters.

MrS


#3

[quote=MrS]I could understand the Islam of the early 600’s surviving… the religion of “peace”. But since then 623 till now, it is not a religion of peace. The peaceful members are far outnumbered by fundamentalists and their supporters.

MrS
[/quote]

exactly, most of the believers of islam are not peaceful, instead they like to bomb the world.

Podo The Hobbit:blessyou:


#4

[quote=RomanRyan1088]I went to this website:

www.islamicity.com

I got to say, i learned quite a bit from this. What surprised me is the fact that they believe Mary was a Virgin, the annunciation story is so similar to that of us Christians, it seemes so perfect, it kinda makes since to, that after Jesus, another Prophet came and that was that. They believe they got their word directly from God. So my question is this, whats wrong with islam? It can’t be that perfect. Please no bashing, I just wanna no what is false about this religion, and what doesn’t make it Gods true faith.
[/quote]

They don’t believe that Jesus was crucified but that he didn’t die at all and was assumed to heaven before death. Muhammed was the only one to allegedly receive the Koran from the angel Gabriel, so there are no witnesses to this event or other events that he describes (vision of heaven at the Temple Mount site, etc.). Muhammed’s idea of the Trinity was clearly skewed and even though he had some merchant contact with Christians, he obviously never received an orthodox explanation of the Trinity and other Christian doctrines - thus, his description of what Christians believed was the Trinity (it involved the Virgin Mary) was outlandish and clearly came from a position of ignorance. A closer examination of Islam’s Allah is clearly not the God of the Old or New Testaments - Why would God contradict Himself from the period of the inspired canonical gospels to the time of Muhammed? Read a good explanation of Islam from a
Christian point of view in The New Advent Catholic Encyclopedia then ask yourself which one is the Truth - the answer is crystal clear.


#5

[quote=RomanRyan1088]I went to this website:

www.islamicity.com

I got to say, i learned quite a bit from this. What surprised me is the fact that they believe Mary was a Virgin, the annunciation story is so similar to that of us Christians, it seemes so perfect, it kinda makes since to, that after Jesus, another Prophet came and that was that. They believe they got their word directly from God. So my question is this, whats wrong with islam? It can’t be that perfect. Please no bashing, I just wanna no what is false about this religion, and what doesn’t make it Gods true faith.
[/quote]

Hello Ryan,

Islam actually gives more honour and respect to the Mother of God, the Theotokos, than Protestants. There is a very practical reason for this which I can tell you about another time if you’d like.

But to answer the main focus of your post, I’d like to say that a half-truth is still a lie. The beauty of Islam is that it has the ability to lure unsuspecting Christians and Jews by the very means you describe. Meaning, a Muslim could say to a Christian, “We believe that Jesus was born of the virgin Mary, his birth was herralded by the Archangel Gabriel. Jesus was born under the line of Abraham to preach God’s word and performed miracles to all believers. His message was rejected by the Jews, but He will come back to earth at the end times to judge the living and the dead.” Well, what’s wrong with that statement to a Christian? Nothing.

But they at first, they will intentionally leave out the details of their beliefs, which would make the sentence sound like this: “We believe Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary by an act of God, but who was NOT His Father, his birth herralded by the Archangel Gabriel. Jesus was born under the line of Abraham and Ismail who came as a prophet like all other prophets before him to preach God’s word and performed miracles for all Muslim believers. His message was rejected by the Jews, so God spared him death in this life and took him straight up to heaven by making the crowds believe he was crucified when he wasn’t. He will come back to earth at the end times to judge the living and the dead, and is second only to the Greatest of god’s prophets: Mohamed.”

Does this make sense so far?


#6

Try reading Hilaire Belloc’s The Great Heresies. Chapter 4 is The Great and Enduring Heresy of Mohammed.
Islam believes that Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary and announced by the Archangel Gabriel and other things similar to Christianity because Mohammed took some of his ideas from Christianity. But it stops there. It was a perversion of Christian doctrine. One of his main themes was convert or conquer. If you didn’t convert to Islam you were killed as an infidel. Much like the fundamentalist Islamists believe today. Thus resulting in all the terrorism of today.
Interestingly, Vienna was almost taken by Mohammedism and only saved by the Christian army under the command of the King of Poland on SEPTEMBER 11th, 1683.


#7

[quote=moira]Try reading Hilaire Belloc’s The Great Heresies. Chapter 4 is The Great and Enduring Heresy of Mohammed.
Islam believes that Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary and announced by the Archangel Gabriel and other things similar to Christianity because Mohammed took some of his ideas from Christianity. But it stops there. It was a perversion of Christian doctrine. One of his main themes was convert or conquer. If you didn’t convert to Islam you were killed as an infidel. Much like the fundamentalist Islamists believe today. Thus resulting in all the terrorism of today.
Interestingly, Vienna was almost taken by Mohammedism and only saved by the Christian army under the command of the King of Poland on SEPTEMBER 11th, 1683.
[/quote]

Moira,

Well, since you brought it up…:stuck_out_tongue: What you say is absolutely true. But the actual reason for the Muslim view on the Virgin was more practical. When Islam first began, Mohammed started making his alliances and raiding the caravans of anyone who didn’t join up. He soon found himself in trouble and in desperation sent a lot of his higher-ups into refuge. About 6 of them were sent to Christian Ethiopia. When they arrived, they were taken to King Ezana who was willing to hear them out. Knowing the country was Christian, the Muslims immediately started praising the Virgin Mary, Mother of Jesus. Saying how she was a pure servant of God etc. They saw the impact this had on the King, who allowed them to stay with him. When the group left Ethiopia (ow there were 5 as one remained there and converted to Christianity…Muslims don’t like to be reminded of this) they told Mohammed of what they had been through. Mohammed realised the tactic of playing up Mary would have a positive impact of wooing potential Christian converts. Which is why there is more written in the Quran about Mary than in the bible itself.

Sneaky…eh?


#8

RomanRyan–Have you looked into the Mormon religion? You might agree with that too. The Mormons believe that the ancient Jews came to North America shortly after Christ’s death approx. 2000 years ago, that the North American Indians were Christians, and the illiterate farm hand Joseph Smith found golden tablets in a field in the early 1800s in northern NYS which he had to translate from the ancient language. A lot of Mormons believe it and a lot of people from other Christian denominations convert to Mormonism.


#9

LACHIARA,

yeah, I’ve always maintained that Mormonism was very similar to Islam in their process and validity. The only difference here is that while Islam took the course of militancy, Mormonism eventually took the course of pacifism. I say originally, because for a time Joseph Smith organised a group called the “Danites” who robbed and pillaged smaller towns before they were finally run out of Missouri.


#10

But the actual reason for the Muslim view on the Virgin was more practical. When Islam first began, Mohammed started making his alliances and raiding the caravans of anyone who didn’t join up. He soon found himself in trouble and in desperation sent a lot of his higher-ups into refuge. About 6 of them were sent to Christian Ethiopia. When they arrived, they were taken to King Ezana who was willing to hear them out. Knowing the country was Christian, the Muslims immediately started praising the Virgin Mary, Mother of Jesus. Saying how she was a pure servant of God etc. They saw the impact this had on the King, who allowed them to stay with him. When the group left Ethiopia (ow there were 5 as one remained there and converted to Christianity…Muslims don’t like to be reminded of this) they told Mohammed of what they had been through. Mohammed realised the tactic of playing up Mary would have a positive impact of wooing potential Christian converts. Which is why there is more written in the Quran about Mary than in the bible itself.

Sneaky…eh?
Thanks for the extra info. I didn’t know that. Sneaky for sure. Amazing what people will do to make themselves look good.


#11

Oh, there’s plenty more where that came from :smiley:

I’m sure everyone here is aware of the Book “The Satanic Verses”. But what you probably don’t know is that it is was written as a spoof of actual events. Very similar to the story of the Virgin and Christians.

At the same time when Mohamed sent his followers out of Arabia to hide out, he was essentially held captive in Mecca by the predominant tribe in the region, which was also the custodian of the Ka’aba (the big black square the Muslims pray to today). Only in Mohamed’s time, the big black square was filled with pagan idols. So, Mohamed got the idea that if he played to the 3 most favored “godesses” (idols) of the tribe, they would also warm up to him. Thus he concocted the verses in Surah 53 which state, “Have ye thought upon al-Lat and al-Uzza
And Manat, the third, the other?
These are the exalted cranes (intermediaries)
Whose intercession is to be hoped for”

All fine and good, except when the Muslims are finally victorious over the Meccans, Mohammed realises how embarassing that last verse is seemingly pandering to goddesses and seeking their intercession (in Islam, there was no intercession to God). So, someone comes up with the idea that those verses werre actually given to Mohamed by Satan, who tricked Mohamed into thinking he was the Archangel Gabriel. The verses were later taken out and the whole story is a very sore subject for Muslim because it begs the question: if those verses came from Satan, how can anyone be sure the rest of the Qur’an did not?

Anyway, one version of the story can also be found here.


#12

Islam says that Jesus wasn’t the Son of God, merely a great prophet.

So God sends this great prophet, and he’s so successful in his preaching that people actually start to believe he’s the Son of God. In time, nearly a third of the world believes this “heresy.” The number of people who believe the “heresy” is 50% more than those who know the “truth.”

So why would he still be a great prophet? Why wouldn’t he be called a false prophet, an instrument of the devil? How dumb would God have to be, to send a prophet who leads people so far astray? People have always gone astray because they refused to listen to the prophet, but in this case, Christians went astray because they DID listen to the “great prophet.”

I’ve always wondered if God’s hand kept Muhammed from denouncing Jesus and His Blessed Mother so that Islam might have at least some Truth, or whether it was simply Muhammed’s craftiness in trying to trick Christians.

Muhammed actually didn’t know Christianity, except through heretics. That may be why he rejected it. He knew part of the Truth, but couldn’t get his hands around the whole Truth.


#13

Mohammed is a prophet of Satan. He’s only claiming that he’s the great prophet for himself. Jesus, the Son of God, is the great prophet of ALL TIME. No prophet of human origin can ever surpass Jesus Christ–the God-Man. Of course. Jesus is not only a prophet, but more than just a prophet. He is the Saviour, King, Priest, Lamb, Son of the Most High, etc.

Pio


#14

[quote=hlgomez]Mohammed is a prophet of Satan. He’s only claiming that he’s the great prophet for himself. Jesus, the Son of God, is the great prophet of ALL TIME. No prophet of human origin can ever surpass Jesus Christ–the God-Man. Of course. Jesus is not only a prophet, but more than just a prophet. He is the Saviour, King, Priest, Lamb, Son of the Most High, etc.

Pio
[/quote]

There’s even more to this argument which drives Muslims crazy. Assuming Jesus were just a prophet, then we have to ask several questions: Jesus worked miracles (Muslims admit this as the Qur’an says so) yet Mohamed didn’t. Jesus never taught or preached the use of violence in any form, yet Mohamed did. Jesus dedicated his life 100% to His mission and did not have a family, wealth or empire to distract Him from God, meanwhile Mohamed led a very worldly life with all three. Jesus never asked of His followers anything that He could not do himself, while Mohammed constantly changed his commands “from God” to suit his needs, as well as marrying 9 wives while commanding his followers to take no more than 4.

So, we have to conclude that from this, God sent an inferior messenger after the most exemplorary. Why would God downgrade His prophets from one generation to the next?


#15

M-ohammed
U-nder
S-atan
L-ead(s)
I- gnorant
M-ultitudes


#16

[quote=RomanRyan1088]I went to this website:

www.islamicity.com

I got to say, i learned quite a bit from this. What surprised me is the fact that they believe Mary was a Virgin, the annunciation story is so similar to that of us Christians, it seemes so perfect, it kinda makes since to, that after Jesus, another Prophet came and that was that. They believe they got their word directly from God. So my question is this, whats wrong with islam? It can’t be that perfect. Please no bashing, I just wanna no what is false about this religion, and what doesn’t make it Gods true faith.
[/quote]

Whats wrong with Islam?

Here are a couple things for you.

Muslims believe that both Mary and Jesus were perfect and without sin. They recognize Mohammed as a sinner. They also recognize that Jesus rose from the dead.
So, the question is why is Mohammed the greatest prophet?

Jesus comes back to fight the anti Christ.


#17

According to Hilaire Belloc, Islam is the same as many other heretical off shoots of Catholicism with the exception that Mohammed didn’t come from within the Church but from without, among the pagans of Arabia.

I think he makes an iteresting point that Islam is an over-simplification and perversion of Catholic doctrine. You see that in all heresies including protestantism.

It began as a heresy, not as a new religion. It was not a pagan contrast with the Church; it was not an alien enemy. It was a perversion of Christian doctrine. It vitality and endurance soon gave it the appearance of a new religion, but those who were contemporary with its rise saw it for what it wasnot a denial, but an adaptation and a misuse, of the Christian thing. It differed from most (not from all) heresies in this, that it did not arise within the bounds of the Christian Church. The chief heresiarch, Mohammed himself, was not, like most heresiarchs, a man of Catholic birth and doctrine to begin with. He sprang from pagans. But that which he taught was in the main Catholic doctrine, oversimplified. It was the great Catholic worldon the frontiers of which he lived, whose influence was all around him and whose territories he had known by travelwhich inspired his convictions. He came of, and mixed with, the degraded idolaters of the Arabian wilderness, the conquest of which had never seemed worth the Romans’ while.

geocities.com/Athens/Rhodes/3543/mohamet.htm

Now what Mahomet did was this. He took over the principal doctrines of the Catholic Church - one personal God, Creator of all things; the immortality of the soul; an eternity of misery or blessedness - and no small part of Christian morals as well. All that was the atmosphere of the only civilisation which had influence upon him or his followers. But at the same time he attempted an extreme simplification.

Many another heresiarch has done this, throwing overboard such and such too profound doctrines, and appealing to the less intelligent by getting rid of mysteries through a crude denial of them. But Mahomet simplified much more than did, say, Pelagius or even Arius. He turned Our Lord into a mere prophet, though the greatest of the prophets; Our Lady - whom he greatly revered, and whom his followers still revere - he turned into no more than the mother of so great a prophet; he cut out the Eucharist altogether, and what was most difficult to follow in the matter of the Resurrection. He abolished all idea of priesthood: most important of all, he declared for social equality among all those who should be ‘true believers’ after his fashion.

geocities.com/Athens/Rhodes/3543/onislam.htm


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