Jewish People and Homosexuals


#1

Ok, A few questions have arised to me, Do we as Catholics like gays and Jews? This is a few reasons why I have thought so.

Gay’s don’t reproduce, Obviously because they don’t like Women, On the other hand how can they when that’s there feelings, Maybe there born deformed in the sexual way?

I can’t establish anything about Jews, But from what I see two catholics in WW2 Hitler and Mussolini Did not seem to like them.

Cheers:thumbsup: Please inform me.


#2

Surely you are not serious here. The misinformation you’re giving out is by no means Catholic teaching.


#3

can’t make any sense of OP, don’t even know what the question is. If OP wishes to discuss traditional Catholic teaching on either topic, he should begin a separate thread for each topic, quote with attribution the source of the teaching he wishes to discuss, and begin from there. If you want to discuss Catholics in WW2, don’t cite Hitler who rejected and persecuted the Catholic Church, or Mussolini who restored limited freedom of movement to the papacy and assured the sovreignty of the tiny Vatican State (ending the pope’s virtual imprisonment and de facto house arrest that had existed since the establishment of the revolutionary anti-clerical Italian government since the late 1800s) but otherwise restricted legitimate activities of clergy. If you wish to discuss activities and views of Catholics, talk about Catholics, not anti-Catholics.


#4

I’m talking about Homosexuals in the bible it states Homosexuals shall be killed, And I was wondering about Jewish people all Muslims and Catholics I know dont have a good impression of them


#5

Let’s see what the Catechism of the Catholic Church says, if you want to know what we as Catholics are taught and believe.

First: Homosexuals:
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.


#6

and your opinion has what to do with traditional Catholic teaching and practice. and your opinion of homosexuals has what to do with Jews? and your question is on this forum, why?


#7

er…ok I’ll go first… Hitler was not Catholic, or even Christian so this had nothing to do with his hatred of the Jews - he hated all religions. It is sometimes said that Hitler was Catholic because he was raised as a Catholic. When he got older he did not agree with Catholicism and said the following statements…

All of these are quotes from Adolf Hitler:

Night of 11th-12th July, 1941:

National Socialism and religion cannot exist together… The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity’s illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity… Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things. (p 6 & 7)

10th October, 1941, midday:

Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure. (p 43)

14th October, 1941, midday:

The best thing is to let Christianity die a natural death… When understanding of the universe has become widespread… Christian doctrine will be convicted of absurdity… Christianity has reached the peak of absurdity… And that’s why someday its structure will collapse… …the only way to get rid of Christianity is to allow it to die little by little… Christianity [is] the liar… We’ll see to it that the Churches cannot spread abroad teachings in conflict with the interests of the State. (p 49-52)

19th October, 1941, night:

The reason why the ancient world was so pure, light and serene was that it knew nothing of the two great scourges: the pox and Christianity.

13th December, 1941, midnight:

Christianity is an invention of sick brains: one could imagine nothing more senseless, nor any more indecent way of turning the idea of the Godhead into a mockery… [here he insults people who believe transubstantiation] … When all is said, we have no reason to wish that the Italians and Spaniards should free themselves from the drug of Christianity. Let’s be the only people who are immunised against the disease. (p 118 & 119)

9th April, 1942, dinner:

There is something very unhealthy about Christianity (p 339)

27th February, 1942, midday:

It would always be disagreeable for me to go down to posterity as a man who made concessions in this field. I realize that man, in his imperfection, can commit innumerable errors-- but to devote myself deliberately to errors, that is something I cannot do. I shall never come personally to terms with the Christian lie. Our epoch Uin the next 200 yearse will certainly see the end of the disease of Christianity… My regret will have been that I couldn’t… behold its demise." (p 278)

Doesn’t sound very Christian to me!!

Regardless of Hitler though there is nothing in Christianity which calls for the hatred of anyone. The Catholic Catechism also states that we must treat homosexuals with dignity and respect also but I agree the thread would be confused if I started on that here.

S


#8

Next, the Jewish people:

The relationship of the Church with the Jewish People. When she delves into her own mystery, the Church, the People of God in the New Covenant, discovers her link with the Jewish People,326 "the first to hear the Word of God."327 The Jewish faith, unlike other non-Christian religions, is already a response to God’s revelation in the Old Covenant. To the Jews “belong the sonship, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the worship, and the promises; to them belong the patriarchs, and of their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ”,328 "for the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable."329

840 And when one considers the future, God’s People of the Old Covenant and the new People of God tend towards similar goals: expectation of the coming (or the return) of the Messiah. But one awaits the return of the Messiah who died and rose from the dead and is recognized as Lord and Son of God; the other awaits the coming of a Messiah, whose features remain hidden till the end of time; and the latter waiting is accompanied by the drama of not knowing or of misunderstanding Christ Jesus.


#9

And Muslims:

841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. “The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.”


#10

Hitler and Mussolini were Catholics so please study that a bit better.

It is a common myth that Hitler was a Christian. In fact, he always made it clear that he was a Roman Catholic. In Mein Kampf Hitler wrote “by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord”. Once he gained power he got the support of both the Protestant and Catholic churches. The anti-semitism on which the Nazi movement was built was fostered by the main churches. It was this support which made Nazism so acceptable to “respectable” people.


#11

Excuse me, Santo Benito, but perhaps you need to study this yourself.

Anyone can be baptized a Catholic. . .but in his or her life live completely against Catholic teachings. Such was the case with Hitler, most certainly. A Catholic in the sense of baptism. . .but not a ‘practicing’ Catholic who following his faith teachings. If you insist on including him as a ‘model’ of a Catholic, you had **darn well better ** include St. Teresa Benedicta and St. Maximillian Kolbe, both of whom were martyred for their faith as Catholics in the same time period that Hitler ruled.


#12

My grandad was in the Italian army back then, The Fascist one he has told me many stuff about it, So it’s your word or someone who fought for Hitlers word.


#13

My dear Santo Benito: For a half Sicilian to confuse “Christian” and “Catholic” as though they were two different things is rather remarkable. Could you elaborate on the difference that makes Catholics not Christian?

You are positing ‘what all Catholics believe’ on the word of a mere person instead of on the Catechism of the Catholic Church? That is a new one. . .


#14

well I don’t know what else I could have done to show you the truth as I quoted several quotes from Hitler himself proving he was not Catholic.

at one stage they banned crucifixes in classrooms, disbanded religious education classes and then barred state funded teachers from teaching voluntary religious classes.

Hitler needed the Catholic vote and often when he writes of immortality and the world to come he is not referring to religious terms

he is referring to the lasting monument that he wnated to make for himself, the world to come was he new Germany. This is why much of the architecture and symbolism is so grand, he wanted a lasting memory of himself on earth - not in any Christian heaven.

The SS even created Pagan marriage ceremonies and the Hitler Youth ere taught anti-christian songs:

We follow not Christ, but Horst Wessel,
Away with incense and Holy Water,
The Church can go hang for all we care,
The Swastika brings salvation on Earth.

I’m afraid it’s you that needs to do your research - I did years of my own.

S


#15

I continually here the argument about well that’s how they feel or that’s the way they were born. Well consider this a kleptomaniac has feelings for stealing. So does that make it ok. The kleptomaniac can’t help the way he feels. Or for the argument for predisposition, consider this: scientists believe alcoholism is an inherited disease.
Overall, we are all predisposed to sin. It is ridiculous that this question even comes up. The liberal secular media tries to convince people it’s ok. The church does not hate anyone. But people who commit homosexual acts are sinning in the same way as someone who steals sins.


#16

not just our word but the word of thousands of war survivors, Christians, Jews and the agreement of Historians. He referred in Mein Kampf to Christianity as “the first spiritual terror,”

you should remember that Hitler had to get elected in a country big on religion. He needed them and so was reluctant when he was trying for power to say anything bad in public about religion.

AFTER he got power it is a different matter, and this is when he starts to test how far the German people will let him go. He banned crucifixes but had to bring them back after an outcry. He waited for the war and said there was a shortage of metal and had them all melted down. Also church bells went. He phased out religious schools and disbanded the Catholic youth movement t force them to join with Hitler’s true religion - Nazism.


#17

:thumbsup:

And a real religious man like Mussolini would adore that and want to team up with him, Thats why i was named after Mussolini “The only man to try and remove the mafia from Sicily”


#18

Interesting have fun. Lack of true Catholic Teachings can lead to some crazy stuff IMHO.


#19

Have fun laughing at my expense.:thumbsup:


#20

if your Grandfather is part of the family you mention who have racial issues with Jews then I would respectfully be wary of any truth he may give you about them - people always see what they want to see in History.

I think you will need to learn to love a lot of people based on these quotes just from tonight… I have my own battle to deal with on an entirely different issue… our attitudes are hard to change and I will pray for you that you have come to the right place to start to address these.

If you need any help on this matter after the thread fizzles out just PM (personal message) me cos this is gonna be a long journey for you.

oh yeah…and God doesn’t hate anyone, despite what some people may say… Jesus says love your enemy… if you can love your enemy who ese is there to hate? lol

Take care,

S


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