Job 33:29


#1

‘‘29Behold, all these things God worketh three times within every one.’’

Now my question/discussion point is this: is this a True statement? Job did not dispute this point plus the Spirit allowed the discourse within scripture.

Now another point I thought of… is this limited to one lifetime? Is this possibly speaking of reincarnation? My thought process sorta goes along these lines… that God works within us thrice to perfect us… once under the old Covenant, once in the New with grace, and once when we are in the Kingdom… thoughts?


#2

Reincarnation does not come from divine revelation. It is a mistaken notion of man.

The precious Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ is enough for one life!

Hopefully others can give an in-depth answer to your question re: Job.


#3

Verse 29 is a summary of the previous verses 14-28. Elihu is describing the 3 ways God declares his will to us: through visions, through illness, or through the intercession of angels.


#4

This is not reincarnation.

No reincarnational teaching I’ve ever heard says that reincarnation only takes place three times.

Scripturally, there is no place for it. You will receive Resurrectional life; after you die, you will regain aliveness as the same soma, embodied self, that you are now, only reformed and immortalized. Rebirth into earthly life as someone else is foreign to Scripture.

Job himself said that he would see God, in his “flesh” and with his “own eyes.”

ICXC NIKA.


#5

That is interesting. I always assumed he was talking about how things come in 3’s which is a common belief saying… perhaps referring to pruning people

True and glad we only have to live this earthly life once!! Though, reincarnation was a common belief among many and Jews during the time of Jesus.


#6

I don’t think the text in the previous verse is necessarily talking about death. One could render these two verses something like: “He has redeemed my life from crossing over into a pit, and my life will see light. Even two or three times God will do these things for a man!”

It’s hard to say what’s meant by “pit” there; however, this is NOT Hebrew sheol, the abode of the dead, but more likely is a metaphor for feeling physically trapped and as if there is no way out, which makes a great deal of sense in the context. [The pit described is used in hunting wild animals.] Also Hebrew “nephesh” is often erroneously translated “soul” here and elsewhere.

The author is emphasizing God can intervene many times during the course of one’s life.


#7

I have never really bought into reincarnation, up until recently though, and Im still a bit up in the air about it, one of the things making me wonder is there have been quite a few young kids who apparently had memories of their past lives…at first I didnt believe this, but after reading further, it was proven that the memories they mentioned were true…so how could a young kid know so much about someone elses life, and have detailed knowledge about things that took place long before they were even born?

Id like to see how this is debunked, because from what I saw and read, it does truly seem like reincarnation or something like it, does happen to some people.


#8

I agree, I personally have an open mind to it as it was never directly addressed in scripture. And I know it was a very common belief in Jesus day … and then the info I know about with many Jews accepting reincarnation belief. EDIT: Jews of Jesus day.

But, if reincarnation was true, who would be reincarnated? Those who follow God and need reproofing? If so then would this be a type of purgatory? If it is those that break Gods law and rebel against him knowingly? If so what is the point? They obviously made their decision. What about those who dont know God? Many people believe everyone has a chance to accept Jesus… but there is no grantee of that ideal. Possible.


#9

mikekle and the seeker,

It is easily debunked by knowing about the deceptions of the evil one. Satan and his cohorts tell each other things, as they have been around and allowed to tempt us for a very long time…starting in the Garden of Eden.

So they know about the history of others, and can deceive them into thinking it was from past lives.

Remember, the demons have an intelligence that is greater than ours. What God gives He does not take back, but God allows them to be the cause of good when we resist the temptations! Temptations are not sin, it is a source of our becoming stronger in the Lord!

We do not have to be concerned about the deceptions of the evil one if we allow the Lord to bring us to obedience and humility and to grow in those virtues., When we keep our eyes on Jesus and learn wisdom from the saints, and all the directives and teachings on faith and morals that our Church teaches then we cannot be deceived.

May our Lord Jesus Christ help all of us to keep our eyes on Him!

Come Holy Spirit!

Father, our Creator we love you!

Mary our Mother intercede for us!


#10

Ok so if reincarnation is something the fallen are using to tempt us… what are they tempting us too exactly?
All I am saying is that I have an open mind to it because it was never directly addressed in scriptures when it was a very common belief in that day.
The belief of reincarnation would not effect salvation to those who are even aware of salvation if you read my above post… so it is not tempting us to leave Christ.
Or at least that is my stance on it. I just think it is possible that reincarnation can exist in some way. Not that it matters to me as it would not effect me if a person who knows Christ and Christianity took a min to think IF reincarnation was real, who would be reincarnated.

This is something I do not dwell on because I trust Christ with my life and afterlife and honestly I could care less about the belief of reincarnation as this is a little string in the whole rug. But it is a possibility it is real because there isnt anything that says absolutely no. This is something that would have been addressed in Jesus’ day by Him since it has a HUGE belief then for everyone including Jews. Considering all of this, is what I am saying it is possible and thus I have an open mind to the ideal. :slight_smile:

EDIT
In other words to make myself very clear, I believe the possibility of reincarnation of being real is true, because it was not addressed directly in scripture as an absolute no. and if it is real, I believe the people who would be reincarnated would be those who did not have a chance to accept Jesus before death because of various reasons, whether it was the location of the people (deep in the wilderness), illness that prohibited mental comprehension, children/babies, ect. It would not effect those who made an actual choice whether for or against.


#11

It may not tempt you specifically but the idea of being reincarnated might tempt some people to think if they “blow it” in this life they’ll have another chance at heaven. Even if they are only “open minded” about it, it may be enough to make someone a little bit careless about how they follow Jesus, because it may not be for “realises” this time around.

This is something that would have been addressed in Jesus’ day by Him since it has a HUGE belief then for everyone including Jews. Considering all of this, is what I am saying it is possible and thus I have an open mind to the ideal. :slight_smile:

Jews have/had a different idea of reincarnation than do Buddhists. (just google Judaism and reincarnation).

EDIT
In other words to make myself very clear, I believe the possibility of reincarnation of being real is true, because it was not addressed directly in scripture as an absolute no. and if it is real, I believe the people who would be reincarnated would be those who did not have a chance to accept Jesus before death because of various reasons, whether it was the location of the people (deep in the wilderness), illness that prohibited mental comprehension, children/babies, ect. It would not effect those who made an actual choice whether for or against.

Scriptures may not speak directly to reincarnation but it does speak about how we are a union of the material and the spiritual. Our creed says we believe in the resurrection of the body, when our souls will be reunited with our bodies. We will live in eternity in our glorified bodies. How will that happen if we lived many lives and our souls are just transplanted from one body to another? As for those who didn’t have a chance to accept Jesus before they died, they will not be punished for something out of their control. They’ll get to know God in the after life, no need to go through this life again.


#12

The inspired writers of the Gospel did not include all the details of what not to follow that would take us away from our Lord Jesus Christ.

In Hebrews 9:27 it says: “It is appointed unto man to die, and after this the judgment.”

The Lord has ways of imparting the truth to others before their death, nothing is impossible to Him.

Number 847 in the Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches me that:

“Those who through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience – those too may achieve eternal salvation.”

That makes a lot of sense to me.

There are directives about not seeking mediums, fortune tellers,…but not every detail connived by the evil one is mentioned in Sacred Scripture, such as tarot cards, astrology, ouigi boards, and all the other methods that are not looking to the Lord for answers. It is self-explanatory of what to stay away from.

The Precious Blood of Jesus is enough for one life on this earth! We get many chances!

Peace in Jesus,

Dorothy


#13

To harmonize reincarnation with Scripture is a mirage.

While Scripture is lax on human eschatology up until the major prophets, when the topic does appear, it is invariably in the context of a human-bodily Resurrection.. Not an immaterial soul becoming somebody else. Immaterial souls were not taught in Judaism until Hellenistic times.

If we are not immaterial souls using bodies to move around, but psychosomatic unions (and the Church teaches the second), then reincarnation makes no sense.

While some may use the reference to John the Baptist to argue reincarnation (from Elijah), this ignores that Elijah didn’t die. Reincarnation without death isn’t even theoretically possible.

ICXC NIKA


#14

ok makes sense

However I know scripture is not going to point out every thing that can lead you away. I was saying since it was such a HUGE belief, it would have been mentioned because of how huge and widespread it had reached…
BUt since you reminded me of souls reuniting with the body senerio, this issue had been addressed. However it is not the physical body that it unites with, it would be as you said glorified body… it is a new body made of a different essence but still has physical aspects (like you can touch it) otherwise we would have to be into embalming…


#15

Are you suggesting that Satan/ demons give young kids certain knowledge about someones past life in order to trick others into thinking they were truly reincarnated?

If so, this does seem plausible, and quite clever…hearing a 3 yr old speak in great detail about a persons life from the 1940s would be enough to fool anyone!


#16

part of the issue with this is that many of the kids look just like the person they are talking about.


#17

How is that possible? Does satan actually have the ability to change how a person looks?


#18

Satan is clever, and I cannot pretend to know how it is done, but I know that if I do not heed the warnings of Sacred Scripture and the directives of the Magisterium then deception can take place. A deception that leads me away from our Lord Jesus Christ.


#19

I think he is asking is it even possible for Satan to tamper with God’s creation. The physical aspect of it.


#20

I would think that an expert in deliverance would know how to answer that question, and that I am not.

I have faith in how the Church directs us, and in those Christians who have been delivered from occult beliefs and practices and have written about it.


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