Jordan's king decries anti-Christian violence, calls upon Christians to defend Islam [CWN]

A week after meeting with Pope Francis, King Abdullah II of Jordan spoke at a conference on the plight of Christians in the Middle East and decried violence against them. "We support …

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I particularly like the irony of the King talking of tolerance whilst a not very veiled form of anti-Jewish rhetoric begins to creep into his words as he talks. I am not a defender of all of Israel’s policies by any means and often have found them questionable but the King’s word’s frankly sound somewhat mealy mouthed and made for the benefit of the listeners.

You have to understand though that Jerusalem was occupied by Arabs until the 1940’s, when they were basically kicked out and replaced by Jews. Anyone would be offended if a foreign country took their land and gave it to someone else.

I understand that very well Jimmy, my father served on UN in the middle east in his time in the Irish Defence Forces and in Ireland many people feel a sense of identity with the Palestinians due to us having been a country which was occupied for a number of centuries by another power. All of that does not excuse the fact that the King is using a speech designed to promote pariseworthy virtues to appeal to certain political views in the middle-east regarding the Jewish people. Also, even Jerusalem had a significant Jewish population long before the 1940’s and for centuries so the matter is multi faceted and both Jews and Muslims have engaged and do engage in reductionist views of each other. Nor do I feel it is the duty of any Christian to defend Islam beyond not offering calculated insult to Muslims or allowing them freedom of worship.

God swore to Abraham, Isaac and Jacab to give the land of Israel to their descendents, also promising to TEMPORARILY exile them for faithlessness.

The land belongs to the children of Israel, although “resident aliens” should not be oppressed.
The land does NOT belong to the Arabs. As Jesus said that “our faith comes from the Jews”, we should respect their inheritance.

That is a good way to make an excuse for forcefully removing people from their homes and giving the land to someone else.

This is a belief that has gained ground in Catholicism, especially in America I note, it does not mesh with Catholic thought very well. In any case no solution that ignores the rights of either the Arabs or Jews will work in the long run and the Church has repeatedly pointed out the Palestinian people are entitled to the dignity of a nation of their own.

Which I would like to point out that despite taking issue with some of the King’s comments I totally oppose.

How did the Muslims get the land in the first place before the Jews took it in the 40’s? Did they just ask for it and everyone said it’s fine?

No in many cases, but ‘he did it also’ is not an argument that is very fruitful and one we should be slow to invoke considering the histories of many of our own countries which are built on conquest.

I’m having troubles understanding though… Basically Muslims are upset because the re-taking of Jerusalem by the Jews was recent?

No because morallly wrong actions were committed during the Israeli War of Independence and after, including mass slaughter. This does not excuse subsequent terrorism but it does offer a context to view it and and it should be noted that whilst right now a lot of noise is been made about the events in Syria there are living Israeli polticians who have carried out brutal actions and not suffered such widespread condemnation.

That is typical liberal progressive speak. No one owns the land in the end and we can steal anyone’s land if we wish. The Muslims lived there for a thousand years, and they didn’t take the land from the Jews. Maybe we should boot the Turks from turkey, and give the land to the Greeks. Constantinople was originally Greek. We should boot all the dark skinned people from Southern Europe too, because the Mors invaded Southern Europe and so their descendent a should be removed in favor of the real owners of the land. Obviously all of us in the west are invaders, and we don’t really own this land. So everyone in north and South America must return to Europe and Asia and Africa, because this land is now gonna be returned to the Cherokees, Aztecs, Mayans, incans, and other Indian tribes. Who else can we displace?

Keeping this in mind you believe that the Muslims should take back the land from the Jews?

No, I never said that; but let’s not pretend that the Jews were the rightful owners of the land. The Muslims have a reason for their animosity. I am not gonna pretend that the foundation of the Israeli state in the forties was a good thing, or that it was God’s will.

He did not say that, however certainly the Palestinians, (Muslim and Christian) deserve their own land and to be treated with dignity and the Jews deserve the same and that has been the consistent position of the Church whom I repose more trust in on these matters than the US govt. which is regularly funding the Israelis to the tune of several billion dollars a year. A point that I notice many Americans themselves find increasingly opposed to.

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

But the Jews allow the Muslims to live their peacefully, and yet they have been getting rocks thrown at them when they approach the dome of the rock.

Most of the negative stuff I’ve learned about Islam in practice, I’ve learned from talking to Arab Christians.

Imagine if I take your house and let you live in one room “peacefully”! How will you react?

Palistinians were driven out of their houses, and forced to be refugees all over the world. Most of them still keep their houses keys in a hope of retrun, and God is just.

Quran 24:55 Allah has promised those who have believed among you and done righteous deeds that He will surely grant them succession [to authority] upon the earth just as He granted it to those before them and that He will surely establish for them [therein] their religion which He has preferred for them and that He will surely substitute for them, after their fear, security, [for] they worship Me, not associating anything with Me. But whoever disbelieves after that - then those are the defiantly disobedient. 56 And establish prayer and give zakah and obey the Messenger - that you may receive mercy.57 Never think that the disbelievers are causing failure [to Allah ] upon the earth. Their refuge will be the Fire - and how wretched the destination.

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