Judo


#1

Hi,

I used to do Karate but sustained a foot injury. As a Christian I didn’t really have a problem with Karate, it was somewhat violent but always either in self defense scenarios or as two willing combatents in a sport situation. There was some bowing but it was always one to another, standing up, like a ‘japanese handshake’ with both bowing, so this seemed ok.

I have since taken up Judo, which is more of a mat sport. The bowing practice makes me uncomfortable, as they bow kneeling hands go down to the ground rather like an Islamic style bowing.

At the start and end of the class, they bow first to the teacher, who bows back so this seems ok but also to a photo of the founder of judo on the wall. This bowing to the photo on the wall of a dead man makes me uncomfortable essentially I’d say it’s a mild form of ancestor worship, which is a shame because Judo is a genuinly peacful and cooperative martial art.

I’m interested in an official Catholic perpective on this…

Thanks in advance…


#2

I don’t know about the “official” Catholic position, but I can tell you the official Japanese position.

It is not worship. It is respect and reverence. Period. In any established ancient martial art, you will find this type of discipline and respect. Especially the eastern arts. If this makes you uncomfortable, try one of the more modern fighting styles. They tend to focus more on the technique of fighting and don’t have an established history of bowing or saluting.


#3

My kids dojo fixed this problem. They hung a cross above the pictures so when the kids bowed they were told to bow to the cross.


#4

My son and husband do Kenpo. Their instructor is a strong Pentecostal Christian, and he even had a picture made of a student dressed in their gee kneeling before Jesus. Beautiful pic. And he makes it clear that the bowing and saluting is simply a form of respect to elders and superiors, which is what the bible teaches.
Now some dojos do teach meditation and the like, and I would avoid those. That leads to other new-agey practices. Find a good Christian instructor, and you’ll be fine. And have fun! :smiley:


#5

I don’t know what the RC official view is,but I have some exp with this.

I would say that if you are uncomfortable with anything,find a new school.But,you should be aware that MOST of the bowing and titles are cultural and not spiritual.I spent 10 years in taekwondo and the teacher’s title was master.Now,back then I was not a practicing Catholic so it was not an issue.Today I would call no man master,or bow to a photo,but thats me.I m lucky cuz I jumped ship to kung fu two years ago.My teacher teaches in backyards and garages in a very informal way.He is a very humble man and will not answer to master or even sifu.He likes to be called by his first name only and that works for me.

But,this is really something you have to decide for yourself.If bowing to a photo is bothersom,maybe thats the Holy Spirit tugging at you.


#6

thanks for input.


#7

I have beend in the Martial arts for 30 years(jujutsu)and Catholic for 40. You bow because of tradition not because of faith. Emerse yourself in the learning and you will become a better Christian


#8

I’ve done Shotokan for years, and I’ll echo what everyone else has said, that bowing is out of respect, and not worship.


#9

[quote=franksv]I don’t know what the RC official view is,but I have some exp with this.

I would say that if you are uncomfortable with anything,find a new school.But,you should be aware that MOST of the bowing and titles are cultural and not spiritual.I spent 10 years in taekwondo and the teacher’s title was master.Now,back then I was not a practicing Catholic so it was not an issue.Today I would call no man master,or bow to a photo,but thats me.I m lucky cuz I jumped ship to kung fu two years ago.My teacher teaches in backyards and garages in a very informal way.He is a very humble man and will not answer to master or even sifu.He likes to be called by his first name only and that works for me.

But,this is really something you have to decide for yourself.If bowing to a photo is bothersom,maybe thats the Holy Spirit tugging at you.
[/quote]

I have to say that I have been involved with MA for many years,
as everyone else has said the bowing is not intended for anything but respect, as for calling someone that has a haigh rank "master"
do you call a DR “DR”? its a title,earned at a given rank.some “Masters” think or act as if it is more but in no way is it meant to mean this person is the Master of you or in charge of you its simply a title achieved with rank meaning this person has mastered all basics to Black belt, and has "mastered many Blackbelt requirements as well.if you were to stop and think about it what is after the title “Master”? Its "Grand Master"
so by you saying you wont call any man “master” in this situation
you are actually missing out on a lot of what you should have learned and are actually holding Yourself back from becoming what you originally started traing to gain,being a master of your own mind and body and self control,
because that Master title is exactly that besides what I wrote above, this person has mastered what it takes to control anger,fear,emotions,and even lots of Pains…

dont look at that title as being to deep.


#10

[quote=cricket331]I have to say that I have been involved with MA for many years,
as everyone else has said the bowing is not intended for anything but respect, as for calling someone that has a haigh rank "master"
do you call a DR “DR”? its a title,earned at a given rank.some “Masters” think or act as if it is more but in no way is it meant to mean this person is the Master of you or in charge of you its simply a title achieved with rank meaning this person has mastered all basics to Black belt, and has "mastered many Blackbelt requirements as well.if you were to stop and think about it what is after the title “Master”? Its "Grand Master"
so by you saying you wont call any man “master” in this situation
you are actually missing out on a lot of what you should have learned and are actually holding Yourself back from becoming what you originally started traing to gain,being a master of your own mind and body and self control,
because that Master title is exactly that besides what I wrote above, this person has mastered what it takes to control anger,fear,emotions,and even lots of Pains…

dont look at that title as being to deep.
[/quote]

Your words ring true.As someone who is newer to the the Faith,I am still in a great cycle of change.Its easy to make mistakes both in extreame ways as well as taking somethings too lightly.Thank you for your point of view,for a while my martial arts practice was a source of stress,I have been able to put it in proper prospective.As I now have a teacher that does not require any title,its not an issue.But,if the day comes when my training changes again and the teacher has a tittle,I won’t have a problem.Thanks again,God Bless.

Frank


#11

I really happy to found a great information on Judo here. So detailed thread you started here. That is why I joined forum to get full detail information.


#12

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