Leading Evangelical Bishops in Church of England propose 'rethink' on sinfulness of homosexuality


#1

The Daily Telegraph of London, England reports on June 17,2016 that a couple “leading evangelical bishops” of the Church of England are proposing a ‘rethink’ of the sinfulness of homosexuality.

While not proposing to soften the traditional teaching on the family, they assert that those who do not accept it should not be excluded from the CoE as “heretics.”

They are among a group of evangelical clerics who have been calling for the Church to move to “affirming” people in same-sex relationships.

The Rt. Rev. Paul Bayes, of LIverpool, said the church teaching on sexuality should not be treated as a core doctrine like the Trinity or the Divinity of Christ, from which anyone who disagrees is a heretic. Other bishops were quoted in a similar opinion.

(The article did not refer in any way to the ‘theology of the body.’)


#2

Its utterly amazing to me how accurate the bible is in predicting the times we live in today…WOW! One can almost go down the list checking things off as they happen in succession.


#3

Well, I guess there really is no hope for the Church of England. 


#4

The Church of England might as well just accept adultery as no big deal if it is going to remove the sinfulness of homosexuality. If it is everything goes, then there is no morality or natural order of things, and the idea of holiness as preached by Christ in the Scriptures is thrown right out the window - by those who should know better no less!


#5

This is in line with the Reformation distinction between “essentials” and “non-essentials.” Once you make private judgment the ultimate judge of what is or isn’t essential and cease to view teaching as a unified whole, each generation rejects more than the previous one which leaves a steadily decreasing patrimony to the future. Anglicans come home!


#6

One thing at a time…once they have homosexuality generally accepted by most people, it will be on to the next group. Sin is progressive, its not like its suddenly going to grind to a halt when they are accepted, naturally other sexual perversions are going to attempt the same thing, until we ultimately reach a point when anything and everything goes and is totally acceptable. Personally I think the next one will be pedophilia, I see that more and more today, we are in the desensitizing stage right now.

I just hope and pray that Jesus returns before things get too out of control down here.


#7

It is the Church of England…what can I say?!

Does this mean we rethink all sins?


#8

From the article:

“Neither of the two bishop calls for traditional teaching on family issues to be abandoned.
But they say that those who do not accept traditional teaching should not be excluded.
Their intervention will anger traditionalists in the Church of England and could further inflame tensions with Anglican leaders in Africa and elsewhere.”

The article is linked below:
telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/16/two-bishops-urge-clerics-to-rethink-interpretations-of-the-bible/


#9

Personally I think it will be polygamy before pedophilia. People still get quite angry about the sexual abuse of children, and rightly so! However, most people now’a days don’t really value monogamy or being faithful to one person from marriage to death. And with TV shows like Sister Wives and the like, these things start introducing the idea to the general population in a slow non threatening way which eventually can lead to acceptance. And if I recall correctly this actually came up pretty quickly after gay marriage started gaining wins in the courts when it was going state by state.

Anyway, I agree with ya’ll, once you start pulling out foundation blocks eventually the whole structure has to fall down. Sin is indeed progressive, once one thing becomes acceptable it is easier to move on to the next. This is why the Catholic Church sticks to her guns so firmly, you can’t just give a little, because if you do then the people will just push harder.


#10

Seeing this here in some dioceses. It starts well, with the social aspect ie caring for and accepting the marginalised, then the human logic kicks in and the social aspect that we must fully accept everyone and welcome everyone as if they were Christ.

I saw this very fully when I was in a parish here where I had contact with the anglican vicar via a local market being set up …

One site exemplifies…

ireland.anglican.org/news/5690

It becomes very difficult then to speak of sexual morality as of course that would be to reject them?

Yet the central rule remains that Christian marriage is between one man and one woman.

If you have the stamina…
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_and_the_Anglican_Communion

My own view is that many are sincerely striving but are basing their thinking on human grounds of compassion and the inisistence of the gay community for “recognition” which seems to mean total accep tance of all and any sexual behaviour.

I am over 70 and in my young and not so young day,which included an Anglican raising, with high morality we never had any ideas on all this and would never even know what sexual proclivities our colleagues had. It has all become an unhealthy obsession


#11

Adding this page irishexaminer.com/ireland/lgbt-input-sought-for-church-of-ireland-stance-on-sexuality-250903.html

Not a word re the word of God etc. and this is what will be lost in this debate. The word is our only hope of unity and peace and the gay community who agitate for rights etc will not accept it?


#12

It is remarkable how accurate Charles Porterfield Krauth is in his description of how error enters the Church, comparing the bishops’ statement above to Krauth’s first stage.

When error is admitted into the Church, it will be found that the stages of its progress are always three. It begins by asking toleration. Its friends say to the majority: You need not be afraid of us; we are few, and weak; only let us alone; we shall not disturb the faith of the others. The Church has her standards of doctrine; of course we shall never interfere with them; we only ask for ourselves to be spared interference with our private opinions.

Indulged in this for a time, error goes on to assert equal rights. Truth and error are two balancing forces. The Church shall do nothing which looks like deciding between them; that would be partiality. It is bigotry to assert any superior right for the truth. We are to agree to differ, and any favoring of the truth, because it is truth, is partisanship. What the friends of truth and error hold in common is fundamental. Anything on which they differ is ipso facto non-essential. Anybody who makes account of such a thing is a disturber of the peace of the church. Truth and error are two co-ordinate powers, and the great secret of church-statesmanship is to preserve the balance between them.
From this point error soon goes on to its natural end, which is to assert supremacy. Truth started with tolerating; it comes to be merely tolerated, and that only for a time.

(C.P. Krauth, The Conservative Reformation and Its Theology, 1872)

Jon


#13

What is definition of “l****eading evangelical bishop”?

In our media culture, a “leading” bishop or theologian, or writer is anyone whose views the media wants to promote. A priest who constantly deemphasizes doctrine, who equates the church’s priorities with those of the media, is labelled “pastoral” and “Compassionate”. When an opening for a bishop comes up, he is well known, the obvious best choice. His books get published by major publishers, sold in mainstream bookstores, promoted by reviewers in mainstream websites.

If a bishop or priest affirms doctrine, he usually gets ignored, sometimes gets labelled a “hardliner” and “rigid”. His books and articles do not get reviewed, he does not get contacted by the media to quote his responses on whatever they are promoting this month. He is not a “big name”, so he does not get major speaking engagements.

Obviously this is true across the denominations.


#14

Nope…we know its still a sin (the act) because of the Truth of the Catholic Faith.


#15

It is time for all the Anglicans outside the Church of England to accept the Ordinariate of St. Peter and come home. I am talking about those called “the continuum”. The Cof E and The Episcopal Church do not even acknowledge sin anymore. Sad.

A few years back, the Anglican Church in America was all set to become reunited with Rome again but unfortunately they decided to stay independent anglican, if that makes sense.


#16

The inevitable result of the Reformation . As we increasingly see with so many Christian denominations they’re no longer led by the Holy Spirit -they are led by the culture of the times


#17

Krauth absolutely nailed it, especially the last sentence.


#18

"When error is admitted into the Church, it will be found that the stages of its progress are always three. It begins by asking toleration. Its friends say to the majority: You need not be afraid of us; we are few, and weak; only let us alone; we shall not disturb the faith of the others. The Church has her standards of doctrine; of course we shall never interfere with them; we only ask for ourselves to be spared interference with our private opinions.

Indulged in this for a time, error goes on to assert equal rights. Truth and error are two balancing forces. The Church shall do nothing which looks like deciding between them; that would be partiality. It is bigotry to assert any superior right for the truth. We are to agree to differ, and any favoring of the truth, because it is truth, is partisanship. What the friends of truth and error hold in common is fundamental. Anything on which they differ is ipso facto non-essential. Anybody who makes account of such a thing is a disturber of the peace of the church. Truth and error are two co-ordinate powers, and the great secret of church-statesmanship is to preserve the balance between them.
From this point error soon goes on to its natural end, which is to assert supremacy. Truth started with tolerating; it comes to be merely tolerated, and that only for a time".

(C.P. Krauth, The Conservative Reformation and Its Theology, 1872)

This possibility holds true not only for reformation communities but for institutions within Catholicism as well. The Theology department at a university, a religious order, or a coalition of religious orders, takes on a momentum of its own. Editors of a religious publication desperately want to be taken seriously by the secular media. Institutions that would never be granted a Catholic label in their present form, continue now to use that label earned when they were genuinely Catholic.

Even orthodox persons and agencies within the Church, aware of the problems Krauth describes at the institutional level, avoid confronting evil or postpone pulling off an inaccurate “Catholic” label from a now-rogue institution. Krauth’s analysis does not disprove the importance of a “Magisterium” - quite the contrary - but describes processes that also hurt Catholics.


#19

Exactly!The Catholic Church is considered anachronistic for standing firm with the Truth!:rolleyes:


#20

True.

But the Anglican living in South Bend can’t see Rome clearly from there. They can, however, see Notre Dame.


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