Luke 2:35 - "and you yourself a sword will pierce ..."


#1

Hello All,

I was just meditating upon Luke 2:34-35 (Simeon blessed them and said to Mary his mother, "Behold, this child is destined for the fall and rise of many in Israel, and to be a sign that will be contradicted and you yourself a sword will pierce so that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed." - and I'm just trying to figure out what Simeon prophesied about Mary and the "many" when he says, "so that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed."

At first I thought that perhaps he was saying that Mary will convert many to her Son through her Immaculate Heart (which is depicted with a sword pierced through it). Thus, the hearts of many will be revealed to be become loving hearts of Christ. Round-a-bout, I know, but just a thought.

Then I also thought, maybe, just maybe, the "hearts of many may be revealed" because there are those that ardently believe in Christ Jesus, but vehemently reject veneration or praying to Mary. Y'all know who I'm talking about here. So, is it possible that hearts are revealed to truly love and accept Christ and his Mother as the new Adam and the new Eve, as the New Covenant and the Ark of the New Covenant? What I'm trying to say is, that if you love Mary and hold to the Church's preeminence of Mary, then your heart is revealed as a loving, accepting, obedient, and faithful believer in Christ. Whereas, others who reject and slander Mary and her important role in the economy of salvation, then their hearts are revealed to not be fully accepting.

Just some rumination;l by no means binding, professed, doctrinal thought on my part!

Thanks to all who offer their thoughts!


#2

I would say so


#3

Very thoughtful question, one that I felt to look into more.
First I read the passage and accompanying commentaries on biblos dot com
Then searching for Catholic commentary, on scripturecatholic dot com, it reads:

** Luke 2:35 - Simeon prophesies that a sword would also pierce Mary's soul. Mary thus plays a very important role in our redemption. While Jesus' suffering was all that we needed for redemption, God desired Mary to participate on a subordinate level in her Son's suffering, just as he allows us to participate through our own suffering
*
it seems the question many have had on this scripture is...was is Mary doubting, some reference to this in the biblos commentaries as well. this never occurred to me, I was going on your initial questions or thoughts.

from regulafide dot blogspot dot com :

What draws our attention tonight is the meaning of "and a sword will pierce your (Mary's) own soul also." For at least since the time of Origen1 some commentators have argued that ψυχὴν διελεύσεται ῥομφαία is speaking of St. Mary's "doubting" at the crucifixion of her Son. Some employing this interpretation have argued against the "Sinlessness" of Mary (or that she remained free from actual sin by a special act of God) by stating that in the act of doubting a certain sinful presupposition must exist. However we ask, is this (doubt) interpretation of the text a mandatory reading?
*
*Far from it. Much lies on the translation of the nominative noun ῥομφαία which can be a literal or figurative (depending on context) type of sharp blade, broadsword or spear. Hence the flow of the Greek is clear, "also (Mary's) soul will be pierced by a blade." The play on words is unmistakable, as Christ will be pierced by a blade so also in a manner Mary. Thus the view that takes ῥομφαία as a metaphor for doubting is rather stretched and it is far more natural to understand ῥομφαία as a metaphor for the shared anguish of both the Son and the Mother at the crucifixion.2 This is further highlighted by the juxtapositioning of the external trials (v. 34) with the internal trials (v. 35). The Mother will also partake internally the external sorrows. 3

I do not think I can attach links yet, so wrote in the way I did.
Thank you for bringing this scripture to your post:-)

I did not do any exhaustive search, but the one I did led me to these.

Peace~*


#4

#5

Just a thought…I often wonder if, as Mary went through life, she wondered if this or that incident was the sword Simeon was referring to…i.e. flight into Egypt, Jesus lost for three days, etc. until both came to the cross and she knew without a doubt…kind of like waiting for the other shoe to drop, and I don’t mean that disrespectfully but she, like the rest of us didn’t know the future and just had to live one day at a time. She must have had questions since mostly what she ‘knew’ was that her son would also be the Son of the Most High and what was in the scriptures . Maybe the Holy Spirit, through Simeon, was giving her a little inkling of what her Son’s life and Mission would be.


#6

[quote="Carolyn_Widhalm, post:5, topic:314219"]
Just a thought...I often wonder if, as Mary went through life, she wondered if this or that incident was the sword Simeon was referring to...i.e. flight into Egypt, Jesus lost for three days, etc. until both came to the cross and she knew without a doubt...kind of like waiting for the other shoe to drop, and I don't mean that disrespectfully but she, like the rest of us didn't know the future and just had to live one day at a time. She must have had questions since mostly what she 'knew' was that her son would also be the Son of the Most High and what was in the scriptures . Maybe the Holy Spirit, through Simeon, was giving her a little inkling of what her Son's life and Mission would be.

[/quote]

You have nicely expressed something that I have also wondered about. This is something that I meditate upon while praying the Rosary.

DGB


#7

It is such great resposibility to be chosen to be the mother of God. And there was a price to be paid. Mary would see her beloved son crucified and that would be a sword piercing into her heart. The other sword edge would be for her to see people rejecting the sacrifice of her son. This is where the true hearts are revealed, whether they are for the savior or not. The prophecy nevertheless came true in the death of her son and where people either accept or reject him and thus the hearts revealed through their choices.


#8

Hello GodLoveYou…

I continue to ponder the original thoughts you had on Jesus and Mary being the next Adam and Eve. Searching around, I have found these things and thought to share:

From DevineMercynatoma dot com , comment from Deacon Rick Morales, Enter Into The Mystery ~ bulletin dated 20130120:

*Before the fall of Adam of Eve, Eve had not yet received her name. Instead, she was just referred to as “Woman.” After the fall, God promised the advent of another “woman” in Genesis 3:15, or a “New Eve” who would oppose Lucifer, and whose “seed” would crush his head. This “woman” and “her seed” would reverse the curse, so to speak, that the original “man” and “woman” had brought upon humanity through their disobedience.

When we then look at the New Covenant, Jesus is explicitly referred to as the “last Adam,” or the “New Adam” in 1 Cor. 15:45. And Jesus himself indicates that Mary is the prophetic “woman” or “New Eve” of Genesis 3:15 when he refers to his mother as “woman” in John 2:4 and 19:26. Moreover, St. John refers to Mary as “woman” eight times in Revelation 12. As the first Eve brought death to all of her children through disobedience and heeding the words of the ancient serpent, the devil, the “New Eve” of Revelation 12 brings life and salvation to all of her children through her obedience. The same “serpent” who deceived the original woman of Genesis is revealed, in Revelation 12, to fail in his attempt to overcome this new woman. The New Eve overcomes the serpent and as a result, “The serpent is angry with the woman, and went off to make war on the rest of her offspring, on those who keep the commandments of God, and bear testimony to Jesus” (Rev. 12:17).
*

:signofcross:

How all the threads are woven into a beautiful design


#9

The Redemptorist Saint Alphonsus de Liguori (1696 - 1 August 1787) relates in The Glories of Mary a story about the Dominican tertiary Blessed Benvenuta Bojani, who wished to participate in the dolours Our Lady felt and asked Her for this desire to be granted. It is related she almost died of sorrow while it was only a portion of the one which the Blessed Virgin experienced at Calvary. Likewise Saint Bernardine of Siena is told to have said that in case the grief of Mary was divided among the whole mankind, it would be enough to cause their death instantly.

The Glories of Mary, p. 431:

In fine, this sword so cruelly
pierced the heart of the most holy Virgin, that the
blessed Benvenuta, desiring one day to share the holy
Mother's pain in this dolour, and entreating her for
this favour, Mary appeared to her with the infant
Jesus in her arms j but while Benvenuta was enjoy-
ing the sight of this most beautiful child, in a moment
she was deprived of it. So great was her grief, that
she had recourse to Mary, entreating her to mitigate
it, that it might not cause her death. In three days
the holy Virgin again appeared, and said : ' Know, my
daughter, that thy sorrow is only a small part of that
which I endured when I lost my Son.


#10

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