Male sexual abuse victims too often suffer in silence

ottawacitizen.com/news/Male+sexual+abuse+victims+often+suffer+silence/3154520/story.html

Most people think sexually predatory priests are loners who have gone rogue, but, in fact, they often work in packs to target victims, says a forensic psychologist.

"These are actually pedophile rings made up of priests who were essentially trading children, sending them different places, taking them on trips where other priests would come and abuse them," David Lisak said in an interview.

It just goes to show that pedophiles are predators. Some like to hunt in packs, some like to hunt alone. But what is really scary is that many of your relativistic types see this as just another alternative sexual lifestyle that should be accepted. After all, children like it you know so no one is being hurt. It's only when society puts other ideas into children's heads that they get all screwed up. Or so they say...

[quote="momor, post:2, topic:202042"]
But what is really scary is that many of your relativistic types see this as just another alternative sexual lifestyle that should be accepted.

[/quote]

Name one legitimate organization that is accepted within Western society and whose mandate is to promote pedophilia as " just another alternative lifestyle".

[quote="Zatzat, post:3, topic:202042"]
Name one legitimate organization that is accepted within Western society and whose mandate is to promote pedophilia as " just another alternative lifestyle".

[/quote]

NAMBLA. And before you say they're not legitimate, then why does the ACLU defend them?

In Christ,

Ellen

[quote="ALLGIRLS, post:4, topic:202042"]
NAMBLA. And before you say they're not legitimate, then why does the ACLU defend them?

In Christ,

Ellen

[/quote]

Nambla is no more accepted within society than the KKK is. Try again.


[quote="Zatzat, post:5, topic:202042"]
Nambla is no more accepted within society than the KKK is. Try again.

[/quote]

How convenient for you. :rolleyes:

[quote="ALLGIRLS, post:4, topic:202042"]
NAMBLA. And before you say they're not legitimate, then why does the ACLU defend them?

[/quote]

For the same reason the ACLU defended the National Socialist Party. The ACLU sees freedom of speech to be an almost absolute right.

Here is the ACLU's explanation:

What the ACLU does advocate is robust freedom of speech for everyone. The lawsuit involved here, were it to succeed, would strike at the heart of freedom of speech. The case is based on a shocking murder. But the lawsuit says the crime is the responsibility not of those who committed the murder, but of someone who posted vile material on the Internet. The principle is as simple as it is central to true freedom of speech: those who do wrong are responsible for what they do; those who speak about it are not.

It is easy to defend freedom of speech when the message is something many people find at least reasonable. But the defense of freedom of speech is most critical when the message is one most people find repulsive. That was true when the Nazis marched in Skokie. It remains true today.

aclu.org/free-speech/aclu-statement-defending-free-speech-unpopular-organizations

I think NAMBLA has about as much cultural and social support as do Nazis in the US.

[quote="Dale_M, post:7, topic:202042"]
For the same reason the ACLU defended the National Socialist Party. The ACLU sees freedom of speech to be an almost absolute right.

Here is the ACLU's explanation:

aclu.org/free-speech/aclu-statement-defending-free-speech-unpopular-organizations

I think NAMBLA has about as much cultural and social support as do Nazis in the US.

[/quote]

Good post, nice find. My sentiments exactly.

Google "twink' or "boi". Post pubescent teen males are an accepted attraction and sub culture in some segments of the gay community.

NAMBLA represents what was a minor occurance in the priest abuse cases: true pedophilia with a pre-pubescent.

[quote="scipio337, post:9, topic:202042"]
Google "twink' or "boi". Post pubescent teen males are an accepted attraction and sub culture in some segments of the gay community.

NAMBLA represents what was a minor occurance in the priest abuse cases: true pedophilia with a pre-pubescent.

[/quote]

Yep. There are also segments of heterosexuals that prefer teen and younger women...go figure. :shrug: For some reason, homosexual apologists try to hold up such homosexual predilections as non-existent or minimal. They believe there is no way that priests with SSA would possibly prey on teenage boys...they believe it must be heterosexual pedophiles (even though 80% of the cases weren't pedophilia). It makes no sense.

[quote="Zatzat, post:5, topic:202042"]
Nambla is no more accepted within society than the KKK is. Try again.

[/quote]

Well, if I recalll correctly, the ACLU has defended them, as well.

Explain this, then: ACLU stands for American CIVIL LIBERTIES Union. So, they obvioiusly believe that having the ability to publish materials that instruct grown men on how to molest children is a civil liberty (as is being able to shout racist propaganda and burn crosses in multiracial neighborhoods during "demonstrations"). And, since the ACLU is a well respected organization in all but conservative political circles, how can you say NAMBLA isn't a legitimate (I didn't say respected, only other child molesters respect them) organization? I mean, the Supreme Court heard their case, that would lend them some air of legitimacy, no?

In Christ,

Ellen

[quote="ALLGIRLS, post:11, topic:202042"]
Well, if I recalll correctly, the ACLU has defended them, as well.

Explain this, then: ACLU stands for American CIVIL LIBERTIES Union. So, they obvioiusly believe that having the ability to publish materials that instruct grown men on how to molest children is a civil liberty (as is being able to shout racist propaganda and burn crosses in multiracial neighborhoods during "demonstrations"). And, since the ACLU is a well respected organization in all but conservative political circles, how can you say NAMBLA isn't a legitimate (I didn't say respected, only other child molesters respect them) organization? I mean, the Supreme Court heard their case, that would lend them some air of legitimacy, no?

In Christ,

Ellen

[/quote]

Aclu defends freedom of speech issues your country. That's your barometer, if the aclu defends something, it's legitimate?

Puhlease! :rolleyes:

Oh, you want examples. OK.

Large swaths of Hollywood early on turned out to defend some director hiding in Europe who ADMITTED to seducing (and allegedly raping) a minor girl. Many of them later quietly vanished when public opinion did NOT go their way. Others, like Whoopie Goldberg stood their ground.

John Stossel not so long ago, did a "Gimmee a Break" segment on 20/20 deriding the statutory rape standards of 18 years for the age of consent and outright called defenders of this age unrealistic and prudish.

Alfred Kinsey, the FATHER of today's cultural sexuality outlook was strongly of the opinion that children can and SHOULD be drawn into sexual encounters early in life before they became sexually repressed by cultural taboos. Kinsey's work strongly influenced generations of psychologists and psychiatrists.

NAMBLA is not alone. They are to child sexual predators what Jack Chick is to anti-catholics. They purposely take the extreme, wacky fringe position so that people like Stossel, Goldberg and Kinsey seem less wacked out.

As to the original post, there certainly was a "lavender mafia" within the catholic priesthood for a time. There are far too many stories out there to deny it. It happened especially during the leadup to the rebellion and attempted hijacking of the Vatican II Council and the extreme lack of emphasis on faithful catholic sexual teaching by the bishops in that era. It is no coincidence that scandalous behavioral permissiveness on the part of priests peaked during the same time period that so many priests and bishops were promoting scandalous sexual permissiveness among the laity.

Good thing our faith isn't grounded in our priests, but our GOD.

The legal age of consent, where a person can consent to sex with an adult of any age inCanada, is 16. Just about 3 or 4 years ago, it had been 14, but got bumped up.

16 sounds about right to me, as the average age of fist intercourse in Canada is 16.5 years old.

If you think any of the pedophilic and other morally repugnant groups who prey on children are examples of moral repugnant and criminal acts being accepted by society...you're mistaken.

[quote="Zatzat, post:12, topic:202042"]
Aclu defends freedom of speech issues your country. That's your barometer, if the aclu defends something, it's legitimate?

Puhlease! :rolleyes:

[/quote]

I'm not defending the ACLU. I think they lost their crediblity a long time ago, when they started defending organizations like the KKK and NAMBLA. Racial intimidation and pedophlia aren't free speech issues. However, many Americans think the ACLU is a wonderful organization defending civil rights. I was just seeing where the OP falls in this spectrum (given his opinions on other threads, I'm guessing he approves of the ACLU, but I could be wrong :shrug:)

In Christ,

Ellen

[quote="ALLGIRLS, post:15, topic:202042"]
I'm not defending the ACLU. I think they lost their crediblity a long time ago, when they started defending organizations like the KKK and NAMBLA. Racial intimidation and pedophlia aren't free speech issues. However, many Americans think the ACLU is a wonderful organization defending civil rights. I was just seeing where the OP falls in this spectrum (given his opinions on other threads, I'm guessing he approves of the ACLU, but I could be wrong :shrug:)

In Christ,

Ellen

[/quote]

I'm no supporter of any organization that throws its support behind NAMBLA.

It sounds as though the ACLU is unaware that there is a difference between free speech and hate speech.

[quote="scipio337, post:9, topic:202042"]
Google "twink' or "boi". Post pubescent teen males are an accepted attraction and sub culture in some segments of the gay community. .

[/quote]

I think you could find an equal fascination, among many heterosexual men, with teen girls.

And its at least, if not more, culturally acceptable. Honestly, I am amazed at the number of people on the website of my local TV station who blame the girl when a teacher gets sexually involved with his student(s).

[quote="Dale_M, post:17, topic:202042"]
*I think you could find an equal fascination, among many heterosexual men, with teen girls. *

And its at least, if not more, culturally acceptable. Honestly, I am amazed at the number of people on the website of my local TV station who blame the girl when a teacher gets sexually involved with his student(s).

[/quote]

Exactly my point. However, "culturally acceptable" or not, 80% of the priestly abuse case victims were teenage boys. If it were teenage girls, then I would say we have a heterosexual priest problem....

[quote="Zatzat, post:14, topic:202042"]
The legal age of consent, where a person can consent to sex with an adult of any age inCanada, is 16. Just about 3 or 4 years ago, it had been 14, but got bumped up.

16 sounds about right to me, as the average age of fist intercourse in Canada is 16.5 years old.

If you think any of the pedophilic and other morally repugnant groups who prey on children are examples of moral repugnant and criminal acts being accepted by society...you're mistaken.

[/quote]

How do you explain the proliferation of child porn? There are a lot more people out there who accept it than are willing to come out of the closet and say so or join a pedophile group. Everytime society expands the definition of what is "normal" or acceptable sexual behavior it makes it easier for some other deviant group to push their agenda. Just imagine yourself back in the 1950's. Do you think you would have imagined a world in which homosexual marriage was legal and the president of the US declared an LGBT month?
Now imagine yourself 60 years in the future in a society made up of a majority of moral relativists, each one trying harder than the next to be "tolerant". You really think it's so hard to imagine pedophilia out of the closet and on it's way to acceptance? I don't.

I know that threads can vary from the original topic but I think only part of the topic is being addressed here. The quote from post #1 addressed perpetrators but this thread title also refers to survivors.

From the article:

Lisak will address a fundraiser for The Men's Project, a unique Ottawa service for men recovering from abuse. Founded in 1997, it offers counselling, trauma recovery, anger management and emotional intelligence help. Lisak says the group is one of few in North America, and it is so well regarded that its staff is travelling to cities like Los Angeles and San Francisco to train clinicians.

Read more: ottawacitizen.com/news/Male+sexual+abuse+victims+often+suffer+silence/3154520/story.html#ixzz0rBVSXg5P

Male survivors, like female survivors, need respect, empathy, safety, and the chance to recover. Talking a lot about the motivations of abusers of males may detract from the experience of male survivors, who often get messages that it's not being a "real man" to complain about any kind of victimization. Also, this culture tends to believe that sexual abuse happens to girls only, with some exceptions such as prison.

The needs of male survivors are legitimate, but it is hard for a lot of people to listen to a man talk about being raped. One guy commented that people didn't believe him b/c he was strong and over 6 feet tall, but he said when this happened he was a child and 4 feet something or other - in other words, vulnerable. He needed support the same way female survivors do.

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.