Marian devotion.....and when it gets too far?

#21

Yeah, it’s clear as a bell to me. I love Mary, venerate her, ask her to pray for me, ask her to do things like give me graces from God that God has specifically tasked her with doing.

I worship God in the three persons of the Trinity.

Not sure how anyone would confuse the two things unless they think kneeling in front of a statue or putting flowers before it is “worship”, and we’ve had a bunch of threads already explaining that it’s not.

Just came from Adoration where I prayed a Rosary in front of Jesus and I wasn’t the least bit confused about who I was worshipping. Jesus and only Jesus.

4 Likes

#22

The CCC#971 says “The Church’s devotion to the Blessed Virgin is intrinsic to Christian worship”. Intrinsic means something natural or essential. God commanded “Honor thy father and thy mother”. Who would consider that honoring their biological mother is something only recommended? Now, Mary is our mother and the Mother of the Church, the whole mystical body of Christ. How can a catholic rationally hold that honoring and having at least some devotion and love for Mary, their own spiritual and most loving mother who gave us Christ our Savior, is something only recommended? Is this how we treat mothers? No it is not if we don’t want to have the wrath of God fall on us! “Whoever dishonors his father or his mother shall be put to death” (Exodus 21:17). Mary is also the mother of Jesus of course, the Mother of God. Does not Jesus honor and love his mother as He commands us to honor and love our own biological mother? And if we have the Spirit of Jesus, then we are surely going to honor and love Mary his mother too or we don’t truly have the Spirit of Jesus in us.

2 Likes

#23

It is good that you want to do the right thing with regard to Our Blessed Mother.

Our Lord Jesus Christ gave her to us at the foot of the Cross. She is our spiritual Mother.

When we imitate her virtues we can grow closer to Our Lord.

The Rosary is a beautiful prayer because it is meditating on the life of Jesus, while holding the hand of our Blessed Mother who knew him so well. Many graces come to us through her.

Those are just a few thoughts to share with you about our loving Mother.

4 Likes

#24

I think it goes too far when there are almost “cults” set up around certain Marian apparitions, particularly Fatima. Some Catholics seem to pivot their entire faith around the Fatima messages, secrets, etc., holding conferences, sending out newsletters, and insisting on conspiracies surrounding various countries being consecrated.

2 Likes

#25

I’ve been wondering this for months

0 Likes

#26

If by “dialogue”, you mean chat, converse, have a little talk…

Do you “dialogue” with your own mom? I’m sure you do.
Mary’s your mom given to you by God, so you’d act the same way with her that you would with your mom.
I talk to her all the time.

2 Likes

#27

Thanks. :heart::heart::church::church:

1 Like

#28

God commanded above all else to have no other gods before him. And Jesus never said anything about praying through any other specific person. As I said I have no issue with Mary, but what I often see in her veneration seems way too much like idolatry to me. It is honestly deeply disturbing to me.

2 Likes

#29

Mary is the Mother of God. It is because Mary said yes to God, that we have Jesus Christ , as the Word made flesh. We venerate Mary as the Mother of God, as our mother - given to us by Jesus Christ with virtually His last breath as He was dying in agony on the Cross, and because Mary has a very important job to do still. This job is defeating the evil of satan in the world. Its reference is scriptural and given in church Tradition.

We do not idolize Mary , we joyously and publicly acknowledge the work, both in her living and now, of Mary in all her roles. Mary, a human just like us, who is the first amongst saints and our role model for seeking a holy life.

2 Likes

#30

We’ve had dozens of threads discussing this. If you continue to be disturbed by it in spite of the many, many good explanations people have provided, then it seems likely you will not be convinced by words.
You will just have to pray for more understanding and I will pray for you too.

1 Like

#31

Thanks, Tis_Bearself,

Sometimes a picture truly is worth a thousand words! :slight_smile:

Also sometimes words are necessary: St. Maximillian certainly agrees with St. Bernard who said: “De Maria, numquam satis” --“Of Mary, there is never enough”

1 Like

#32

Yes, I have heard all the explanations. It still disturbs me at a deep level. The scriptural case for the extreme veneration of Mary is very weak, especially compared to the enormous themes warning against idolatry. Most all mariology is based in tradition, and honestly it above all else causes me to doubt the infallibility of church tradition because it veers so wildly from Scripture. It is one thing to ask for the prayers of Mary along with all the Saints and all the Church, but the pressure to idolize her disturbs my conscience.

2 Likes

#33

Co-signed all of this. I’m perfectly fine with it if others have a strong Marian devotion provided it doesn’t turn Jesus into an afterthought, but it’s just not a big part of my spiritual life, and I get a little peeved when others imply it’s necessary. To each his own, though.

3 Likes

#34

I had a distant relationship with my mother. She grew up in the minority of her siblings, being a girl. I think she had a very adversarial relationship with them, and when I, as a boy was growing up, I felt she was just projecting her dislike for her brothers on me. She was overly angry about small things. I had nuns in school who acted the same way. I never felt welcome at home I never had any affection from my mom. Even as a boy growing up, i couldn’t remember affections from my mom. She was a dictator mom.

From time to time I thought I experienced incestuous emotional advances from my mother, which pushed me away as you could imagine.

We were relatives who needed and depended on each other, at best.

So, I don’t have these brain circuits along which I have a natural affection for Mary. She gets generalized into the distant, controlling, often unfriendly women who were supposed to be modelling Mary to me. So, this is the first time I put it into words, right here, why do I need Mary?

A friend of mine was distracting me in a high school class, enough to draw the attention of the nun. I went to apologize after class and she just about bit my head off. Yeah, this is probably another post of mine that won’t measure up to community standards, for telling the truth.

2 Likes

#35

I am so sorry you were dealing with that. Starting and end point is Jesus, always. Ask Jesus to change your heart towards Mary and ask him to help you forgive your mother and the nuns. I struggle with the Mary thing because of old Protestant teachings about idolatry so I stick to just the Hail Mary at mass and a decade of rosary once a day. Jesus is enough for your salvation though so one step at a time

0 Likes

#36

We don’t “idolize” her, and the Catholic church is not Sola Scriptura.

So it seems to me that the problem is really coming from your own mind in not being open to the actual teachings of the Church.

As long as you keep relying on your own interpretation of Scripture for this issue, you’ll continue to be disturbed, I guess.

3 Likes

#38

The creator of the universe humbled Himself & surrendered Himself to her virginal womb where the divine was married to the human. It is that very same womb where the human (you) will be married to the divine.

Follow Jesus. Do what he did. Surrender to God’s masterpiece.

2 Likes

#40

We understand why it disturbs you , but I don’t see any way we can talk you out of your disturbance.

The Church is not going to change its approach to Mariology because a subgroup of people are disturbed by it.

As others have posted, if Marian devotion is not for you, then apart from the one or two “Mary prayers” that are part of the Mass, you’re free to not practice it. A lot of Catholics will not agree with your position and will think you’re missing out on great spiritual benefits; if you tell them all this stuff about how it disturbs you, they’ll respond with the same arguments that you say you’ve already heard. If you tell a Mary devotee they’re being “idolatrous”, at best they’re going to respond with, “OK, you do your thing and we’ll do ours, your loss” and at worst they’re going to get offended because you are showing a lack of acceptance of Catholic practice and insulting something dear to them.

I really don’t know what you’re trying to accomplish with these posts, but I’m going to mute thread now and just pray for you. God bless.

2 Likes

#41

I was just thinking about this very thing, as I was reading through all of the posts.

I also think of her as our spiritual Mother too, @Dorothy. :slightly_smiling_face:

I think of her as being a part of our Heavenly family. I think of her as our Heavenly Mother and as Jesus’ Mother, and as a Mother whom we can turn to as well, for help and intercession.

1 Like

#42

oldgraymare2,

How good it is to read your sharing about our Blessed Mother.

I recall something that Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen (if I am remembering correctly) said about our Mother…that she is God’s revenge on Satan. She, a mere creature given so much grace.
She suffered terribly while watching Jesus suffer on the Cross…and she was one with Him as He suffered.

Our Lord Jesus Christ asks us to pick up our cross and follow Him…and He loves His Mother very much.

3 Likes

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.