Mark of the beast related question


#1

First time posting here so go easy on me.

In my opinion the Mark of the Beast will be somehow related to Radio Frequency IDentification (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RFID for more information). As you can see from that link they are already implanting them into humans :mad:

Also I work as a computer programmer and many of the new projects in my company are starting to use RFID. Do you think would be a sin to work on a project that uses RFID if you believe it is somehow related to the Mark of the Beast. They haven’t asked me yet to work on one of these projects but if they did I wouldn’t feel comfortable doing so.

Dustin Michaels


#2

In the time of the writing of this scripture, it was common practice for the guilds to worship a pagan god, complete with orgies, etc. One who was not a member could not find work or do business well. Also, the money at the time was considered to be related to graven imagery, as it had the image of Caesar, considered to be godlike, making it hard to, as the scripture says, “buy and sell” without the image. :frowning: I also read that the beast could have been referring to Diocletian, a particularly anti Catholic and persecuting Caesar. My details may be wrong, as it is a couple of years since I took the class, but the priest teaching it was actually born to that culture and these writings were his specialty. He seemed to think that the number itself was not the problem, but that which it referred to.

Not that it matters, but I also read a fictional work that pointed out that 666 looks like 3 vertical slashes/claw marks when presented in one of the ancient languages. (Hebrew?)

Just some thoughts. Please, someone correct me if I am wrong.


#3

This coming from Revelation 13; 11-18. Picking up at verse 16 - 18 reads: Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or forehead, so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name. this calls for wisdom; let him who has understanding reckon the number of the beast, for it is a human number, its number is six hundred and sixty-six.

In the Navarre Bible Text and Commentaries on the Book of revelation it comments: “The author of the Apocalypse here uses a method (called gematria in Greek) to reveal the name of the beast in numerical form. In both Hebrew and Latin letters of the alphabet were also used as numbers. The figure 666 fits with the name Caesar Nero in Hebrew. Some manuscripts gave the number as 616, which fits Caesar Nero in Greek. However, Tradition does not provide an exact interpretation and various other names have in fact been suggested.”

You may look to study more of the book of Revelation to gain a greater understanding of the “mark of the beast” and how that could manifest itself in today’s world. I don’t know that RFID would fall into that category by itself, but it would become a matter of who is mandating its use - and to what extent it becomes enforced.

These are just thoughts of a layman who is not overly versed in the Book of Revelation or RFID. God Bless


#4

Sorry to ruin the fun, but speculation such as this is a waste of time and unworthy of a serious, mature Christian. One hundred years ago, the “mark” was thought to be one thing, one hundred years from now, it will be speculated to be something else, according to whatever technology comes around at that time. Hawthorne and denmacii are on the right track — interpret the Bible in the way it’s first readers understood it, and with sound biblical exegesis as approved by the Church.


#5

[quote=Fidelis]Sorry to ruin the fun, but speculation such as this is a waste of time and unworthy of a serious, mature Christian.
[/quote]

I would prefer it if that were qualified that being overly-concerned about the end times would be a waste of time. For example, so many Protestant sects are wound up with speculating about prophetic writings. But to be interested and speculate does not necessarily bespeak that. Christ does command us to read the signs of the times.

There is a good book about the End Times by a great Jesuit named Fr. William Kurz. I don’t recall its title, but it is a worthy read. He is a great biblical scholar and exegete at Marquette University. I’ve had the pleasure of meeting him personally on a few occasions.


#6

There are some holy Orthodox Elders who believe the same as the original poster. I myself am strongly against RFID and would resist any attempt to force a chip under my skin. I don’t know if it is the mark of the beast, but it sure doesn’t feel right to me. :frowning:


#7

[quote=DustinMichaels]First time posting here so go easy on me.

In my opinion the Mark of the Beast will be somehow related to Radio Frequency IDentification (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RFID for more information). As you can see from that link they are already implanting them into humans :mad:

[/quote]

it makes as much sense as any of the other theories floating around out here. If you have a few hours to kill do a search and check out the dozens of past threads on this topic. I will warn you, most of us have a hard time taking any of these theories seriously. Also, widipedia is not a reliable source of information for any serious researcher, as anyone can post anything on that cite, no matter what their credentials or lack of them.

Radio frequencies are part of the natural world, created by God, created good, created for good purposes. Like any other created thing they can be used by evil persons for evil purposes, but are essentially good in and of themselves, so there is no danger in using them for a good or neutral end.


#8

I have occasionally listened to Fundamentalist radio stations over the last 30 years. I have heard hundreds of theories about the mark of the beast and the end times, all of them proven wrong by their failure to happen. Hal Lindsey makes a good income selling his end times books to unsophisticated readers. All four (or is it five?) of them have been completely wrong. Look for him and other fundamentalist preachers to keep this material coming. It keeps listeners and readers in rapt attention, looking for some secret biblical insight. God bless our Protestant bretheren for their sincerity of faith. But for my part, I recall the words of Our Lord, “The exact time is not yours to know. The Father has reserved that to Himself.” Glory to God in the highest! - Rob


#9

Why would it even be a sin to work on the project that creates the mark of the beast when that would be fullfilling prophecy?

I don’t think this thing is the mark of beast because I think the mark would be visible.


#10

Revelation was written about 200 years before Diocletian’s time – the Emperor at that time was Domitian, who resembled Nero in many ways. The wound in the beast’s throat may be a reference to Nero, who committed suicide, and the legend of Nero Revividus – that Nero would come back to life. Many people believed Domitian was Nero come back.

Marks were quite common, one for a slave (usually on the forehead) and one for a soldier (usually on the hand.) Household and business slaves were often freed. Freed slaves became Roman citizens, with all the rights and priviliges of a citizen. Similarly soldiers became citizens (if they were not already) and were often paid off by being given land – usually settled in colonies in underpopulated areas. Greece was full of such colonies and the locals resented them.

John is probably talking about the Roman Empire and it’s exploitation of conquered peoples.


#11

The Book of Revelation is multilayered. Certainly, as several posters here have indicated, the “mark” probably had an application to the crisis then existing in the Church, and I would echo others who have indicated that a literalistic interpretation of the mark is most likely absurd. Hence, I wouldn’t think it would have anything to do with a literal mark being forged on our hands, forehead, etc.

On that vein, the most useful meaning to these things is most likely *spiritual *: the Seal of God in Rev. 7 is most likely meant to contrast the mark of the Beast in Rev. 13, both in a figurative sense. Then, those with the seal of God in their foreheads are those who are spiritually faithful to the truths of God, recognizing that, ultimately, the truth emanates from God. Hence, the seal of God is a metaphor for faithful Catholics. Then, the opposite extreme would be the mark of the beast, symbolizing persons who, unlike the faithful Catholics, who are total friends of God, are persons who are total enemies of God, who believe that truth is ultimately determined by man in his sinful nature, and who serve sin, or, associatedly the Devil, as opposed to “the servants of our God”.

There is even perhaps room for certain gray areas inbetween these extremes:i.e., consider the first two “woes” (the fifth and sixth trumpets). In the fifth trumpet, the individuals affected are “tortured” but don’t die, perhaps symbolizing this in a spiritual sense, which would fit with Christian heretics (i.e., mainly Protestants), who, while still possessing the supernatural life of God within them (assuming they are material heretics), are yet “tortured” through their lack of complete truth and lack of five of the seven Sacraments (they are tortured for “five months.”).

In the next trumpet, a third of man is actually “killed,” again, perhaps really spiritually, meaning, they slip into merely “natural religion”, denying the necessity of Revelation or Redemption from God, as in the deism, rationalism, and the “Enlightenment.”

Anyway, it’s just some thoughts. I elaborate a little on my blog, if you care to check out a short article.

GB,
scott


#12

There is a exhaustively researched book out, “revelation www. is 666” that includes RFID tracking devices. It also answers 616. Available at amazon.com and others. It is getting four stars, and includes emails back and forth to the Vatican, with their staged warnings. Multiple w’s in ancient hebrew can be interpreted 666 or 616…


#13

[quote=Calbreese]There is a exhaustively researched book out, “revelation www. is 666” that includes RFID tracking devices. It also answers 616. Available at amazon.com and others. It is getting four stars, and includes emails back and forth to the Vatican, with their staged warnings. Multiple w’s in ancient hebrew can be interpreted 666 or 616…
[/quote]

Does it haved the nihil obstat or imprimater?http://forums.catholic.com/images/icons/icon12.gif


#14

[quote=Calbreese]There is a exhaustively researched book out, “revelation www. is 666” that includes RFID tracking devices. It also answers 616. Available at amazon.com and others. It is getting four stars, and includes emails back and forth to the Vatican, with their staged warnings. Multiple w’s in ancient hebrew can be interpreted 666 or 616…
[/quote]

Dear Calbreese,

again, this is the problem with literalistic interpretations. On the other hand, I don’t like to vindicate the liberal retort, which simply relegates the book of rev to the opposite extreme, making its contents simply, and only, applicable to the Early Church. In my opinion, the most likely intention of the work is to describe spiritual realities and deep metaphysical theology, as Genesis, its counterpart, does.

On that vein, there is a real tradition in the Early Fathers that connects the Seven [Eight] Days of Creation with the Seven [Eight] Heads of the Beast. In this context, they are really a metaphorical outline of the entire progress and struggle of Salvation History, from the Fall, in the beginning, all the way to the end of the world and the New Creation.

This, then, is the balance between Protestant Fundamentalism and too-critical Liberalism: the beast is neither merely some secret force at the end of the world (like the internet) or pagan Rome in the beginning of Church history, but rather encompasses the entirety of the major stages of sin in history, from the beginning until the end. I elaborate more on my blog if you care to take a look at it.


closed #15

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