Marriage finally over? When to give up?(sorry so long)


#1

I have realised now that after fighting for three years for my marriage that I need to give up. I have posted at various times about the troubles my husband and I have had and now those troubles seem insurmountable. There seems to be no hope. I am struggling now with an overwhelming sense of grief, failure and hopelessness. Which is unlike me, as no matter how bad things seemed, I always had hope that they would work out or I hoped for a miracle. This is my second marriage, which makes me feel even worse about the situation. (please, please, nobody say I should look into why I am attracted to the same kind of men, etc etc.) I know why this happened. But no matter what you know and what warning signs there might be, they don’t always mean that the marriage is doomed.
I just have such a need to understand what happened.
We were separated, were living apart, separate houses, but trying to work things out. We have a 15mo son and I have 4 others to marriage #1. He has a 12yo son too.
About a week ago, we made plans to watch a movie together at his place. Because of circumstances, we swapped it to the next night and instead his nephew came over and they played a computer game all night. The next day when I went over there to get something, he sheepishly told me that he hadn’t been to bed at all.
I was upset as we were going to go out that day and our plans had been messed up but I got over it and apologised. He is a teacher and had been working very hard and I realised he needed the break as he was on holidays. He appreciated my understanding and sent me a few text messages through the day saying he loved me etc. that night, he still hadn’t been to bed, I got a message at 10.30 pm. Well, 48 hours with no sleep makes him unbearable, I said it was silly of him. I rang him, not very happy as he cancelled our night that night yet was still up with his nephew again!
He got upset and hung up on me. Well, no big deal. Little tiff. I was over it but the next day once again we were supposed to go out and didn’t . his b/d is new years eve and I spent the next 2 days looking for a present for him.
Sent a message asking if he was going to talk to me. Nothing. sent another, ‘were we going to not see him for his b/d and start the new year fighting?’. Nothing.
Rang him on his mobile. No answer. Rang him on his home phone. No answer.
Then message, ‘stay angry at me and leave me alone’ and ‘I don’t want to talk to you’
Over what??? Nothing. I was a little upset that he cancelled our plans, then stayed up late when he’d had no sleep for 2 days!
Sent message ‘asking him to get over it, let it go, it was minor.’
Nothing.
New years eve. His birthday. Heard nothing.
New years eve spent alone.
Next day, abrupt messages from him that his son wanted to get something he’d left at my place. I said fine.
Got his stuff.
Wouldn’t talk to me for the next 2 days.
Jan 2. I got abusive messages. He threatened things, (not physical), said he hated me, called me a b***ch, told me to, ‘go to hell’
I asked what it was all about. No explanation. Nothing. Just more abuse. Called me a ‘liar’, said ‘he hoped I’d rot’.
I still had NO idea why he was so angry.
I begged and pleaded for him to tell me what it was all about. He wouldn’t. I begged him to calm down over and over. I told him that I loved him and that he was bigger than this.
I was a wreck. The nastiness and the venom that he wrote in the messages was unbelievable. He told me he ‘would spend every cent to take me down’.
I then said that if he was intent on destroying me that I would do whatever it took to protect myself and the children even if it meant moving interstate. I said that he was out of control and that if I took the messages to the police he would be in trouble and that I would put a restraining order on him if he kept threatening me.
The next day, I got, ‘alright then. I am sorry. This is out of control.’
I was past caring by then. I tried. I begged and pleaded for him to calm down and he got worse. Nothing I said that night helped.
Then he sent, ‘happy anniversary’ (of the day we met)
My reply was, ‘what a joke. I wish 6 years ago I was anywhere but on the beach that day.’ ( I met him through a friend at the beach)
I had had enough. A week of ignoring me, then the abuse, then, I’m sorry? All through text messages (that in itself says there’s something seriously wrong)
I was angry. I knew then I could not do this anymore. Normal people do not do things like this. Normal marriages do not resolve conflict this way.


#2

Cont.

Then he asked if I wanted to see a movie. A MOVIE???
Is he insane? Bi-polar? Schizophrenic? After all the abuse??
Today he sent, ‘calmed down yet?’
ME? ME CALM??? What is the matter with him??? He was the one that was furious with me!!
Today we sent message after message. I said it is over.
He said his other son, (12yo) ‘was confused why after 6 years of teaching him about Catholicism and on the importance of marriage, that *I * am doing this.’ (I can’t believe it!!)
I just can’t deal with this anymore. It will never be normal. He has these terrible mood swings and no matter how good things are, it can all change in an instant.
I can’t take the insecurity, the stress, the turmoil. The children can’t live through this anymore. Its not good for them to think this is normal. It will damage their idea of marriage.
I feel so frustrated that he never sees what he does wrong. He always turns everything around on me. He’s never really sorry for treating me bad. He says ‘I’m sorry’, then an hour later, tells me to ‘go to hell’
I’ve prayed and prayed for this marriage. I’ve hoped that things would change, but now I need to let go. But the permanence of marriage runs very deep through me and I wonder if I will ever be able to ‘let go’ But I’ve never felt the real ‘hopelessness’ of the situation as I do now. I can’t see him ever changing. and although I know God can change people, I don’t feel He will.
I can’t believe I’m probably heading for a divorce, a second time. I’m in shock, especially when things were looking up. Everything I had wished for, dreamt of, wanted is now not going to happen. I am sad for our son and our other children. I am sad that I have dragged them through this.
Please pray for me.


#3

Jules, I have to advice, but I’m definitely praying for you. My brother is going through a divorce, and his wife sounds a lot like your husband. So…I know a little of what you’re going through, and I pray for you.

God Bless You, and Stay Strong!

:gopray:


#4

Jules…
i am sorry I have no advice to offer you but I can offer prayers…
just one question though…if he has such mood swings has he thought perhaps a visit to a doctor for some medication might help? You know somewhat even out the drastic mood swings


#5

Jules:

You are in my prayers. I am going through a painful divorce. I have said/done things that have hurt her and she’s said/done things that have hurt me.

Just keep your spirits up that there will be brighter days and that the anger will cease and be replaced by forgiveness.


#6

prayers, but it sounds to me like he has some major mood swings that are probably indicative of something else going on as well (emotional or physical) and needs help for that because it is obviously messing up all his relationships.


#7

Jules,
Has he seen a doctor? Sounds like he may need to. I am gonna be different than everyone else here and point out that you are in a good position. Yup, that’s right I said a GOOD position. If he is trying to make up with you, you are in the power position. You can ask him to go see a doctor, go to marriage counselling, etc. What is the worst he can say? No? You are already prepared for that. How about a retrouville weekend?

It really sounds like he may need medication or counselling… why not try that route first? Isn’t a marriage worth trying everything? I know the pain of divorce…been there done that and quite frankly…wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy!

Pray about it…


#8

I completely agree with this too and from your first post, you mentioned that this is your second marriage too… so you have been through a divorce too… do you honestly want to go through that again?? do whatever it takes to get it together…
you are in a position of power now and take full advantage of that. Also please do not beg him again as that is the BIGGEST mistake that you can make. You will just make the abuse worse. I know you want to do that as I did that too but that just drives them away even more.
even if he decides that he does not want to do anything to make this marriage better, do not beg. Pray and then go ahead and do everything to protect yourself and your children.
God Bless


#9

Have you ever looked at this website before?

www.marriagebuilders.com

My wife did not love me and was dead set on divorcing me before I found this website. We had tried marriage counselling and it did not help, I have read other “relationship” books and they didn’t help. This guys approach is not your traditional marriage counselling and he has been very succesful in saving marriages. Following his advice my wife fell back in love with me and our marriage is healthy now so I can testify that this stuff works.

Be sure to check out all the basic concepts first, but from what you have said it sounds to me like you both want to make it work but there is a lot of what he calls “Love Busters” going on, specifically selfish demands and disrespectful judgements I think.

marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3400_lovebust.html

There is also a forum on that website where you can get a ton of great support from people who have been through it and can give you practical advice on how to put these concepts in to action. When my marriage was falling apart that was pretty much the darkest time in my life. I was an atheist/agnostic at the time and this is when I found God again and I feel he guided me to this website. I always share it with others in the hope that it can have the same impact that it had on me and my marriage. It worth a shot at least…God Bless


#10

He needs to see a doctor but it’s the same old thing… he won’t admit he has a problem.


#11

Jules…
I am truly sorry to hear that…:frowning: do you think perhaps if you spoke with his doctor and explained what is going on with his moods etc. that the doctor could perhaps then speak to him?


#12

=BlestOne;1786720]Jules,
Has he seen a doctor? Sounds like he may need to. I am gonna be different than everyone else here and point out that you are in a good position. Yup, that’s right I said a GOOD position. If he is trying to make up with you, you are in the power position.

He doesn’t really want to make up… I don’t think. He just takes it as a matter of course. Abuse me, ignore me, then, oh, it’s gone on long enough, lets make up now.
Thing is, this has been going on for years and no matter what we have done, it doesn’t change and it doesn’t get any better.

You can ask him to go see a doctor, go to marriage counselling, etc. What is the worst he can say? No? You are already prepared for that. How about a retrouville weekend?

We don’t have Retrouvaille here. I am in South Australia. We have tried counselling. Didn’t help.

It really sounds like he may need medication or counselling… why not try that route first? Isn’t a marriage worth trying everything? I know the pain of divorce…been there done that and quite frankly…wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy!

I think I have tried everything. EVERYTHING. Nothing seems to work or at least break this pattern. And yes, I know the pain of divorce. It’s horrible. I’ve been there too. That’s why this is so much more distressing but I don’t know what else to do, i see no future and I see nothing changing for the better. I will probably end up losing my mind.

Pray about it…

I assure you, I do. I have prayed so much for my marriage but now I don’t want to pray for it anymore. I just want to pray for God’s will in my life, whether the marriage is saved or not. I don’t know.
Thankyou for your reply


#13

=Karin;1788020]Jules…
I am truly sorry to hear that…:frowning: do you think perhaps if you spoke with his doctor and explained what is going on with his moods etc. that the doctor could perhaps then speak to him?

Well, the doctor we see, I don’t know well enough to ask him to speak to him.
I truly do wonder if he has a mental illness and I think he is starting to think it himself too.
I mean, his behaviour is just not normal. I just don’t know any normal married people that do this!


#14

perhaps if as you stated he is also starting to realize there is a problem (mental health) then perhaps there is still hope…hope that he will seek treatment and repair the damage that has been inflicted in your marriage…


#15

I have seen this website but it seems to be for marriages with the normal range of problems.
I don’t think our problems are normal.
You see, he does love me and I do love him (don’t feel it at the moment though) but he seems intent on destroying it. It’s almost demonic.
He doesn’t do what most couples would do with issues. They discuss things. He seems to enjoy being angry and not giving me an explanation. He seems to take pleasure in me sweating it out, wondering, asking him to tell me what is going on. Truth is, this last thing is over NOTHING. It’s silly, petty. Seems like just an excuse for him to do all this. It’s not normal behaviour.
He knows that I have given him more love than anyone in his life and he fears losing me, yet he will push it that way,almost to say, 'see, I told you so, you’re just like the rest…'
I have stuck at it, and I know three years doesn’t sound very long, but they’ve been hell. They were almost all bad.
And I selfishly brought another child into all of this and will pay for that too.
The last thing in the world I wanted was another child in a single parent family with a part-time dad.
Its so sad


#16

Jules;

I’m so sorry to hear about this. It seems as though, for the sake of your own mental health, you are going to have to leave this man, since it seems as though he takes great joy in making you feel like you’re crazy. This is a form of abuse, and you have the right to leave, and take your kids with you, when someone is abusing you.

Please don’t feel bad about divorcing in a situation like this. There are times when a divorce is the good, right and Catholic thing to do, and this would seem to be one of those times - you have to protect yourself, and you have to protect your children.


#17

Wow! I can relate but thank God my husband has gotten on medication and sees a counselor. You are so right and this is not normal and to be honest marriage counseling will not help until he realizes his problem and seek help. In my marriage, many times we went to marriage counseling, but they all said the same thing, how can you work on your marriage when one of you has excessive anger and mood swings. My dh had to realize to get help for himself and then we could work out marrital problems. I have been there with the verbal abuse, the name calling, putting you down and twisting your words to make you seem to be the abnormal one. I have spent many days crying as a result of his mean words. Jules, I understand your situation. He does sound like a personality disorder, Borderline to be specific. I thought my dh had this, but he took a psychological test and even though he had tendency to this disorder, he did not have it. He still has mood swings, but not as when we were first married. My dh does go to Mass and his faith has helped him see where he needs to improve. I remember walking up to him talking to a priest complaining that I don’t accept his apologies anymore. the priest said, “Well, do you keep apologizing for the same behavior and not improve, they you don’t mean it and she knows it.” That was a good and wise answer that my dh needed to hear from another person besides me. He still thought the priest was wrong and so was I, but that was common for him to blame others for his problems. He is so much improved, but still has a bad temper. Yes, I could be happier, but as long as he keeps trying to improve, I will stay by his side. Are there times when I want out of the marriage, oh yes especially when he tells me to “shut up” or calls me names. He is not as mean as your husbands words were, but still they were mean words that hurt.

The anger and mood swings become like a cancer in your marriage and it will kill the marriage unless it is attacked from within and that person is only your husband. He alone has to want help and seek help and admit he has a problem. I would not feel bad if you got a divorce, as the PP said, sometimes it is for the best. I don’t think that marriage counseling will help, but individual counseling will help.


#18

continued…

Do you feel that you are losing your mind? Do you feel at times that you have the problem, or did you feel this way? Do you feel that you are walking on eggshells? Do you always have to protect your children from his behaviors or words? All this is not normal and I agree marriage builders and other help out there is not for this kind of marital problems.

I know that you are suffering so much, more than I thought. I had to look at other threads when I saw the one you left in the “prayer for marriages” one. I knew you were hurting real bad. I am so sorry and I have experienced this hurt. Please find a good support group if they have one there. I think there are even online support groups. Look up Borderline PD on the internet and see if this is what he may have, of course, you are not a doctor, but you can find out for you. Also, don’t erase you text messages that he wrote to you and was mean and cruel. You may need this to protect yourself and your baby. It is all sad as you say, it is a very sad situation. I do agree with you also, that you are praying and discerning about all this. If you are like me, you have been praying since you first notice a difference in your marriage. I am like you also in another matter. You say that you feel bad that you brought a child into all this. I felt this way for a long time also. I remember crying when I was pregnant and telling my baby that I chose a terrible daddy for her. Thank God things got better and I am so glad that I did get pregnant, even though at the time I regreted it. This is normal to feel this way, I think and I hope so for that is how I felt. It will get better. If you do divorce, I fear that part of child visitation may be a nightmare for you too. Please don’t make the mistakes my sister did and I have learned also from it in case if I ever have to divorce. Don’t agree to child visitation if you know he can be verbally and emotionally abusive and possibly physically due to his anger. This needs to come out and ask for supervised visitation for the dad to see your baby. There is more I can tell you, but first you need to get through his suffering.

Your in my prayers, Jules.


#19

I’m sorry, Jules. I know it’s been a heavy cross.

I think you are right. It’s not good for the kids to have all this instability. Maybe some distance will force him to deal with his problems.

God bless you and your children.


#20

Have you been able to get him to look at it though? It sounds like he needs this advice more than you. I think you may be wrong that your problems are not normal. You are making a big assumption that couples with issues normally sit down and discuss things as you say. This could be a big part of the problem. In my experience this is often the woman’s desired approach to a conflict while the man may simply want to ignore things because he doesn’t want to fight and have things escalate. This is a bad cycle as the woman usually gets even more upset when the man behaves like this. If you try to force him to talk your probably just going to get an angry outburst. If this is the case your best course of action is to leave him alone until he is ready and not hold it against him. When he is ready to talk to you again do not bring up the argument again or be negative but instead welcome him back lovingly. I have been through marriage counselling too, and I am very leary of marriage counsellors and think many if not most of them stink and actually make things worse. The best thing is to work on this stuff together, but one spouse can lead the other back. My wife didn’t love me, had an affair, wouldn’t talk to me, and was intent on divorcing me before I put this advice in to action. It took awhile and was very difficult, there were ups and downs, but after about a year of it the love was restored and now we are expecting another child together. Even if there is no infidelity involved I would highly recommend plan A to you:

marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

Basically you have to take the high road and basically try to be a saint. So he was inconsiderate and cancelled your plans, getting upset with him makes it worse. Also I noticed you were upset he was still up with his nephew, if you said this to him he will take it as a judgement and become defensive. Definitely don’t accuse him of having mental health issues! He may have them but he needs to realize this for himself and the best way is to meet the angry outbursts with kindness. Basically he is hyper sensitive and you have to walk on egg shells to pull things back together so that the real healing can begin. You still seem to be in a state of conflict in your marriage but your dangerously close to heading in to withdrawl which would make things even more difficult.

marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3600_state.html

You are in my prayers,
God Bless


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