Mary Never Truly Died


#1

I have a person I know that really has a hard time respecting catholism. He claims that we worship Mary even though I told him already we don’t. He claims that Mary death in Bible wasn’t how we Catholics believe it to be. How did Mary die in the Bible?


#2

Mary’s death is not recorded in scripture.


#3

Mary’s death isn’t in the Bible…neither is her birth. It is Tradition in the East that she did indeed die (her Dormition) and was assumed 3 days later. It’s hard to argue things like that with a “bible-based” evangelical Christian (at least that’s what it sounds like this guy is). We (Catholics and Orthodox) believe in Oral Tradition as well as written (Bible).


#4

That’s what I though to. He cocnstantly attacks Mary saying that she isn’t anything special and that the Bible says she died a death like everyone else. I think that she ascended into heaven. He is suppossly a self proclaimed followers of Christ Christian without a religion.


#5

She was assumed, she did not ascend.


#6

Ask him to show you where Mary’s death is recorded in the Bible.


#7

What’s the difference?


#8

What does assume mean?


#9

When the pope officially promulgated the dogma of the assumption in 1951, no declaration was made as to whether or not she died, it just stated that when her life on earth was completed she was assumed into heaven, the wording was compatible with a belief that she died and was then asummed or that she did not die but was assumed in life


#10

Jesus ascended into Heaven under his own power. Mary was assumed into Heaven by God at the end of her life. Mary had no power to do so on her own, it was a special privilege. The language carefully makes this distinction.


#11

I see making her entrance into heaven unique from everyone’s else. No one, but her had the private of assuming into expert her right?


#12

Now, I am devoted to Our Mother…she brought me into the Church and I dedicated my son to her and I pray for her intercession for them and for me as a mother every day. However, I fail to see how this issue refutes Catholicism as a whole. Many “I make my own rules” Christians like to argue these points endlessly, as if the whole of the Church rotated on a minor issue. Also, as addressed above, you cannot argue with someone if you don’t start with the same given. If this person conveniently ignores 2000 years of well-established Oral Tradition, but it’s central to your argument then Mary’s assumption is not your issue. Sola Scriptura is your issue.


#13

Elijah and Enoch were also taken up bodily into heaven while still alive, this is in the OT. Possibly the same happened to Moses


#14

Actually not really. Both Enoch and Elijah in the Old Testament were taken into heaven (and them without dying) So regardless of what your friend thinks about the Blessed Virgin Mary there is clear scriptural precedence that this can happen.

In addition if he thinks there is nothing special about The Blessed Virgin Mary he is going completely against scripture since scripture says, “For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed;” Luke 1:48.

So there it is right in Scripture that she is pretty special and that future generations would appropriately recognize this fact.


#15

Dang, you beat me to it haha


#16

One ascends under one’s own power (Jesus).
One is assumed through the power of God (Mary).

IOW, Jesus rose by Himself; Mary was taken up (assumed) by God.

So yes, quite a big difference.


#17

I would like to see him say the same thing to Jesus.

I don’t get Evangelicals. They go on and on about motherhood being a respected vocation, yet turn around and treat Mary with contempt. I have heard some of them say Mary was just an incubator.

Not all Evangelicals do this of course and I am encouraged to say that a lot do accord Mary respect.


#18

It is unclear if she actually passed away before being assumed into Heaven or was assumed prior to death. That’s my understanding anyhow. I do not believe the Church has an official stance on this.


#19

Please read CCC 86 in your catechism. It’s the official Catholic view of the relationship between scripture and Magisterium, or tradition.

“Sola scriptura” is a term I’ve heard only from Catholics whose knowledge of scripture is weak; to them it’s pejorative toward those who use scripture as a basis for belief. Yet it’s what Jesus himself did when confronting his greatest adversary in the wilderness after his baptism. “It is written …”


#20

Isn’t it funny how those who often know nothing about Catholicism–true Catholicism at least–just love to tell us what we believe? :slight_smile:


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