McBrien absolutely RIPS the TLM

.My diocese continues to insist that Richard McBrien is a deity and continues to give him Centerpiece to the Opinion section of the Diocesan Rag. He is heralded as one of the greatest theologians of the modern church. :bigyikes:

In his latest installment, McBrien viciously lashes out at the Old Mass. In a nutshell his argument that TLM was bad for the congregation and exclusive to worshipers being the priests and Altar boys and Observers those being in the pews.

I plan to express my opinion to the paper regarding Mcbrein’s comments on TLM.

Any posters out there who want to catalog the “fruits” of the Novus Ordo Mass vs. TLM?

Thank you in advance. P.S. PM me with any suggestions

Why would anyone listen to this guy?

Whenever a TLM is said a Liturgist loses his wings.:smiley:


What I have long wondered is, if the TLM was somehow wrong, then what does that say about the Church? What does that say about Trent? Was Trent not guided by the Holy Spirit as much as Vatican II was? Was the Church not guided in her liturgy for the thousand years before 1962, but only in the few decades after?

Yet another reason to support the TLM. If McBrien is agin it, then I am fer it.:thumbsup:

Well, why would anyone be surprised at this coming from him?

A lot of made of the fact that there were five Protestant Observrrs at Vatican II who adversely affected the outcome. While true they had some influence the real problem came not from them but from the roughly 280 or so theologians who were there, the vast majority of them modernists and liberal thinkers who prepared the drafts that the Bishops debated and voted upon. The Bishops brought these men as their advisors and assistants for lack of a better word. Their ideas for the future of the Church and reccomendations to the Bishops, both carried great weight and heavily influenced the outcome of the Council. Men like Kung , Schillebeecks and many others were also of the mindset that reform was needed and had to be accomplished at any and all costs. The faith must be freed. McBrien falls squarely into that class of theologian.

The major problem that men like these and McBrien have or had is that the changes did not go far enough to suit them. Trust me McBrien is far from alone in his theological views.

McBrien also believes that the Pope needs to reverse the doctrine of Papal infallibility among other things.

Do you have a copy of the article he wrote? I’d be interested in reading that.

A question for the OP: Is the link below one to the article you are talking aobut?

If there was a ‘quote of the year’ contest for this forum, this one should wins, hands down!!


The usual liberal drivel about the Old Rite.

Does anyone really care what he has to say?

[right]JMJ + OBT[/right]

I’ve been to plenty of Novus Ordo Masses in my short thirty years where it was obvious that many members of the congregation were no more fully spiritually participating in the liturgy than they might have been at a Traditional Latin Mass, even while they absent-mindedly drolled out the various responses in English or Spanish.

Here is a free video of a TLM which displays the great potential for the congregation to fully participate with their hearts, mouths, and bodies in the context of the traditional Roman Rite. Nobody can seriously watch this video and say the the congregation is qualitatively less involved than at a Mass of the modern Rite in the average American parish (i.e. excluding consideration of extraordinary ministers, which have become so unfortunately ordinary) – how enthusiastically and with what love do the lay congregants sing those parts of the Ordinary which are rooted in their hearts, and in a “dead” language no less!.

Tridentine Missa Cantata (Sung Latin Mass) for the Last Sunday after Pentecost

If you don’t speak French you may want to skip the homily, which is about 11 minutes long. Please share this video with friends and family and fellow Catholics who aren’t sure what the Traditional Latin Mass is all about! :thumbsup: I hope one day soon that such a beautiful, traditional liturgy can be celebrated in my home parish and many, many parishes througout the world.

In the Hearts of Jesus and Mary.


This links to a book at Amazon, unless I’m missing something.

You’re right; but I fixed it. Maybe you could remove your post, and then I’ll remove this one, so as not to confuse anyone.

I wouldn’t believe anything McBrien said, right down to his name, unless he produced his birth certificate to prove that. Even then, I would check with the Bureau of Vital Statistics to see if the information matched and ask him for an inked footprint to compare.

I wonder why you feel the need to put the two rites in opposition? Why not simply talk about why you prefer the TLM?

I don’t know anyone who pays any attention to McBrien anyway.

Well, the editor of our Diocesan paper, for one, or she would not print McBrien articles in it. Then there’s the bishop who would not allow McBrien articles in the diocesan paper if he did not pay attention to McBrien. Evidently both believe people will pay attention to those articles, or they would not print them. Sad, very sad. I have often said our diocesan paper is the only anti-Catholic publication printed in the diocese. One should never underestimate the damage people like McBrien can do.

Apparently the editor of their Diocese newspaper.
I’m not sure about anyone else.

I think I finally understand the observation of more reverence at the TLM Mass. Its like the statistic that only 2 percent of couples using NFP get divorced. It is composed of a self selected group who have a deeper respect for the Church, its teachings, and practices, whereas most NO Masses include some of the select group, but many more unwashed who either don’t have a clue or just don’t give a rip about such things nor would they appreciate a concert of Classical music.

I’m speechless. I’m watching this right now, having never actually seen a TLM before. Why would anyone in their right mind work so hard to get this abolished? I feel like I’ve been robbed of my liturgical heritage.
:nope: :frowning: :mad:

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