Rinnie–This took place close to where I live, and I’ve been following the case through a long string of local news stories. With all due respect, your post is so out of touch with the facts of the case that I don’t even know where to begin to correct it.:doh2:
What’s up with the “…renounce gay children…” title in the link, I wonder. That’s a stupidly misleading choice of words. He is not being asked to renounce his son. Sensationalism aside, for performing a same-sex marriage ceremony for his son, he was tried for breaking the Methodist church law which he agreed to when he became a Methodist pastor.
Recently the pro-gay marriage people in the UMC are trying a new tactic, saying that even if the current policy against gay marriage stays in place it is up to the bishops’ discretion whether these kinds of church trials take place. It is their assertion that these church trials are unnecessary and harmful to unity, and that therefore pastors who perform these ceremonies in violation of church discipline should not be penalized.
I guess that’s what happens when you don’t have a strong magisterium and an official head. Methodist, like most Protestant denominations generally have a collegial approach when deciding about doctrinal issues. This issue will eventually come down to a vote. This is what happened in the Church of England, I think they’re called episcopal in the US and Anglican in th UK. There are some who are fighting an extended battle against accepting hpmosexuals in full communion, but I’ve visited England several times and homosexual clergy and blessings of gay unions is very main stream there. Wikipedia actually has a good explanation of the process.
A human preacher can have authority over another preacher because in being ordained a minister in the United Methodist Church, ministers have committed themselves to following the rules of the UMC, which are found in the Book of Discipline.
At this point, Scripture has nothing to do with it. If the minister wants to define Scripture anyway he likes, he can do so outside of the UMC. However, if he wants to remain a minister of the UMC, he has to submit to the Discipline of the UMC.
It’s not hard to understand. The UMC has standards, and it has courts to try cases where those standards have been breached.
They can’t, because it is not in the Bible. Therefore, they have to resort to methods of “higher criticism” of the Bible, such as the historical critical method, which allows them to claim that the Bible isn’t proclaiming a universal truth, but rather is simply a reflection of the acceptable social norms of ancient Jewish/Greek society.
Is there an official document that says they are? I always thought that they weren’t, and I don’t mean this as a harsh remark, I just never thought the Methodist church thought of themselves as believing sola scriptura.
Right. Rinnie, this is what the case is about. Frank Schaefer went against a rule which he had at least implicitly promised to abide by. The UMC upheld the rule in the trial that UMC ministers may not perform same sex marriages.
If I were a Catholic, I’d be glad that the UMC has stood their ground on this and I’d be praying for the UMC as well as the parties involved for strength, wisdom, healing, and God’s guidance. I would not be using the story to try to undermine another church.
That’s a good suggestion for you, Rinnie.
Hi I’m in Berks County. For some reason I was guessing you were in western PA, not the eastern end. Looks like we’ll be getting s#%w next week.