WhIch would a Mormon find it easier to convert to mormonism;
A Protestant or a Catholic? :shrug:
Keep this in mind;
1 - Protestants don’t believe in Earth authority but Catholics do.
2 - A mormon would have to at first convince a protestant that there was a Earthly convenant made.
3 - The Mormon would have to convince a Catholic that the “great apastacy” actually happened and that this is why Joseph Smith’s church is the one true chruch but the catholic church is not.
It’s an interesting thought that I’ve been thinking of lately. What do you think?
It would depend on which one (Catholic or Protestant) knew their Faith more.
Not only a strong Faith is need (defense)-but ***knowing what you believe ***is paramount!
I have met many a Catholic (online & in person) who do not know their Faith-and hold strongly to their “opinions” of what it means.
I have met (mainly in person-but online also) some Protestants who do not know theirs.
The easiest would be the poorly catechized Catholic or Protestant.
I believe I did read a stat that Catholics make up the largest converts to the Mormon Church. I am sorry that I do not have a reference for this nor am I sure that it is true. However if it is true this doesn’t necessarily tell me anything other than 1)Catholics make up the largest part of Christianity so there are more to convert and 2) there are numerous poorly catechized Catholics out there.
To characterize the evangelistic efforts of Mormons as “preying” upon people seems disrespectful. They believe they are bringing life to the lost, and they do a much better job of getting their message out on the street than most Catholics, as you yourself have observed in other posts. Why do you post these inflammatory threads?
Most Protestants DO believe in authority on earth. They just don’t consider it infallible. Protestants all embrace Covenant, though it is called “testament”. Not just in the way of scripture, but in a new way of relationship with God in Christ.
I do agree about the apostasy thing, and most fundamentalists and many evangelicals do agree that the Catholic Church went “off the rails” at some point.
IME Mormons don’t “prey” on anyone. Every time I have been approached by missionaries, which happens a lot as I live in a majority Mormon town, as soon as I tell them that I am a happily practicing Catholic, they say something like, “Well, you have a wonderful day!” and leave.
When a leading apostle, David W. Patten, raised insulting questions, Smith slapped him in the face and kicked him into the yard. After a warrant was issued for Smith’s arrest on the charge of bank fraud, Smith and Rigdon fled Kirtland for Missouri on the night of January 12, 1838.
What do you think about this?
"Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness."
Those who become “sons of perdition” does not mean they fought or fight the Mormon Church. It means they deny Christ after they have had a perfect knowledge that He lives. This means they have denied the Holy Ghost and the pure knowledge given by revelation, and they fight against Christ in open rebellion. It means they have rejected Him and His saving grace after having a complete understanding about Him. It is like denying the light when the light is shining right in front of one’s face. It is not about a church, at all.
Thanks very much for your comment early on here.
Correction there: “perdition,” or the “outer darkness” or 'hell…" is harder to get into than that. It’s not a matter of leaving the church and opposing it. After all, if those who leave the church and oppose it honestly believe the (*# they say about it, they aren’t actually opposing US, but a strawman version of us. How can one be condemned for opposing untruths? I mean, since we don’t believe in 90% of the stuff the antis claim we do, then we’d all be going to hell too, wouldn’t we?
No; one must knowingly sin against the Holy Ghost; to me that means one must, in an absolute and certain knowledge of the truth, deliberately choose the lie, knowing it is a lie.
People who leave the church and oppose it—perhaps one or two qualify here, but I wouldn’t know who they were.
Yes we do, and yes he did. There is more, we believe, to the plan of salvation than simply going to a better place than this earth life is.
mormons will go for anyone they can get in front of. they really don’t think in terms of specific profiles (they tend to be very unaware of other religions apologetics) and try to make a connection and get an “emotional conversion”. retention is attempted through keeping the person busy, appeal to ego (priesthood advancement, callings and most importantly the whole eternal progression concept) fear (do you want to have your family taken away and given to someone else?) and once again “emotional conversion” (love bombing, testimonies)
they desperately need new members…especially ones who will be active and contributing ( i mean time and talent mostly…although every church needs money to pay the bills)
this church really does seem to be on the decline and with such ready to access to information combined with a lessening appeal for what is still a very white american religion i think it becoming an anomaly like the amish
In other words, we don’t publish anti-whatever pamphlets that attack another religion, and we don’t use scare tactics to show how horrific the other person’s belief is so that they will be disgusted with his own faith before he looks for ours…and we don’t keep our own beliefs back until after we have completely attacked theirs. yep, I guess that’s a fault.
Well, there is a higher percentage of active LDS than there is of any other US religion. I suppose you could call that ‘declining’ if you want to, but I wouldn’t.
Absolutely not! That is why I would not assume they are “preying” on Catholics or Protestants,either. I have personal experience with a number of Mormons who I believe to be very fervent in their convictions.
I did not mean to imply that I agreed with what they said.
That may be the reason they are sent out, but they are told that they must bring in the lost sheep. I think most of them do it with sincerity.
I have not really studied much about him. Frankly,he seems a little off his nut to me. Maybe he believed that. Maybe he had delusions of grandeur. Do you think he believed he was “preying” on people?
I think Jesus was talking about people who said they believed, but did not act in accordance with what they professed to believe. I think most Mormons are different because they are acting in accordance with what they believe. Certainly people from any sect may be hypocrites, but I think they are out door to door because they believe it is right for them to do.
Thanks once again for your kindness here. (Joseph Smith did have a lot of self confidence, and a lot of trust in people around him, but he was in his right mind–but perhaps you were kidding with the one comment.)
Claire from DE,
Thank you also for your kind comment.
I think whoever will listen to them. Mormons are very good people, just misled. But I think they could confuse any religion if that person is not informed about their faith. I think personally they would have a better chance of converting someone who is going through a very rough time in their life any faith. If that person does not really study their own Religion.
While I disagree with the Mormons alot I know that in their heart they are just doing the best they can, and know how to do. I find it is better to try to show them where we disagree, and the more they question their faith, they can come to the truth. I personally just pray for them.
Interesting post, and one that describes the differences in approaches better than I ever have. Mormons go out and teach what they believe to be true to everyone, regardless of what their beliefs are. You describe an approach that depends upon, first, destroying the other faith before you will teach yours. The problem with the first approach, of course, is that those who are fully informed about their own faiths, and who are faithful IN them, will be able to compare/contrast what we tell them with what they believe to be true, and come to their own decisions. If they are NOT well versed in their own faiths, then all they have to go on is what we believe—and what their own personal opinions are.
The problem with the second approach (well, probLEMS, actually) is that in order to go after the beliefs of a different faith in order to disprove or destroy it, one must be well versed in THAT faith–all those other faiths. Not ‘well versed’ as in “I read what my pastor’s brother’s website said,” but well versed in what the believers actually do believe. Individually. You cannot afford to be incorrect about the slightest thing, because once you are, you have so completely erroded your own credibility that your listener will stop hearing you.
Here is an example of what actually happens to me, far more often than it should: I am told that I am going to hell, or worship a ‘different Christ,’ or am not Christian, or (you name it…) because I don’t believe that Mary was a virgin at Christ’s birth, that I believe that God had sex with Mary.
Well, here’s the thing; since I do happen to believe that Mary was virgin at Christ’s birth, I can then throw out every thing else that person is claiming about my faith. I mean, if they can be wrong about something like that, can they be right about anything important?
And since most people who try this approach don’t ever, actually, tell me what I should believe INSTEAD of Mormonism, I am left with absolutely no choice here. They have nothing for me.
The odd thing is that when I correct them, and tell them that Mormons do TO believe in the virginity of Mary, I will, 99.99% of the time, get a "you do NOT’ and start quoting stuff from some anti-book or site or whatever. I have never, not even once, gotten a “Oh? I’m wrong about that? That’s wonderful! Let’s go on and talk about this, then…”
I think you can understand that such an approach ticks off more people than it converts.
i would consider the pearl of great price and even the book of mormon pretty strong “anti-whatever” publications that condemn all non-mormon religions. and as far as “scare tactics” go ? please have you watched your missionaries? be a mormon or lose your family forever…be a mormon or never get to heaven. missionary discussions START with the great apostasy …which attempts to invalidate all other religions at once and THEN starts the joseph smith “restoration” story.
you don’t keep your beliefs back? like the temple? i challenge that assertion!
i think we all know about that…assigned fellowshipping, etc. targeting families for “re-activation”
i think you are looking at bogus statistics then…i have seen the shrinking wards and the shell games that give the appearance of growth…not much conversion going on and very low convert retention even then. primarily birthrate sustained but only a narrow demographic even then…and LOTS of leaving being obscured by how the numbers are run and the refusal to let people “leave” unless they jump through all the right bureaucratic hoops.
I guess I don’t see where you get that. I also think it is impossible to “destroy” other’s beliefs. Not only that, Catholicism is taught continuously everywhere, so I am not sure I understand your thinking that there is a pre-requisite to learn it. It is not a secret!
I think this is a very accurate observation. A lot of Catholics, I would say most, do not know how to have a discussion about their faith.
I guess I don’t see why this is a “problem”. What is wrong with being educated about what others believe? That is why a lot of us are here!
I think it is fine not to know everything, as long as a person is willing to be corrected.
It is very poor form to tell others what they believe.
I get the impression that you very much prefer Mormonism.
That is what I would call a humble response - willing to be corrected.
Yes, sir, I watched them extremely closely for 18 months, back when I actually was one.
We do not say that you will lose your family, YOU do. your weddings all say “until death do you part.” We don’t have to tell you that. We say 'would you like to keep your family forever?" We do not have to mention the wedding vows you took, you know what they are.
We are very clear about what we do in the Temple. We do baptisms for the dead, we do marriages (“sealings”) we spend some time doing some intensely symbolic teaching–and none of the concepts we teach in there are secret from what is taught outside, y’know. What we do NOT discuss is the actual script and the symbolism, and that’s because we promised. We promised because we want to keep that special spirit of Christ we feel when we are there when we go. I wouldn’t discuss it with you even if I hadn’t promised, because when I go in the Temple, I do not want the memory of acrimonious discussions coming with me. You go look at the Temple scripts all you want to; you know I’m telling you the truth about this.
As for the apostacy…of course we talk about that. If there were no apostasy, there would be no need for us. However, we simply say that there was one, and then present what we believe to be true. The listener, who knows his own beliefs, can decide for himself whether the beliefs we present are better than the ones he has. We don’t have to tear him down with some “Maze of Catholicism” or “Inside the Baptists” stupidity.
I fail to see where fellowshipping is a bad thing. Do your priests and pastors ignore everybody every day but Sunday, and every place but from the pulpit? The whole purpose of religion is to help one another.
At least I give you statistics. All you are giving me is claims, backed by nothing. One study, by the Barna Research Group (which is not religious nor affiliated with any religious group,)
According to them, 71% of Mormons attend church weekly, 67% read the bible daily, 95% pray , 62% attend Sunday School (in addition to regular church services) 40% volunteer, 24% donate money, and 26% share their faith with others.
According also to them (same study) 48% of Catholics attend church weekly, 23% read the bible daily, 88% pray , 6% attend Sunday School (in addition to regular church services) 12% volunteer, 13% donate money, and 10% share their faith with others.
Also according to them (again, same study) 50% of Baptists attend church weekly,55% read the bible daily, 92% pray , 30% attend Sunday School (in addition to regular church services) 19% volunteer, 20% donate money, and 10% share their faith with others.
Of all the faiths examined (Adventists, Assembly of God, Baptists (any type) Catholics, Church of Christ (which is the RLDS, isn’t that a hoot?) Episcopalians, Lutherans, Methodists, LDS, “Christian non-denominational,” Pentacostal Foursquare and Presbyterians, the following was found to be true:
Nobody attends church more than the Mormons do. Only the Pentacostals pray more (97% to our 95%), Nobody attends Sunday School more often, nobody volunteers more (the next highest is 30% to our 40%…that’s he Assembly of God folks), Non-demoniational Christians donate more money, as does the Church of Christ (again, this is the RLDS…they are Mormons too…) though oddly enough, five other religions ‘share their faith’ more than we do. Who’da thunk? Lessee…the Assembly of God people do (62% vs. our 26%), the Baptists do (43%), the Church of Christ (there they are again… ), Christian non-denominational, (57%) and those Pentacostals (61%)
I’m actually rather ashamed of us, that we are that far down on the ‘share the faith’ list.
Still, there you go. Please feel free to share any real numbers with us as to your claim that the LDS church is ‘shrinking’ and all that.