Muslim country, arrests Christians for gathering to pray in Private

These people were arrested for gathering to Praise Our Lord.

arabnews.com/saudiarabia/article154864.ece?comments=all#comments

This is so sad. But what can you expect? It happened in Saudi Arabia after all. The only people in Saudi Arabia who have religious freedom are Muslims and even they aren’t free to convert to another religion such as Christianity. :frowning:

“However, a source told Arab News that only the priest and the 12 Filipinos were arrested for allegedly being the organizers and leaders of the group while the others were let go because they could not all be accommodated at the police station.”

:rotfl:

Mass!, Priest!..

Welcome to Saudi Arabia…

Don’t let those religious dialogues propaganda fool you, there will never allow such things in SA, it’s all politics…

Muslims do not have religious freedom or any kind of freedom in Saudi Arabia, it’s a vicious and repressive nightmare state which I don’t think Americans can begin to comprehend since there’s been nothing like it in their history. But if you want to get change this situation then please lobby your government to stop propping up the regime. The Saudi royal family are despised by most of their citizens and virtually the entire Arab world, they wouldn’t last ten minutes were it not for the billions of dollars of economic and military assistance (paid for with your taxes) which has kept this family dictatorship in power for decades.

Sorry? OUR billions of dollars of economic assistance? You mean they have made zero dollars off of oil? :smiley:
If they are so despised, why cant most of their citizens and virtually the entire Arab world deal with them? Plenty of arab/muslim states around to help

Oil which the United States is the biggest buyer.

If they are so despised, why cant most of their citizens and virtually the entire Arab world deal with them? Plenty of arab/muslim states around to help

Because everyone knows the Saudis are backed by the Americans, so attacking the Saudis would be to bring the wrath of the eagle upon you.

That, and the fact that they are so big in OPEC, which is how most Arab states make their money.

Also, they house the location of the Ka`abah, the holiest site in Islam.

And, the Saudi regime’s way of running things is 99% according to Islamic Shari`ah Law, so it’s not like they’re doing anything wrong in terms of Islam.

they must be doing something wrong if , according to Kadaveri, most of the arab world and almost all of their citizens hate them. Not likely the US is in much of a position to do much to help. I suppose the saudis could have used that petrol money to help their own people.So because they dont, its our fault. the locals wont overthrow their govt & thats our fault too, we buy their oil, which lead to the modernization of the country, but thats our fault too. I suppose had we been allowed to use our own natural resources we wouldnt be in this pickle :smiley: sarcasm:D

They’re just following the tradition of Umar ibn al-Khattab and his treaty with non-Muslims.

This is a letter to the servant of God Umar, Commander of the Faithful, from the Christians of such-and-such a city. When you came against us, we asked you for safe-conduct (aman) for ourselves, our descendants, our property, and the people of our community, and we undertook the following obligations toward you:

  • We shall not build, in our cities or in their neighborhood, new monasteries, Churches, convents, or monks’ cells; nor shall we repair, by day or by night, such of them as fall in ruins or are situated in the quarters of the Muslims.
    …]
  • We shall not manifest our religion publicly nor convert anyone to it.
    …]
  • We shall not display our crosses or our books in the roads or markets of the Muslims.

Oilforimmigration.org is very interesting and it caught my eye during the 2008 presidential campaign when alot was happening!

Check out Bat Ye’or and the history of oil for immigration starting with Europe…

oilforimmigration.org

Do anything that threatens the Saudi dictatorship and the Americans will kill you and your family, bomb your cities and destroy your country, depending on how seriously they think the threat is. People in the Middle-east have been terrorised by the US for decades to stop them challenging the US-backed dictatorships in the region which make sure the profits from the oil go to the US and Western Europe rather than to the people of the region. It’s been one long story of repression, invasions, coups, assassinations and massacres directed at civilians, so it’s difficult to do anything. But they’re still trying and God willing will succeed in bringing down the tyrants. Praise be to God much progress has been made in the last 10 years in resisting US imperialism there. The US-backed military juntas have been smashed in Turkey and it now has some independence; Hezbollah have cut the Israelis down to size and protected Lebanon from US-Israel invasion; the Iraqi resistance forced the Americans to withdraw from Iraq without achieving most of their aims; the US-backed Saudi bombing of Yemen is not working in breaking the resistance there and even the US-backed Mubarak dictatorship in Egypt is having problems.

The USA has been blamed for supporting dictatorships…it is supporting free markets, production…the free society we had also was always telling its citizens to be compassionate and help the poor. So can easily find American volunteers in many of these same poor countries working to help the poor with education, sanitation and health, medicine…no strings attached…hard to believe but it is true.

The other side of the coin is that in these various countries throughout the world, either you have a dictatorship anyway, irregardless of the USA, and coupled with it is always the presence of the revolutionary Marxists as what is happening in South America and encroaching its ways up, to where our borders are deliberately being attacked, our sources of generosity to help the poor of this world being quickly used up. Soon America will have no more means to help the poor of this world.

Moslem countries would be very hard to help in part due to religious and gender restrictions and that Islam is such a totalitarian way of life. Muslims make up a great majority of poor people in the world…from a recent statistic the past week or so…probably from Muslim sources if I recall properly…and predictably blaming the West for their poverty and in particular, America.

Israel is a quandry. Israel always has belonged to the Jews. It was given them by God Himself…and their Covenant of the Land is something we Christians respect. Just as the seat of Orthodoxy was overcome by Islam in Turkey by Moslems, just as the Holy Land, most sacred to Jews and Christians, was overtaken by Islam, you have to face what is the aggressor and usurper of the holy places belonging to these people. They still remain Orthodox Christian and Jew.

The Moslems should acknowledge the right to exist by the Israeli people, and to realize as well that Holy Scripture predicted that some day its people would return to the land the Lord chose for them. The Moslems have been in control of the Holy Land many times over the actual age of America. And the only solution is for everyone to accept each other and allow each other the right to exist, but also to acknowledge the history of Israel and its people and their return.

The Jewish people, from my experience, are not poor because they have learned their livelihood from teachings within the Bible, have a very high value on education, and take the best care of their families. We can learn alot from the Jews.

“Muslims do not have religious freedom” in the KSA. Please elaborate.

The KSA regime “wouldn’t last ten minutes were it not for the billions of dollars of economic and military assistance (paid for with your taxes)”. Please substantiate your claim.

Kadervi,

It is stated on American television that it is public opinion we do want to be out of Saudi oil, it will take atleast 10 to 20 years to do that…even if it was attempted 10 years before 9/11. Vast majority of Americans with you that we should not be supporting that regime in Saudi Arabia…or South and Central American dictatorships…but that is all these countries have for a government.

But we also cannot access oil on our own shorelines or work for development – which is atleast 90% there to remove oil from shale. We have the greatest deposit of shale in the world.

We usually hear more complaints overseas from those who oppose our support of Israel…We are very open to Scriptures of some day the Lord drawing the Jews back to their homeland…this coming about in the last days…

If Saudi Arabia was open to religious freedom without persecution the flood gates would open and Christianity would sweep the country, aswell as many other religions.

This however cannot be done, since leaving Islam means death.

Would you mind pointing out where good government exists in the islamic states? They are almost all dictatorships, absolute kingdoms or ‘mock democracies’ (Iran). Only Turkey appears to have a democratic government and now that it has an Islamic one, it will make sure that it won’t lose any future election. The Sunnis hate the Shia (and vice versa) and the non-Arabs hate the Arabs (and vice versa) and they all despise Pakistanis whose many governments has been an international joke for years and who have all lived off US aid as they still do.
Get real, the West (including the residents of Birmingham UK) needs oil or everything stops, the two big producers are Saudi and Iran. What is the west to do? Encourage a ‘pure’ islamic government in Saudi who might cut off our (your) supply.
The US didn’t put the Saudi ‘royal family’ in power (though it can be blamed for the Iranian government). In Saudi it was, as usual, in a then primitive and undeveloped country - the strongest group takes power and then keeps it. We have to deal whoever has the oil our (and your personal) economy perishes.
I believe that it is likely that Iran and Turkey will combine to remove the perceived hegemony of Islamic power from Saudi by attacking it and setting its oilfields on fire permanently at some point - the deal being Turkey will take the western islamic ‘empire’ including North Africa for the Sunnis and Iran the east of it for Shia (get prepared to convert to Shia when you go home to Pakistan - you might look back with nostalgia on Saudi power !)
Take a look at Walid Shoebat on youtube (an ex-muslim terrorist who seems to know what’s going on in the horrible islamic empire)

You’ll find it mostly boils down to emotionalism.

I’ve experienced this mentality before. I once read a book written by a supposedly “moderate” Muslim who first condemned America for bombing Serbia (even though it was partially doing so because of Serbia’s atrocities against Muslims) then a few pages later ranted about how Serbs killed Muslims. He didn’t even bother to mention the America troops who took care of Muslim Bosnians and protected them from radical Serbs. You’ll find some Muslims ranting about how much money America gives to Israel, but they won’t be praising America for the money given to various Palestinian groups for development.

Frankly it’s the kind of “us vs. them” mentality which leads one to, as seen in the post you quoted, refer to groups like Hezbollah in a positive light, and work counterproductive. Unfortunately it doesn’t belong to Islam either - I’ve heard Orthodox praise the Serbs for their attacks against Muslims in Bosnia, and ignore the atrocities committed therein. When I hear people get in this kind of mindset, I simply walk away. What rationale can conquer the flawed emotions of the human heart?

A good question. I’ve also heard some Orthodox, including family members, praise the atrocities committed against the Muslims. Just as I’ve heard Catholics praise the IRA for resisting Protestants.

Kadaveri you are overstating your case. While I happen to agree that at times western invovlement in the middle east has been disastrous and some of the issues ongoing there can be in part traced to that you are creating and feeding into an image of America as the great Satan which is a caricature of the reality. No nation is perfect and I doubt any American here would pretend that all American decisions are perfect but the people of the middle east are not merely puppets and they to have moral responsibilties.

I actually disagree vehemently with the invasion of Iraq but talk of ‘Iraqi’ resistance is misleading as although all the individuals fighting the Americans may be Iraqi remove the Americans and there would likely be a bloody civil war in five minutes flat as many of those groups have massively divergent viewpoints.

You are trying to put an image across of a coherent fight against western imperialism which is at odds with the nationalistic and religious rivalries that have existed in these areas for many many hundreds of years.

America the Great Satan…

Yet the world totally ignores the millions murdered by their own people during communism. This ‘hate America’ was promoted throughout the world with all sorts of propaganda and individuals in the education systems and arts by the KGB, the intelligencia of the former Soviet Union.

The Soviet Union had the most sophisticated and advanced use of disinformation…people read and hear such things over and over again.

When I was growing up, we were always instructed to help the poor, to be compassionate and caring, to serve others, to be always willing to give what you have, that there was so much starving in the world, and to thank God for what we have here.
And my family did not have much, but we always had hearts for the needs of others no matter their race or religion. My dad would visit with our neighbor, who was being monitored by the FBI – an American communist who started the coal miner riots in Pennsylvania many years ago, and my mother babysat their daughter. My father would converse with him to try to understand him, the good intentions he had, as well as try to redirect him.

People growing up in the USSR always heard about the bad things happening in America, nothing good here. Yet people want to come.

The Bosheviks came into contact with the Muslim Brotherhood and its associations during the 1930’s, and I see the same types of self-victimization and justification, the manipulation you hear about happening at times in the Middle East…

It is sad…but people are free to choose what they want to believe.

I shared some things I learned from our secular newspaper that wrote about the origins of the Turk/Serb war.

It was terrible what was done to the Serbs in the 1500’s…people should read about it, and see how the victim becomes like the aggressor…and considering the tit for tat in non-
Christian countries…you live with it for so long…It was the Seljuk Turks whose murders of pilgrims to the Holy Land was part of the reason the Church finally declared the Holy War to regain the Holy Land way back. During the invasion of Serbia, the Turks also attempted to take over Europe and the Catholic Church.

Communism was overcome by the rosary and penance…Our Lady of Fatima asked us to pray for the conversion of Russia. We pray for the conversion of the militant Islamicists. The Holy Father said that the only remedy for terrorism was the rosary and penance.

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