Muslims: What If......?


#1

Muslims say that the Bible used to be God’s word, was corrupted by men, and God had to send forth Mohammed with a new book to restore true worship.

My question:

If the Qur’an were to become corrupted by men, would God send forth yet another messenger and another book?


#2

Hi Chris,

From a Muslim’s perspective it is not possible to corrupt the Qur’an for several reasons.

  1. After 1400 years, the Quran still exists in the original Arabic language.

  2. The Qur’an is memorized by heart by many Muslims world wide. Muslims would be able to reproduce it from memory. I know of one teacher at Zaytuna institute in California who wrote out the Quran completely from beginning to end, completely from his memory.

  3. God promised to protect it.
    We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption) (Quran 15:9)

All of that aside, But what if…

One of the main doctrines in Islam is God’s Justice. It can be classified as Justice through creation and Justice through legislation. By creation I mean all of what He created, the universe and everything in it. By legislation I mean his laws, orders and commandments. Complete Justice belongs to God.

When we look in nature there is nothing out of place, and everything has its measure, course and order set by God. From the orbit of the stars and planets in our solar system to the sustaining of Life on this earth; the natural order in nature is Perfect. This natural order leads us to conclude that divine justice alone balances the scales.

This concept extends to His legislation as well, He sends exemplary messengers to teach us His message, his orders, commands, oughts and ought-nots. If His message becomes corrupted then his Justice demands He sends another messenger with the same message or at least protect the message from being corrupted. Otherwise we are left lost, in a catch-22 situation where we are required to follow God’s commands without knowing what it is.

I hope this answers your question.

peace.


#3

Of course what Muslims say about this is a bunch of lies!


#4

Hi

I think you won’t mind if I mention my views on the above, so that if you understand that then you could revise your view point as stated above if you think appropriate.

We Ahmadi Muslims believe that GodAllahYHWH’s Word was on all the ProphetsMessengers of the world i.e. Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster, Noah, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus etc, etc. It is a matter of history that the Word from GodAllahYHWH’s mouth could not remain secure and protected in the pristine form it was revealed; in the original language and form it was revealed.

Anybody who says that they have got secure and protected Word from the mouth of GodAllahYHWH should bring his arguments, please, if any.

Thanks


#5

Hi

And what our friend thistle; says about this is a bunch of truths?!

[size=]How?,please elaborate.

Thanks

The truth about Jesus, as I know , is that:

  1. JesusYeshuaIssa did not leave the Word of God or anything in writing revealed on him from GodAllahYHWH in the form of stone tablets as was in the case of Moses.
  2. Or anything written by JesusYeshuaIssa himself as a biography when he left from Galilee, after the incident of Crucifixion, alongwith his mother Mary in search of the lost ten tribes of the house of Israel, he died natural and peaceful death in Kashmir, India.
  3. Jesus left nothing behind authenticated by him, in possession of the Church, as there was none in existence( not erected yet).
  4. We do respect the NTGospels which have account of Jesus life, but it does not have much utility for a non-Catholic except that we may treat it as a book of history subject to scrutiny, internal as well as external, for each bit of event for finding truth in it on merit.[/size]

#6

Hi

A good answer.

Thanks


#7

Jesus did not leave the word behind? He IS the word and he is here among us NOW, not on paper or stone, but Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity, in tabernacles all over the world. The faithful may partake of Truth every day if they see fit.


#8

Muslims like to claim that their Quran is perfectly preserved. However, the history of its compilation reveals otherwise. The Quran was actually compiled by a junior scribe Zayd ibn Thabit under the auspices of his master Caliph Uthman. The Quran we know today is known as the Uthamic Recension.

This link shows the textual variants of the Quran and the evidence that it is not perfectly preserved - including authentic hadiths about missing verses.

answering-islam.org/Quran/Text/


#9

Wasn’t there a series of passages that Mohammed deleted when he suspected that satan had been the source? The satanic verses?

BTW, God made the promise in the book of Isaiah that he would preserve His word. Doesn’t the Muslim faith more or less imply that God failed at this so that the Qur’an needed to be revealed?


#10

Now why in heaven’s name would a ‘God’ protect the Koran and not the Torah and the Gospels?


#11

Hi

Through Quran all meaningful truth in all the Revealed Books of the world have been protected and saved; and that is why it is the final Revealed Book:

The Holy Quran : Chapter 5: Al-Ma’idah

5:47] And We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow in their footsteps, fulfilling that which was revealed before him in the Torah; and We gave him the Gospel which contained guidance and light, fulfilling that which was revealed before him in the Torah; and a guidance and an admonition for the God-fearing.
[5:48] And let the people of the Gospel judge according to what Allah has revealed therein, and whoso judges not by what Allah has revealed, these it is who are the transgressors.
[5:49] And We have revealed unto thee the Book comprising the truth and fulfilling that which was revealed before it in the Book, and as a guardian over it. Judge, therefore, between them by what Allah has revealed, and follow not their evil desires, turning away from the truth which has come to thee. For each of you We prescribed a clear spiritual Law and a manifest way in secular matters. And if Allah had enforced His will, He would have made you all one people, but He wishes to try you by that which He has given you. Vie then with one another in doing good works. To Allah shall you all return; then He will inform you of that wherein you differed;
Unquote

No other RevealdBook has claimed this nor there is any reason given in any other Revealed Book, to my knowledge.

Thanks


#12

The problem is that the Koran as given was not the only one available many centuries ago.

One of the Caliphs ordered alternate versions to be destroyed. So Moslems just assume they’ve got the right one.


#13

tell me how do you explain about Islam speaks about Trinity consist by Father, Jesus and Mary??


#14

That’s dealt with on another thread.

forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=177952&page=3


#15

Hi AgnosTheist,

Because the Koran is the last of the divine scriptures and the prophet muhammad (sa) is the final prophet and messenger.

It took the efforts of 124,000 prophets, one prophet after another in succession until it finally culminated in the prophethood of Muhammad(sa) and the revelation in the Quran.


#16

That does not make any sense. If the koran is the last then its all the more reason to protect the first two. Else its not fair to all the people that have been misled.


#17

Here is a question. If the Torah had been protected, whey bother sending the Gospel, maybe some will say the Torah is not complete and the Gospel is the fulfillment of the Torah. The problem with that is that you have two separate laws when there is only 1 God.

For instance, I’m no expert but I believe the Torah forbids people from eating flesh of the swine. But the Gospels allow it.
Two conflicting laws on the same subject can not exist at the same time, it is either yes you can eat flesh of the swine or no you can not eat the flesh of the swine. If the answer is affirmative and the Gospels replace the Torah as the divine source of guidance then the Torah becomes obsolete, there would be no sense in following it since the true guidance is contained in the Gospel.

On the other hand if the divine law remains the same i.e. you are still not allowed to eat flesh of the swine then the Gospel must have been corrupted, either textually or its interpretation.

I’m not specifically talking about the law on eating pork as an isolated case but rather on a general level I’m sure there are many laws in the Torah which are not upheld in the Gospel and vice versa. Both of those contradictory commands can not be correct to follow at the same time. It is either one or the other.

As Muslims we accept the Torah and Gospel were revealed by God to their people, but over time the message has been altered and the torch of prophethood has been passed down. and that this generation including all Muslims and non-Muslims of all faiths are considered the generation of Muhammad (sa)


#18

If there is really a God, and if all 3 (torah, gospels, and koran) really did come from him then there wont be any contradictions between them in the first place.

that only proves that one or both are completely fabricated. the koran as well was fabricated. and these man-made religions are making you people hate each other for no valid reason.

the idea that god preserved one and not the other is just silly and a made-up excuse.


#19

Well, lets think about it logically. Whether you are an atheist or a Theist, you have to agree that the universe and all of its components, planets, gravity, gases, sun, stars all work together perfectly.

The theists attribute this perfection to a Creator that made them that way. The Athiest says its caused by nature or natural selection, that millions of big bangs happened and this one we are in happened to work. Never the less they both agree the universe is perfect.

Now if you believe in God then it only makes sense to believe He will be perfect in his Legislation because our senses and intelligence tell us He is perfect in his creation. This is the creationists expectation of God. Do you agree this is a fair assertion?


#20

I am all for logic. There should be a good balance between faith and reason.

I believe in the Divine, I just dont believe in religion for logical reasons: they are all unoriginal, erroneous, divisive, hateful, morally inconsistent, & completely baseless in their fantastic claims. little good comes out of it. its not worth it.

For some reason God left us on our own and doesnt care what you believe. She does not need us, nor does she care if we worship her or not. God merely observes her creation.


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