Not to mention it can also get your thread closed! :o
I think that endometriosis surgery can be done in a more rigorous manner and thus be more successful. (NaPro doctors may be more skilled at this due to the greater frequency with which they perform the surgery.) If fully successful, it would likely be much longer before a repeat of the surgery is needed.
Only a handful of doctors in the US know how to perform surgery for endometriosis that actually gets all of the tissue, thus, unless you happen to be blessed enough to live close to one of these doctors, expect to have to travel, probably cross country. Then, expect to have to pay for the doctor’s visits, pre-surgery blood work etc. and the surgery itself. Most insurances are reluctant to cover doctor’s visits and surgeries that are performed in another state, especially when, in their view, the “same” surgery can be performed by the local OB/GYN. If this is something you can afford, consider yourself very blessed. For a lot of us, this simply is not an option. I’m beginning to think that when a lot of posters tell others to “go see a Napro doctor” to treat endometriosis they have little idea of what that actually entails.
Has your friend looked into natural ways to treat it? Yes, it may mean some major changes to how she eats and approaches life, but from my understanding, making these changes really does help.
If money is an issue, I can forget that option for sure. I know you have to pay for quality treatment, but it’s sad that you have to settle for less than ideal just because you can’t fork over thousands of dollars. Healthcare these days…:rolleyes:
This is a great thread…I am 40 and have endometriosis…I had a very large cyst removed with ablation from other organs, 10 years ago, I was unmarried at the time…
I was told by a very experienced OB/GYN, that to help prevent more growth, the best possible treatment is the pill…I did go off it to conceive, when I was married, and conceived very quickly when I went off it ( I was on it for years and years)…I was reading into the NAPro, and it is good to learn about the info, but unfortunately I still agree esp if you are young, that being on the pill is the best preventive measure to stop the regrowth, infertility, and possibility of future ablation/cyst surgery…I know you can try eating better etc, but with endometriosis, not enough is known…And as far as I know, the use of the ABC pill really does control the growth…
Also, as far as abstinence, when married, I have no idea what is right??? Ive been reading conflicting info…But, because the Pill can have an abortive property which I dont agree with ( most drs think is rare though) , you can use barrier methods or other means, to avoid that issue.(in case you do accidentally ovulate)…Since you are on it for medical reasons…
I just want to address the last two points you made.
First, you may not use a barrier method for the sake of avoiding conception. The teaching of the Church is that you may participate in medical treatments that treat a medical problem so long as infertility is an unintended side-effect. So while using the pill for a medical issue such as enodmetriosis can be permissible, using a condom to avoid conception is not.
Second, I get a little frustrated when people speak about the “abortive quality” of the pill. What we are talking about is a hormone which may be linked to an increased risk of miscarriage. We don’t talk about caffeine as having an “abortive quality” despite the fact that it is linked with an increased risk of miscarriage as well, in fact, I believe the evidence for a link between caffeine and miscarriage is greater than between the pill and miscarriage. Now, while you would still discourage pregnant women from drinking excessive amounts of coffee nobody would ever claim that such a person was risking aborting their child. So why do people claim that those on the pill for medical reasons who do not desire a miscarriage are risking aborting their child? They are not. They are weighing the pros and cons of the situation, the possibility of a slight increase in the risk for miscarriage vs the harm complete abstinence would have on their marital relationship. Abortion dosn’t even come into the picture at all, it is not an abortion unless it is desired and sought after, so an unwanted miscarriage can not in any way be called abortive.
Edit Also, I’m sorry if my post comes across as harsh… I did not intend that but was just being terse. I am sorry to hear of your (and others) struggle with endometriosis, and I hope you are able to find a solution which works well for you. God Bless
No worries at all! To the above…But that is my confusion…If someone is on birth control pill for endometriosis, and married, and many are saying its ok NOT to abstain, then how is that ok, since there is a very rare chance that the sperm could meet the egg , if you happen to ovulate, then there is a chance it would not embed in the lining, and would be expelled…In my eyes thats an abortion, to me anyway…I could never live with that…Not a big fan of the pill since I read that 2 years go…Its the 4th way it prevents pregnancy…My Dr did explain it would be rare…SO, if you are allowed to take the pill, because of the medical condition, dont you want to avoid its abortifacent effect???..I read on another catholic site that some use withdrawal because of the fear of the pill (while they are on it for medical reasons only)…
Hey, btw, never knew that about caffeine! and please read my other post to you above too…I see what you are saying…Thanks for the prayers, it is a tough call…and tough decisions…Especially for a younger woman…
The I’m making is that it is not an abortion unless it was intended, if it was unintended it was a miscarriage. You’ve become used to calling it an abortion because of all the hype many Catholics give to the “abortive effects” of the pill. The fact remains, however, that as people speak normally (doctors speak differently) if your unborn child dies because you purposefully did something that you intended to end their life that is an abortion, however, if your unborn child dies, even as a result of something you personally did without you intending for the child to die it is not an abortion, but rather a miscarriage. Now, if that is how these words are used then it is clearly incorrect to say that the unintended loss of a child because of taking the pill is an abortion. Honestly the way we distinguish between whether something is an abortion or a miscarriage relies solely on the intent of the person acting. So, while the pill may be used as an abortificient by those who desire the death of any children conceived it cannot be called so by those who have no desire for this to occur. Does that make things any clearer?
Yes! Definitely makes it clearer, So in the eyes of the catholic church it is better then in this situation, if you have to be on the pill or choose so as the best medical advice, you can still have relations, and no need to worry about the abortifacinet effect?..I guess for me that is hard to think about because in my eyes, if I knew there was a possibility of life, if I did ovulate, and there was a chance we didnt have a child because THE PILL made it hard for the zygote to attach…That would be heart breaking and something Im not sure I could accept…Either way it seems like its going against gods will…I guess in my eyes, preventing the abortifacent effect by using a barrier or withdrwal seems more logical…But I know, its hard to understand the Catholic rules and try to follow
Well, yes and no. You wouldn’t have to worry about an “abortificient effect” but you would have to take the possibility of an increased risk of miscarriage into account when deciding which course of action is the best for you in your particular situation, just as you must with pretty much everything in life. In the particular example at hand the only moral options are either complete abstinence or engaging in relations while accepting that there may be a slight increase in the risk of miscarriage. Now, since many people find that their marriages suffer greatly when they abstain for long periods of time these people have to weigh the negative effect on their marriage vs the possible small increase in the chance of a miscarriage. For some people the risk of an increase in miscarriage will win and they will have to abstain, for others the importance of relations for their marriage will be a stronger reason and so they will accept the risk as an unwanted but necessary side effect of the medical treatment. The Catholic Church views the health of the marital relationship as extremely important, and it places very high value on the importance of marital relations within that relationship. It is not infrequently that the importance of continued marital relations will take precedence over the possibility that there may be a small increase in the risk of miscarriage. But that doesn’t mean that it is automatically the right thing for everybody. Its a matter that falls to prudential judgement for the individual couple in their particular circumstances that should rest on objective scientific studies ( as opposed to emotional appeals and scare tactics that use small amounts of scientific truth and then twist them to sway people to their way of thinking) as the real extent of the risk as well as particular knowledge of the individual couple in question and how abstinence would effect their relationship.
Thank you for your time !
Actually, the precise nature of NaPro surgery involves minimal risk of re-growth. It also involves special techniques to minimize scarring (typical endo surgery carries a high risk of pelvic adhesions, which can very much interfere with fertility.) I had this done myself last year (I’m in my early 30’s) and, when combined with bioidentical progesterone therapy, it has greatly improved my cycles. In January of 2013 I was curling up in a ball, wishing someone would just cut me open and make it go away. Now, in 2014 I can ignore what little pain I have. After 16 years of pain, this is revolutionary!
The Pill may slow regrowth, but it has the potential to interfere with fertility on its own, even without endo. Plus, it increases your risk of breast cancer, especially if you take it before your first full term pregnancy (according to a Mayo Clinic study:sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/10/061030143351.htm)–not–not) good if you are young, especially if you haven’t been pregnant yet.
In short, for me, NaPro surgery and bioidentical hormone support is much better than that infernal pill. I don’t judge people for taking it, I certainly get being in a place where you’ll take just about anything to make the pain go away. But I can’t believe its the best thing out there. Not after what I have experienced the past year.
I know Raymond Peat suggests using high doses of natural progesterone cream all cycle long for endometriosis. He also does not believe in the use of the pill. Some women have also had success with herbs and switching to an organic diet. Of course, it’s not always so simple, but I know Marilyn Shannon has written on these topics, and her work is great.