Need advice for responding to an anti-Catholic


#1

First off I would just like to say hi to everyone, I’ve been reading this board for some time now, and thought that it would be good to finally introduce myself and again say hello. My wife and I this past Easter Vigil were fully initiated and confirmed into the Catholic Church. It was a long two-year journey for us, from the Lutheran church, but we are so happy that we are finally home. Thank you so much to Jim Blackburn for your wonderful advice.

Anyways, I have been emailing back and forth recently with an old friend and he has thrown some really hateful accusations at the Catholic Church and I am not really sure how to respond to him. Any advice you can offer would be most appreciated.

Thanks and God bless,

Tony

Here’s part of his recent email:

If you or I had been born when Mr. Neitczche was, it would have been a more appropriate and acceptable response to the end of the tyrannical attempt of the Catholic Church to incorporate torture such as live boilings, burning “heretics” at the stake, censorship out of control and of all things for freakin’ Napolean Bonaparte’
to have brought the whole thing darn near down !!!
That is why the Pope was driven out of Italy and all other countries and given his (their) own little place (the Vatican City) to sit and stew about who to feed their line of BS to now.
And, after the Inquisitions all flew south, and the Jewish Kid being kidnapped and “baptized”; it was money that changed minds very quickly. For the Vatican had been solely funded for many generations by the Rothschilds (Jewish).
To top it all off, your response to the question of Roman Catholic Preists RAPING
little boys, was that the percentage of Catholic RAPEing of little boys, was directly in line with a societal percentage, IS BS !!! God does not look at it that way. Only Catholics. There is no analogy that I can use to illustrate how ridiculous that is.
It took until 1968 for the R.C. 's to abolish the hundred year plus old “list of approved publishings”.

That is why I asked why you chose Roman Catholicism, Tony. What other choices did you look into ?


#2

Simply ask him for reliable, solid documentation for any and all of his accusations. He doesn’t have any, of course. All he has is some anti-Catholic book(s). Tell him such sources are not documentation since mere accusations are not proof of anything. It like demanding he answer “how many times a day do you beat your wife?” as if it were a fact he has to disprove. Hardly a fair nor productive way to find out the truth about anything, is it?


#3

The heretics were killed by the state not the Church. The Church did have tribunals to sent up courts for the accused. If found guilty the state executed them.

And, after the Inquisitions all flew south, and the Jewish Kid being kidnapped and “baptized”; it was money that changed minds very quickly. For the Vatican had been solely funded for many generations by the Rothschilds (Jewish).
To top it all off, your response to the question of Roman Catholic Preists RAPING
little boys, was that the percentage of Catholic RAPEing of little boys, was directly in line with a societal percentage, IS BS !!! God does not look at it that way. Only Catholics. There is no analogy that I can use to illustrate how ridiculous that is.
It took until 1968 for the R.C. 's to abolish the hundred year plus old “list of approved publishings”.

The Catholic Church abolished books that were mistranslation of the Bible. Also cite your sources.

What source can your friend cite to prove any historical evidence to prove you case. Second, the sex scandal is a social issue. Your friend apparently does not want to acknowledge the sex scandal by teachers on minor students, or that preacher who had sexual favors with a homosexual hooker.

That is why I asked why you chose Roman Catholicism, Tony. What other choices did you look into ?

The Holy Spirit guided his heart to return to the Truth Church of Jesus Christ.


#4

You can point out that priestly pedophilia is not exclusive to the Catholic Church by showing him the information here: www.reformation.com


#5

868 Protestant ministers pedophile… :eek:


#6

There is not much you can do with this. If you trawl through two thousand years of the history of an entire continent you will always find some incident you can kick up a fuss about.

The real complaint is elsewhere, but there is no evidence where it is. Normally it will be a failed sexual relationship at the root of the trouble, but it might take a long time before that becomes self-evident.


#7

Tony,

Your friend may be sincere but he is poorly educated in Catholic and Protestant histories. See if you can get him to read Henry Kamen’s book The Spanish Inquisition: a Historical Revision. Kamen is an atheist and has no allegiance to the Catholic Church. He and most other modern scholars of reputation will set your friend straight on the Inquisitions. Your friend also needs to understand that the Protestants had their own inquisitions and did everything that he believes the Catholics did.

When a person begins to point a finger at sinners the finger always points inwardly as well as outwardly. Truth in teaching is what is critical. If we put our trust in people we will always be disappointed. The Church has many members…some are good and some are bad. Nevertheless, scripture says many things about the Church. The Church is “the pillar and bulwark of the truth.” The Church is the “body of Christ on earth.” Individual members may be sinners, but the Church was built by Jesus and “the gates of hell will not prevail against her.” If your friend can accept these things from scripture he will do well. You may have many discussions and a long haul ahead of you to make your friend more friendly toward the Catholic church.

Let your friend know and appreciate your love for the Lord, and let him know how much being a Catholic has enhanced your relationship with Jesus. Be cheerful and loving toward your friend. Do not respond to him in the same fashion in which he presented himself in his email. Love, patience, and understanding on your part will go a long way in helping him.


#8

Happened under Pius V - he may be referring to the boiling alive of an atheist - which it is not easy to see Jesus Christ doing

burning “heretics” at the stake,

There were plenty of these, at Rome itself, & elsewhere - see previous answer.

censorship out of control and of all things for freakin’ Napolean Bonaparte’
to have brought the whole thing darn near down !!!

Presumably an allusion to the arrest of Pius VI in 1798 when the French entered Rome. As for censorship - it was a fact, whether one approves of it or not. Not that it was peculiar to the Papacy - though how it originated among Christians, I don’t know; it goes back to at least the 540s, when works of Origen were burned :frowning: There is better case for saying there was too much censorship, than for saying there should be none & should have been none. There is another issue - should anything be allowed to be circulated in print ? It is hard to see why.

That is why the Pope was driven out of Italy and all other countries and given his (their) own little place (the Vatican City) to sit and stew about who to feed their line of BS to now.
And, after the Inquisitions all flew south, and the Jewish Kid being kidnapped and “baptized”

A reference to the Edgar Mortara affair of 1858 - his (Catholic) nurse baptised him, so the Pope had him taken from his (Jewish) parents

it was money that changed minds very quickly. For the Vatican had been solely funded for many generations by the Rothschilds (Jewish).

I have no idea about this - sorry

To top it all off, your response to the question of Roman Catholic Preists RAPING little boys, was that the percentage of Catholic RAPEing of little boys, was directly in line with a societal percentage, IS BS !!! God does not look at it that way. Only Catholics. There is no analogy that I can use to illustrate how ridiculous that is.

It is a very weak answer - I agree with him. The Church makes very high claims, so we cannot complain if we are judged by them. In a way, it is a good thing he is judging us by our own standards - this is evidence that the preaching of Christian ethics has had an effect in society at large. He is absolutely right to be indignant - what happened is indefensible; it is better to admit & confess these abominations, than to try to palliate them, however slightly.

It took until 1968 for the R.C. 's to abolish the hundred year plus old “list of approved publishings”.

That is why I asked why you chose Roman Catholicism, Tony. What other choices did you look into ?


#9

Just ask your friend to come here, to this web-site.:smiley:


#10

A reference to the Edgar Mortara affair of 1858 - his (Catholic) nurse baptised him, so the Pope had him taken from his (Jewish) parents

Here is the writeup of the the Edgar Mortara afair. Search the page for his name to find the section talking about it.
http://www.catholiceducation.org/articles/persecution/pch0022.html


#11

. For the Vatican had been solely funded for many generations by the Rothschilds (Jewish).
Not true. This would imply that the Rothschild’s, the Jewish ones, gave most of the money for running the church. This is not true.

The Rothschild are among many things money lenders and bankers. In past centuries when a European King wanted to get financing for a project he’d go to the Jewish money lenders because that’s we were the money lenders. In more recent times the have run financial institutions. The Catholic church has its money deposited in many banks around the world. I’ve read that one of them is a bank run by the Rothschilds.

By the way, There are quite a few Catholic Rothschild too.

You know I’m getting really confused… I thought it was good to befriend with our Jewish brethren… now it’s bad? I cannot keep up with the constantly changing rules. :doh2:

The best lies are built on kernels of truth which are then morphed into a fabrication.


#12

To top it all off, your response to the question of Roman Catholic Preists RAPING
little boys, was that the percentage of Catholic RAPEing of little boys, was directly in line with a societal percentage, IS BS !!! God does not look at it that way. Only Catholics. There is no analogy that I can use to illustrate how ridiculous that is.

others have addressed this as well. The incident of Catholic priests molesting boy is actually less then in society at large. The incidence of this among the clergy of other Christian denomination is about the same. So that even blow out of the water the contention that the cause of the molestations is that priests are not allowed to marry.

Protestant leaders have handled the situation as badly as Catholics have. The main issue is that the press loves going after the Catholic Church. But that’s not been a bad thing. It gave us all a chance to understand what was going on and for our church to come up with a good policy on how to handle situations like this. Now if only the other denominations would follow suit and fix their policies.


#13

It took until 1968 for the R.C. 's to abolish the hundred year plus old “list of approved publishings”.
Without a valid link to address this my reaction would be … “so what?” Organizations and governments let laws are rules fall by the wayside all the time without appealing them.
Here are a few old laws that are still on the books in the USA. People just ignore them.
· Massachusetts – Blasphemy is punishable by death.
·In New Mexico a man should beat his wife at least once a week to keep her humble and obedient. ( I think this one was finally removed from the books in the last 1970s)
· In Denver it’s illegal to shoot jackrabbits from a moving trolley.
· Massachusetts - Mourners at a wake may not eat more than three sandwiches.
· Massachusetts - Snoring is prohibited unless all bedroom windows are closed and Massachusetts securely locked.
· Massachusetts - An old ordinance declares goatees illegal unless you first pay a special license fee for the privilege of wearing one in public.
·Arizona - it’s illegal to let your donkey sleep in your bathtub. OR to take your house up the second story of hotels. The only thing you can legally shoot from a moving vehicle is a whale (in Arizona? Huh?)
· In Texas, it’s illegal to put graffiti on someone else’s cow
· In Texas, It is illegal for a person to shoot a buffalo from the second story of their hotel.
· In Texas, It is still appropriate punishment to hang a horse or cattle thief.
· In Texas, My favorite: It is illegal to take more than three sips of beer at a time while standing.


#14

I take it that you’re close to this friend. This is going to be a real test of your faith. You’re probably not used to having this distorted nonese thrown at you. I’ve learned to handle in a few ways.

Ask them to provide vaild sources on the accussations. They will probably provide links and material that is from anti-Catholic sources. Disproving a few of the contentions should get your friend to start to realize that he’s been fed a lot to nonsense and lies in the past. Though some people just hold on to it …

Secondly just patienty get the answer and keep responding to each of his remarks. I advise you to keep what you write because this will mostly likely only be the first time you hear this stuff feel a need to respond.


#15

Regarding the Rothschilds charge, the association of Jews and banking has been around for centuries. Tony, if your friend could give a source, any source at all, for this tired, thread-bare charge, please ask him/her for it.


#16

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