No Faith Alone at Judgment Day


#1

“And I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds. And death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.”

And again, in Matthew 16:26 27:

“For what will a man be profited, if he gains the whole world, and forfeits his soul? Or what will a man give in exchange for his soul? For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels; and will then recompense every man according to his deeds.”

And what about Revelation 2:23:

“And I will kill her children with pestilence; and all the churches will know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts; and I will give to each one of you according to your deeds.”

And what amazing information does St. Paul give us in Romans 2:5 11?

“But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who will render to every man according to his deeds: to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life; but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation. There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek, but glory and honor and peace to every man who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. For there is no partiality with God.”


#2

It was passages like these (as well as Matt 7:21 and the parables in Matt 25, and others) that gave me misgivings as a Protestant. It’s why I’m Catholic now.:thumbsup:


#3

Don’t forget about the verse in the bible where a rich man askes Jesus what he must do for his salvation. Jesus didn’t mention, faith.


#4

if you notice everytime protestants try to “proof text” for sola fide, they always quote st. paul and never jesus, this is because jesus did not teach this.


#5

Hello,

Neither did Saint Paul - it is just that he is more easily misinterpreted and taken out of context.


#6

Lazerlike42 explains best, IMO.


#7

In the Old testament, Today’s First Reading says

Jer 17:5-10

I, the LORD, alone probe the mind
and test the heart,
To reward everyone according to his ways,
according to the merit of his deeds.

usccb.org/nab/030807.shtml


#8

The true teaching of the Church is at the same time much more complicated and much more beautiful. It begins with the idea that justification is not only external, but internal as well; Protestants most often disagree. To the Protestant, justification is merely a decision whereby God declares man not guilty in view of the offering of Jesus Christ. Man is still unjust in fact, but God accepts him into Heaven anyways, because of the sacrifice of Christ. Martin Luther explained this idea by use of an analogy. He compared sinful man to a pile of dung. By faith in Christ, the Savior would cover this dung with snow. Beneath the snow, the man was really still dung, but God would look at the man as if he were really snow. This idea is known as imputation of righteousness because it holds that Christ’s righteousness is merely imputed – assigned - to the justified. At last we come to this point, which is really where the entire disagreement lies.

The Catholic Church’s teaching is that righteousness is infused – really put into – the justified. It holds that man is not only forgiven in justification by some assignment of Christ’s righteousness to them, but he is also made righteous inside. It is the difference between covering the dung with snow and actually turning the dung into snow. This teaching can be found in the Council of Trent:

…justification itself… is not only the remission of sins but also the sanctification and renewal of the interior person through the voluntary reception of grace and of the gifts, whereby from unjust the person becomes just, and from enemy a friend, that one may be “an heir in hope of eternal life” (Titus 3:7). (Session 6, Chapter 7)

Immediately, the statement that justification makes men the friends of God jumps out, calling to mind the earlier point that justice is in some way equivalent to knowing God.

Lazerlike42, that is such a beautiful description of justification. I never thought of it that way. I am utterly amazed that the more I learn about Catholic teaching the more I see how full and beautiful it is. Thank you and God Bless you:)


#9

I am wondering if we have all obeyed what Jesus saked the rich man to do? Have we sold all of our goods and then given the money to the poor? If not then according to Jesus we will not have eternal life. :frowning:


#10

Hello,

Jesus does not condemn the ownership of goods here. What is being condemned is disproportionate attachment to goods - to desire the created more than the Creator.


#11

The revelation passage is not talking about God judging our works plural for salvation. The only basis of salvation is faith alone in Christ Jesus. The work of salvation was completed for by Christ on the cross. The very last thing He said on the cross before He died was “it is finished.” This means that the work of salvation HAS BEEN accomplished for us. Now on this basis God is able to offer salvation to us as a free gift. This free gift of salvation is received by faitn in Christ. John 1:12-13
12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood **nor of the will of the flesh **nor of the will of man, **but of God. **NASU

Notice that in verse 12 we recieve Him (Jesus Christ) by believeing in His name. When we do this the believer is born again of God.
According to John 1:13 salvation is not:

  1. Being born into a family of believing parents so that automatically makes us Christian. No, we are not “born of blood.” :frowning:

  2. A natural human desire “the will of the flesh.” Man by nature does not want God.:tsktsk:

  3. Based upon a man made list of good works of any kind, “nor of the will of man.”:ouch:

But on the other hand, salvation is all of God. Salvation is a work of God for man and not a work of man for God. God does it all for us. that is why John tells us in John 1:13 that salvation is **“of God.” **:amen:


#12

Was there then no need of a resurrection?? Taken literally, “it is finished” means that’s it. No more…HMMM…What will I do on Easter Sunday?? :bigyikes:

Since I do believe in Jesus as my Savior, I’m going to cheat on my wife and I think that I’ll rent some porn and whatever non-sense I can come up with to show my point.:wink: Faith without works is an empty faith. DLC, you have no argument with us. Go to the letter of James and debate his second chapter. You read Scripture literally?? "It is finished’??? James don’t think so and neither did Christ or His Church…God Bless :slight_smile:


#13

actually Jesus when saying it is finished was refering to the passover meal being finished as he consumed the fourth and final cup on the cross.

Hopefully someone else can give yo alittle mor info on that because I dont know it all but I do believe that that is what he wa refering to.

Notice that in verse 12 we recieve Him (Jesus Christ) by believeing in His name. When we do this the believer is born again of God.

Jesus recieved me into his body when I was born again:thumbsup:

(1 Cor 12:13) “For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body.” Jesus body. Baptism is how we become members of Jesus body. Not by one act of faith. And what is Jesus body? The Church. Baptism is how we become members of the new covenant.

  1. A natural human desire “the will of the flesh.” Man by nature does not want God.:tsktsk:

This is so wrong. Why do yo think there is so many religions in the world? Even in places that have never heard of Jesus they still search for the truth. Religion is how people have always answered natural disasters, suffering…
By nature we all desire God Because God created our nature and he created us for him.

But on the other hand, salvation is all of God. Salvation is a work of God for man and not a work of man for God. God does it all for us. that is why John tells us in John 1:13 that salvation is **“of God.” **:amen:

Amen brother


#14

These passages about Judgment actually destroy sola fide; Protestants either misrepresent the passages to say what it does not intend to say, or else ignore these passages and never include them in any discussion about salvation (and we know why they are loath to bring them up). See more on the thread regarding salvation (ongoing topic, about 21 pages as of this writing) for more about this, and how much Protestant apologists continually dodge the obvious.


#15

I think that regardless of whether someone believes in faith alone or not… as Christians we have an obligation to provide role models for the rest of society to show the difference that God can make in peoples lives. There has to be a visible difference between Christians and non Christians in order to show God’s love and guidance through our own lives and our works. We must be known by our fruits or we will not be recognised at all.


#16

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