OK, The RCC in first-place for Truth. But which Church is in SECOND place?


#1

Assuming (for the sake of this discussion) that the “Roman” Catholic Church has always had (and always will have) the Fullness of the Faith - 100% truth, 0% error.

But which Christian Faith would you say is in second-place? Which Faith comes closest to the fullness of the Faith but doesn’t quite get there?

I guess I would say the Greek Orthodox. They have a lot going for them - valid Orders, a valid Sacramental theology, an ancient history, an orderly, liturgical style of worship, a respect for Sacred Tradition, and an impressive stable of Saints.

But that’s probably the “obvious answer.” I would be interested to hear other opinions (and the reasons for those opinions).


#2

Satanism!

At least that’s what I heard on another thread :smiley:

Honestly, I’d have to go with the “obvious” answer too. Heck, as far as I’m concerned the Orthodox are basically Catholics who haven’t gotten around to admitting it yet, but then I’m arrogant like that :stuck_out_tongue:


#3

I’m pondering two choices.


Choice 1:

I’d say the Church that is written in my heart.

I may say and do odd things, but my goal is to transform my heart and mind to be conformed to Christ’s. I will never know every detail of theology, but I’m confident that if I can be transformed then I will know the Right Thing to do when I need to.


Choice 2:

My wife.

Alan


#4

The Eastern Orthodox are in very solid second place for Truth in my view, I in many ways consider them our ancient brothers in the faith.

In third place I would say are conservative Protestants who take the scriptures seriously, and whom agree with the Catholic Church in areas of morality and social issues.


#5

[quote=DavidFilmer]Assuming (for the sake of this discussion) that the “Roman” Catholic Church has always had (and always will have) the Fullness of the Faith - 100% truth, 0% error.

But which Christian Faith would you say is in second-place? Which Faith comes closest to the fullness of the Faith but doesn’t quite get there?

I guess I would say the Greek Orthodox. They have a lot going for them - valid Orders, a valid Sacramental theology, an ancient history, an orderly, liturgical style of worship, a respect for Sacred Tradition, and an impressive stable of Saints.

But that’s probably the “obvious answer.” I would be interested to hear other opinions (and the reasons for those opinions).
[/quote]

I agree with your statement about the Greek Orthodox – but there is another candidate.

Judaism! Reason: Twice during the papacy of John-Paul II, the Vatican issued statements to the effect that because God never revokes a covenant – never breaks a promise – Judaism remains a valid conduit to God. I have a reservation or two about that logic – if one carefully studies Old Testament typology, one finds Catholic Christianity heavily foreshadowed in it – in other words, Judaism contains our seed, we Catholics are the matured plant. So, how could Judaism be an appropriate alternative if Christ has already come and gone? I.e., it is time for sprouted seeds, not inert seeds. Perhaps the answer is that God is happy if someone is at least in the inert, unsprouted seed stage.


#6

[quote=DavidFilmer]Assuming (for the sake of this discussion) that the “Roman” Catholic Church has always had (and always will have) the Fullness of the Faith - 100% truth, 0% error.

But which Christian Faith would you say is in second-place? Which Faith comes closest to the fullness of the Faith but doesn’t quite get there?

I guess I would say the Greek Orthodox. They have a lot going for them - valid Orders, a valid Sacramental theology, an ancient history, an orderly, liturgical style of worship, a respect for Sacred Tradition, and an impressive stable of Saints.

But that’s probably the “obvious answer.” I would be interested to hear other opinions (and the reasons for those opinions).
[/quote]

There is only One Church, There is no second place.

The Catholic Church is not just the “Roman” or Western/Latin Church. The Orthodox of which there are 21 different Rites or Traditions are not just the Greek Orthodox either. Many if not most Orthodox are Catholic doctrinally.


#7

I’m convinced Adam and Eve were the first engineers.

They couldn’t leave it alone. They had to break it because they wanted to see how it worked. Once they knew how it worked, they figured they’d try to control it – but instead of improving it they messed it up because it wasn’t as simple as they were prepared to dea with.

Anyway, after Br. Rich’s post, I got an idea that I’m not sure if it’s sinful but here it is. :hmmm:

There are a lot of arguments going on among Protestants, liberal v conservative. These denominations are splitting along the same lines that the Catholic Church “seems to be” splitting as well. (One of my friends told of the trauma his local church went through when the other branches nationally started pushing visible ordained gays, and how his local church resigned from and quit paying tithes to the national organization.)

Here is how it is different between us and them. In Protestants, if they split down the middle, they are divided and can fall. In Catholicism, the Church cannot fall. We are divided, we bicker and all but we are still united in Truth and in the sacraments.

I’m saying we go in and plunder the strong man’s house. His power is weakened. There are people out there that used to band together with each other, and now they are fighting due to liberalism, gay issues among the top ones. These divisions are undoubtedly turning the faith lives of many of their members upside down.

They were told by their leaders that their church was right, and look what their church is doing, calling into question (for those open minded ones especially) really everything that church ever stood for.

Who knows but they may be searching, and they may be so desperate as to look to the Catholic Church for several possible reasons. One, objectively the Catholic Church promulgated the Bible. Second, the Catholic Church, even though she has been bashed by these people’s leaders, has been confident (even “smug” some might say) in her constancy – which may just seem kind of nice to people whose church teaching change every time the wind comes around. Third, these people have to be envious of a church that does not bow to gay political activism.

Let’s get in there, individually and publicly, and start recruiting. These people have been stunned because their own church has lied to them. Maybe they are just about ready to “dash it all” and just see what Catholicism is about anyway.

Open campaigns. TV ads proclaiming, “do you want to belong to a Church as old as Christianity?” or “you believe in the Bible, come learn where it came from” or “does your religion have more waffles than IHOP? Come find rest where the Truth doesn’t change.”

The possible sinful part would be whether it would be like wife-swapping or something, or whether the strategy would give them new ideas. Gosh, I’ve heard Protestant ads calling people to worship that sounded pretty convincing. Maybe we can make up some that aren’t as pointedly “taking advantage of others’ wounds” shall we say?

Then again, all’s fair in love and war, isn’t that what THEY say? Has the world not used the Catholic Church’s faults against her – to no avail but still annoying of course? Or is this sinful, vengeful thinking too?

I’m not trying to be flippant. I’m completely sincere about this post – at least after the part about Adam and Eve. People used to think I was joking or with ulterior motives, when I wasn’t. In this case I am not joking and my motives I believe to be clear – they are either grandiose sinful thinking or they are ways to call in some of the lost brethren. I know I usually sound like I’m from another planet or something, and if I’ve made a fool of myself again than I will accept jokes about it at my expense, because then I can learn and save face at the same time. :thumbsup:

Alan


#8

[quote=Br. Rich SFO]There is only One Church, There is no second place.

The Catholic Church is not just the “Roman” or Western/Latin Church. The Orthodox of which there are 21 different Rites or Traditions are not just the Greek Orthodox either. Many if not most Orthodox are Catholic doctrinally.
[/quote]

They aren’t rites, their different completely independent, autocephalous churches made up of different ethnicities. Also their are the Oriental Orthodox who do not share communion with the Eastern Orthodox churches. The Orthodox doctrinally are very close to Catholic except they deny the papacy. They also allow remarriage after divorce up to three times, and allow contraception, a recent development.


#9

I believe he’s refering to the Eastern Catholics, not the seperated Orthodox. Not all of the Easterns and Orientals are outside of the Church.

:blessyou:


#10

[quote=sjangelini]They aren’t rites, their different completely independent, autocephalous churches made up of different ethnicities. Also their are the Oriental Orthodox who do not share communion with the Eastern Orthodox churches. The Orthodox doctrinally are very close to Catholic except they deny the papacy. They also allow remarriage after divorce up to three times, and allow contraception, a recent development.
[/quote]

“Rites” as in Rites, Rituals, and Traditions unique to each Church.


#11

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