Ostende Nobis Domine Misericordiam Tuam - and save us from the return of the Latin Mass

unifaith.blogspot.com/2007/05/ostende-nobis-domine-misericordiam-tuam.html

[Edited by Moderator]
He seems to think that traditionalists don’t exist. :smiley:

Catholig

I left one but he deleted it.

I left one on a different issue and it said waiting for moderator approval. Did yours actually appeal and then disappear?

Catholig

I laughed myself silly when I read that blog…Thanks!

Well I felt it was important - and I have left a comment.

It reads as follows:

I just wanted to comment that while I do NOT reject the validity of the Novus Ordo Missae or Vatican II I, for one, would appreciate a return to tradition. I mean this Mass was celebrated for centuries and is the Catholic Mass. We shouldn’t be aiming to please other religions or christian denominations, but only our God in heaven.

Catholig

What, no slam against the SSPX? How valid can the article be then? :smiley:

Seriously, though, we are returning with the Missal of Pope John XXIII, not some supposed vision of his.

Amen, Bob!

I left one as well. Thanks for posting the info. :slight_smile:

I left one.
It is awaiting moderator approval.

Cool anyone else wanna send one?

Catholig

If it gets approved.

  • “But, just like the culture wars here in America, a conservative backlash has been coiling in the corners of the Catholic Church and waiting for its moment to remake the Church in its former image. Now, with the installation of Benedict (the former Cardinal Ratzinger) as Pope, the Empire is definitely striking back. As Cardinal Ratzinger he served as the head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, where he established a reputation as a conservative hard-liner. He is apparently not interested in moderating any of his views on Church policy and teaching now that he is Pope.”*

The Church is both a human and a divine institution. Taking eccelsial issues and looking it through the lens of politics is like using a magnifying glass for astronomy. Political analysis can only give a partial view of the entire picture. A clearer understanding of this issue may be found by considering how Vatican II should be interpreted. A rupture with Sacred Tradition or continuity.

The entire concept about a return to Tradition is also not over the reduction of the participation of the laity. It has more to do with witnessing to the Sacred Deposit of Faith that has been handed down to us from the Apostles.

  • “Nevertheless, there is apparently a constituency for 16th century liturgical practices among the Church faithful.” *

Blessed Teresa of Calcutta was nurtured in the Classical Roman Rite. So was Padre Pio, St Jose Maria Escriva and the martyrs of the Spanish Civil War. It was the liturgy that sustained the faithful during the darkest moments of World War One and World War Two. The Mass that was celebrated during Vatican II was also that of the Classical Roman Rite.

  • “what type of ecumenical message does this send to other Christian churches, to other non-Christian faiths in general?”*

And here we come to the very core of what ecumenism is about. Ecumenism is not the campfire mentality of reducing the faith to what everybody can agree on. According to Vatican II, Ecumenism is about witnessing to the Deposit of Faith passed down from the Apostles. And in terms of the Orthodox Churches, the previous liturgical practices are much closer to the second lung of the Church.
*
“While a traditionalist minority might cheer Benedict’s rightward lunge, this move can likely have critical, negative consequences for relations between the Church and Judaism.”*

The Gregorian Chant is much closer to how Jesus, Mary and Joseph worshipped in the synagogue than the banal mainstream Praise and Worship songs. The employment of the Gregorian Chant would be a positive acknowledgment of the Church’s Jewish roots.

I’m not gonna waste my time.

Just another crybaby :tissues: that’s whining because the trads are getting something. Nothing’s being restricted or taken away. No one’s forcing people to attend this mass. There’s no reason for anyone to be against this.

The only reason left to explain it is envy and viewing tradition as some sort of enemy.

Is that even a Catholic blog? He seems more interested in everything interfaith than Catholic… And no comments have appeared on the post yet…

From that page:
[LIST]
*]As a part of the Vatican II reforms, the Council struck the following prayer from the Good Friday liturgy: "“Let us pray also for the Jews, that the Lord our God may take the veil from their hearts and that they also may acknowledge our Lord Jesus Christ…” In 1970 this was replaced by the following: “Let us pray for the Jewish people, the first to hear the word of God, that they may continue to grow in the love of his name and in faithfulness to his covenant. (Silent prayer) Almighty and eternal God, long ago you gave your promise to Abraham and his posterity. Listen to your Church as we pray that the people you first made your own may arrive at the fullness of redemption. We ask this through Christ our Lord. Amen…”[/LIST]I don’t see what is wrong with praying for the conversion of the Jews - I can’t imagine a reason not to want that :slight_smile: It seems weird, even cruel, to encourage the very people who were chosen by God to be His own to miss out on the coming of Christ. “Fullness of redemption” is in Christ - & nowhere else: so, the Church ought to pray for their conversion. It’s immoral not to.

A liturgical development might take the form of adding the ideas in the new prayer to those of the older one - but simply rejecting the older one is not Catholic at all, because it is anti-traditional; we can’t just throw away the prayers of the past :eek:

My comment is also awaiting “approval”

"You mention the Second Vatican Council as the reason for “freezing” the Latin (TLM) Mass. Where in the Council’s documents does it say such a thing?

Also, reading Article 36 of “Sacrosanctum Concilium” says as follows, “1. Particular law remaining in force, the use of the Latin language is to be preserved in the Latin rites.” How is the Catholic Church enforcing this article?

There are people who do not understand Latin, and that is fine. However, for those who do understand Latin, why are they repressed when in the same document in Article 54, those people are encouraged to continue to pray parts of the Mass in Latin, "In Masses which are celebrated with the people, a suitable place may be allotted to their mother tongue. This is to apply in the first place to the readings and “the common prayer,” but also, as local conditions may warrant, to those parts which pertain to the people, according to tho norm laid down in Art. 36 of this Constitution.

Nevertheless steps should be taken so that the faithful may also be able to say or to sing together in Latin those parts of the Ordinary of the Mass which pertain to them."

Sounds to me that the Second Vatican Council is yet to be implemented. Thank you and have a good day."

I really doubt he’ll put your comments on his blog. As pope of his own little blogosphere, why would he go and let any reason muck it all up?

Oh of course. But considering how many of us have commented and him having to leaf through those comments for approval may have an effect on his stance. Who knows, but we can always pray!:thumbsup:

Sad that that guy thinks the way he thinks.:frowning:

I don’t get why there is a chock full of film references in there, though (A lot of which is from the 70’s or 80’s. There’s something fishy here… ;))

I left one too, just in case. :thumbsup:

He’s posted the comments, much to his credit. :smiley:

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