Our clergy need to remember who they are!!!!!


#1

The cowardly attitudes of our Clergy when it comes to standing up for what is right (especially at the altar rail) brought this story to mind:

St. Ambrose Humiliates Theodosius the Great

Our clergy need to remember who they are!!!

Justin


#2

I have to wonder…if John Kerry and other pro-abortion Congressman could see themselves in the story of St Ambrose and Theodosius would they repent and think of the innocent lives of the unborn and elderly when they vote, or would the continue in their behavior.

  • LauraAnn

#3

bookmarks for future reference

I just don’t get the people who want to go soft on a very clear area of Church law: pearls like the Eucharist should not be cast before the unrepentent, especially when their unrepentence is so publicly known. I never read about a saint who was soft in the face of sin.


#4

[quote=1962Missal]Our clergy need to remember who they are!!!

Justin
[/quote]

Very true. And our laity needs to remember who they are also. Human. People who give their lives to serve God and His people and get no respect. They give all, serve all and make mistakes. They get little support from anyone, certainly not those whom they serve. So…they screw up. Bad, very bad. Then the ones who serve faithfully get dissed too even though they serve faithfully… Bad. Exceptionally bad. 2% screw up and they all get trashed. Now, who is it again that is mandated to bring us all the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ?

Pray for them all. They are human. Everyone wants perfection and few pray for them.


#5

[quote=Marie]Very true. And our laity needs to remember who they are also. Human. People who give their lives to serve God and His people and get no respect. They give all, serve all and make mistakes. They get little support from anyone, certainly not those whom they serve. So…they screw up. Bad, very bad. Then the ones who serve faithfully get dissed too even though they serve faithfully… Bad. Exceptionally bad. 2% screw up and they all get trashed. Now, who is it again that is mandated to bring us all the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ?

Pray for them all. They are human. Everyone wants perfection and few pray for them.
[/quote]

I certainly understand that the Clergy are human. And I have no problem offering them support. I support my pastor and my confessor wholeheartedly. But support does not necessarily mean unconditional acceptance of their behavior. And as for “dissing” those who serve faithfully, I imagine they know that it is not at them that the laity’s tirades are directed.

Yes, the Priests of God are mandated to offer the Eucharist, but not to all unconditionally. The reluctance to confront is craven. And a priest, especially a bishop need to remember who he is. One to whom Emperors should submit.


#6

“The priests alone, O Emperor, are permitted to enter within the barriers by the altar. Retire then, and remain with the rest of the laity. A purple robe makes Emperors, but not priests. . .” Theodosius meekly obeyed, praising Ambrose for his spirit, and saying "Ambrose alone deserves the title of “bishop.”

Your point being? I was refering to this.


#7

[quote=Marie]Your point being? I was refering to this.
[/quote]

I am not at all sure what your point is.

Justin


#8

[quote=Marie]Very true. And our laity needs to remember who they are also. Human. People who give their lives to serve God and His people and get no respect. They give all, serve all and make mistakes. They get little support from anyone, certainly not those whom they serve. So…they screw up. Bad, very bad. Then the ones who serve faithfully get dissed too even though they serve faithfully… Bad. Exceptionally bad. 2% screw up and they all get trashed. Now, who is it again that is mandated to bring us all the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ?

Pray for them all. They are human. Everyone wants perfection and few pray for them.
[/quote]

:amen:

how does it go about the first stone?

There are a lot of weak Priest because we have been a watered down laity. We need to support them and encourage them not tear them down, and there are times when we need to point out error, but sometimes we are so quick to do that, and we never take the time to pray for them.


#9

Wow. Great story.

Man, we need some serious dose of Ambrose in our current bishops.


#10

how does it go about the first stone?

There are a lot of weak Priest because we have been a watered down laity. We need to support them and encourage them not tear them down, and there are times when we need to point out error, but sometimes we are so quick to do that, and we never take the time to pray for them.
[/quote]

The verse about the stone, too oft quoted, deals with condemnation-- literally taken, final condemnation, as in capital punishment. A rebuke is not a condemnation and should not be equated with one.

I am sorry, but I was unaware that causality between a weak laity and weak priests had been established. You have data?

Nor is it evident that anger directed at the Clergy, specifically certain members of the Hierarchy, is a sign that one does not pray for them. In fact, calling them to emulate St. Ambrose is not tearing them down; it is encouragement.

Justin


#11

[quote=1962Missal]The verse about the stone, too oft quoted, deals with condemnation-- literally taken, final condemnation, as in capital punishment. A rebuke is not a condemnation and should not be equated with one.

I am sorry, but I was unaware that causality between a weak laity and weak priests had been established. You have data?

Nor is it evident that anger directed at the Clergy, specifically certain members of the Hierarchy, is a sign that one does not pray for them. In fact, calling them to emulate St. Ambrose is not tearing them down; it is encouragement.

Justin
[/quote]

No Justin I do not have data other than the work I have be blessed to be a part of with a few good men that were having a hard time being a priest. One of them came from a very God fearing family and is a great priest, but he was transferred to 3 different churches in the 3 years time and the last church he was sent to have no kneelers and the tabernacle was a safety deposit box. The Church council believed the priest should be hired by them instead of appointed by the Bishop. Many times on the verge of giving in he would talk about how he wanted to lead and be there for the people but was unable to find the courage, all he needed was support. He has gotten things into to line but not with out a lot of fear and fighting for the truth, and it has taken its toll on him, but God has made him stronger in spite of it.

Now I do not do this to say that it is not right to rebuke because we are required to, however I did use the stone verse in the proper context there are many people that are condemning priest instead of a loving rebuke. When the priest put in the kneelers at the church they wrote to have him removed and he was rebuked many times for changing the way things had always been and it was not his right to spend the Church funds in such a way. They have given their lives to serve us, when do we serve them? Justin I do not disagree with you on the need for the truth, my only concern is how many good priests are being tormented because we are to busy going after the few bad ones and forgetting about the ones that need us. So I do not have data other than my own, and the data you could create by befriending a Priest that has little to no support from the pews for teaching the truth. When is the last time you sent a card to a priest for a good homily, being there for your confession, performing the mass, so you and I could partake of our Lord? My point for every time you point out an error to a Priest, find two to complement, then watch what happens.

Point out error but show the Love above all else.

Scott

Justin you are right but so many I have seen turn the tables using this to torment good men, we have to love them enough to tell them when they are wrong for their sake as well as ours, but many times it is not a rebuke that is needed.


#12

One other thing Justin I wish they would all wear the proper atire all the time.


#13

Thank you, Scott. You are right. Not the attire. I didn’t get in fast enough. The previous post.

Justin


DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.