Passiontide Poll


#1

Today the Church has entered into the season of Passiontide, which is more ancient then Lent. Now the church begins focusing on the passion of Jesus Christ. Before the reforms of Vatican II, the Fifth Sunday in Lent was called Passion Sunday, that title has now more appropriately been restored to the following Sunday nicknamed “Palm Sunday.” Since the Passion is actually read on that Sunday.

As a sign of mourning the church would cover the crucifixes with purple shrouds this day and they would not be unveiled until the Easter Vigil. Did your Church continue this practice, my pastor read to me for the rubrics for the year that this practice is permissable unless the local bishop says not to.

Here’s a link about veiling images for Passiontide:

ewtn.com/library/Liturgy/zlitur72.htm

Here are two about Passiontide in general:

newadvent.org/cathen/11535b.htm

wf-f.org/Passiontide.html

Here is a link for the United States Catholic Bishops Site stating in the middle of the page that there is provision for this, it is number IGMR 318: usccb.org/liturgy/innews/01022001.shtml


#2

Here is the old Gospel reading for this Sunday:

"At that time, Jesus said to the crowd of the Jews: Which of you shall convince me of sin? If I say the truth to you, why do you not believe me? He that is of God, heareth the words of God. Therefore you hear them not, because you are not of God. The Jews therefore answered, and said to him: Do not we say well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil? Jesus answered: I have not a devil: but I honour my Father, and you have dishonoured me. But I seek not my own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth.

Amen, amen I say to you: If any man keep my word, he shall not see death for ever. The Jews therefore said: Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest: If any man keep my word, he shall not taste death for ever. Art thou greater than our father Abraham, who is dead? and the prophets are dead. Whom dost thou make thyself? Jesus answered: If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father that glorifieth me, of whom you say that he is your God. And you have not known him, but I know him. And if I shall say that I know him not, I shall be like to you, a liar. But I do know him, and do keep his word.

Abraham your father rejoiced that he might see my day: he saw it, and was glad. The Jews therefore said to him: Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say to you, before Abraham was made, I am. They took up stones therefore to cast at him. But Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple." (John 8:46-59)

A shorter version of it will be read at Mass this Thursday. However, the current gospel readings for the Fifth Sunday in Lent still have a premonition of Jesus’ passion.


#3

[quote=Psalm45:9]As a sign of mourning the church would cover the crucifixes with purple shrouds this day and they would not be unveiled until the Easter Vigil.
[/quote]

I made a little typo, the statues would be unveiled at the Easter Vigil, the Crucifix would be unveiled on Good Friday for veneration during the Mass of the Presanctified.


#4

Since I started attending the Latin Mass, I haven’t seen this, but then I haven’t been going for very long, only a month and a half, do they have this in the TLM? Is it exclusive to the TLM? When I attended
the Novus Ordo, I do not recall seeing it either.


#5

My parish (which follows the current normative missal) has veiled statues for passiontide in the last several years, but not the crucifix, because mechanics make it difficult. (Ergo I did not answer the poll)

If we were to veil the crucifix, is it necessary to unveil it *during *the Good Friday liturgy? Or would it be acceptable to unveil it *prior * to that liturgy? (This is part of the mechanical difficulty to which I refer)

tee


#6

Tee, I was under the impression that the crucifix is unveiled during the Mass of the Presanctified. That is how I have always seen it done, the priest would raise it up chanting, “This is the wood of the cross on which hung the savior of the world.” At that point he would unveil some of it. He would do this two more times until it was compleatly exposed then all would come forward to kiss it.


#7

The church in which I assist in the Traditional Latin rite is one which is shared by both FSSP and Novus Ordo priests (e.g.; marble altar in front of the high altar). Therefore, at the solemn high Mass earlier today, the crucufix and that statues were not covered since that does not happen until next Sunday in the N. O. scheme of things. If the FSSP had its own building, the statues and the crucifix probably would have been covered today.


#8

I was under the impression that the crucifix is unveiled during the Mass of the Presanctified.

BTW - it’s not the Mass of the Presanctified. There is no Mass on Good Friday, thats why its the ‘Presanctified’ (I.e. pre-consecrated Eucharist)


#9

[quote=Trevelyan]BTW - it’s not the Mass of the Presanctified. There is no Mass on Good Friday, thats why its the ‘Presanctified’ (I.e. pre-consecrated Eucharist)
[/quote]

Yes, I know that “Mass” is not celebrated on that day, but the Good Friday service has been called Mass of the presanctified:

IV – The fourth part, the Communion of the Priest and people, completes what used to be known as the Mass of the Presanctified. Today’s liturgy does not constitute a Mass, for there is no consecration: all who communicate receive sacred particles consecrated at Mass the previous day. This form of Mass is familiar in the Greek Rite.

mysite.verizon.net/missale/goodfri1955.html

“Mass” in this sense does not mean the consecration of the Eucharist, it is using the term “Ite Missa est” only. Not in the sense of a “regular Mass”. I really don’t know if this however is the official pre-Vatican II rubrics or if they are the author’s. So I am willing to admit I made a mistake.

On a side note in the Eastern Church they celebrate during Great Lent what is known as The Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts. Liturgy in this sense does not mean consecration of the Eucharist, rather a combination of Evening Prayer and a communion service.


#10

[quote=Psalm45:9]Tee, I was under the impression that the crucifix is unveiled during the Mass of the Presanctified. That is how I have always seen it done, the priest would raise it up chanting, “This is the wood of the cross on which hung the savior of the world.” At that point he would unveil some of it. He would do this two more times until it was compleatly exposed then all would come forward to kiss it.
[/quote]

Yes, that is done with a processional crucifix.

I was speaking of the 20 foot tall crucifix on the wall above our altar.

PS.
I always hear it called the “Liturgy of the Passion and Death of Our Lord Jesus Christ”

tee


#11

[quote=tee_eff_em]Yes, that is done with a processional crucifix.

I was speaking of the 20 foot tall crucifix on the wall above our altar.
[/quote]

Lol, well that would make a difference.

[quote=tee_eff_em]PS.
I always hear it called the “Liturgy of the Passion and Death of Our Lord Jesus Christ”
[/quote]

tee

That’s what I get for using old terms, he he. Well we all learned something.


#12

The Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts and the Liturgy of the Passion and Death of Our Lord are the same in the Latin Church.


#13

Here’s a link to Jimmy Akin’s webblog explaining the current norms for this custom:

jimmyakin.org/2006/04/veiling_of_cros.html


#14

Hello,

In my church, the crucifixes and the stature of the Sorrowful Mother are covered in purple cloth. I am not certain about the other statues (i.e. Saints Joseph, Lucy, Anthony, etc.)


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